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Apothem
07-02-2010, 11:24 AM
It's something of a taboo, I know, but it occurs to me that not ALL slash fics are Draco/Harry, with events such as Harry realizing that Draco was only mean because his daddy never really loved him so they soul bond and become perfect for each other.

However, I have absolutely no idea where to begin sifting through the vast repositories of garbage for the good fics, so I was hoping that perhaps someone else with similar inclinations could point me towards a few good stories/authors to start, at least.

EDIT: Just for fun, any good Naruto slash fics would be appreciated as well.

Johnny Farrar
07-02-2010, 11:35 AM
Reclamation. (http://sam-storyteller.livejournal.com/59838.html#cutid1)

This is the only story that I've read that has slash for a secondary character and also happened to be incredibly good.

mknote
07-02-2010, 04:02 PM
Here is a complete list of slash fanfiction that doesn't totally fail:

Sacrifices Arc by Lightning on the Wave (http://www.fanfiction.net/u/895946/Lightning_on_the_Wave)

/list

Have fun.

Perspicacity
07-02-2010, 04:09 PM
I recall Copperbadge's Stealing Harry (http://copperbadge.fanficauthors.net/Harry_Potter/) series on ffa as being readable "Wolfstar" (RL/SB). The author has a HP/SB (SB is de-aged to 16 y.o.) story as well, but I've not read it.

I second the recommendation on Reclamation.

Nukular Winter
07-02-2010, 04:49 PM
Slash recommendations? Start with your wrists...



(I keed, I keed, but what happened to this forum to allow this post to remain here all day without a single GTFO?)

Memory King
07-02-2010, 05:07 PM
Cartographer's Craft (http://copperbadge.fanficauthors.net/Cartographers_Craft/index/) is the only Harry-centric Slash I've gotten through during my long stay in this fandom. I remember the ending fizzling out somewhat though, and I've never reread it.

Zennith
07-02-2010, 06:08 PM
GTFO.


But if you won't, I have to go with the Sacrifices arc as well.

Shinysavage
07-02-2010, 08:11 PM
Sacrifices Arc. Other than that...I have vaguely fond recollections of Skin Deep (http://www.fanfiction.net/s/2519543/1/Skin_Deep), but I suspect that's largely nostalgia, as one of the first fanfics I read. From what I recall, some interesting ideas, some dreadful cliches (insane levels of Dursley abuse, father!Snape), and reasonably well written. But as I say, it's been a while.

Stalin's Pipe Organs
07-02-2010, 08:25 PM
This (http://www.fanfiction.net/s/4115400/1/Long_Strips_of_Metal) is one of my favorite slash fics out of the many that I have read.

Although the pairing doesn't have many fans over here at DLP, I'm sure you'll enjoy it.

Scott
07-02-2010, 08:32 PM
Nicca wah? The next thing you know, you're gonna be reading Bottom!Harry with a dominant!Snape!

Hello
07-02-2010, 08:48 PM
Considering I do not know what your idea of epic fail is I would recommend anything by Miranda Flairgold (http://www.fanfiction.net/u/100447/Miranda_Flairgold). Also it should be said that I do not truthfully know she is still a HP writer and not an original fiction writer.

Zennith
07-02-2010, 09:00 PM
Miranda Flairgold writes shit. Literal steaming piles of shit on far too many pages.

Tomatta
07-02-2010, 10:05 PM
http://www.fanfiction.net/s/3762636/1/The_Black_Heir
AU.Harry escapes from the Dursleys when he's ten years old and is found by the escaped Sirius Black. His whole life changes as he slowly discovers his destiny.Durmstrang,DarkArts,dueling,powers,heritag e,horcruxes,hallows,Tom,Grindelwald.Darkish!Harry. HPLV


I started reading this before I knew it was slash, but I was that hooked on the story I powered through. The sequel is a WIP at the moment.

Anarchy
07-02-2010, 10:07 PM
http://www.fanfiction.net/s/3762636/1/The_bBlack_b_bHeir_b

Very long fic, 900 plus words plus a nearly just as long sequel. Very well written with good plot, and really the best durmstrang!harry story out there. Granted, I could not finish the story just because the slash was too much, and really hard to just read over when it is part of the plot.

Salah
07-02-2010, 11:40 PM
Slash story's are not worth recommending. It's as simple at that.

Now, go read your Drarry while I cry in my hugbox about the atrocities of Fanfiction.

The Santi
07-03-2010, 12:30 AM
http://www.fanfiction.net/s/3762636/1/The_bBlack_b_bHeir_b

Very long fic, 900 plus words plus a nearly just as long sequel. Very well written with good plot, and really the best durmstrang!harry story out there.
Very well written with good plot, and really the best durmstrang!harry story out there. the best durmstrang!harry story out thereExcuse me? WTF did you just say Anarchy!?!

I'm not going to declare that my story (http://forums.darklordpotter.net/showthread.php?t=14397) is the best Durmstrang fic of all time, but I sure as fucking hell will not let you insult it by saying it's not better than a fic where Bottom!Harry willingly gets graphically, and consistently, fucked in the ass by Voldemort! You are now officially on my shit list. GTFO and go die in a fire.

OP: I'll second Miranda Flairgold.

ParseltonguePhoenix
07-03-2010, 12:51 AM
I'm actually gonna have to go with The Santi, here--his Durmstrang!Harry is the best I've seen.

And as for the Black Heir and Vindico Atrum fics--they have some interesting ideas, but it's so full of Horcrux!Romance and Voldemort-ass-fucking, not to mention the way 'Harry' falls in love with every male wizard he meets, that the stories are unreadable.

disturbed27
07-03-2010, 05:52 AM
I read Black Heir and managed to drag myself through the sequel to find what it was all about, the big secret. I HATE firephoenix8. I want her too be burned alive. I enjoyed Black Heir and found some enjoyment from the 2nd one but the explanation ruined it all. It killed whatever enjoyment I had for that now demented creation. Fuck her and her literally gay angel demon super gods.

And Santi has the best Durmstrang!Harry.

iLost
07-03-2010, 07:24 AM
Slash story's are not worth recommending. It's as simple at that.

Now, go read your Drarry while I cry in my hugbox about the atrocities of Fanfiction.

It's been stated time and time again on this forum that Slash fics are hated because fan girls go crazy with the buttsex and who fucks whom. That is why they are hated.

I'm not sure if this will help clarify things when it comes to this stuff, but here goes.

Slash=Fangirl fantasies involving Harry getting trained by anything with a penis, where woman are completely ignored. It's only purpose is to showcase two(or two hundred) men getting it on in unrealistic ways with Harry, where plot is secondary to the sex and man-love.

(Not sure what label to use)M/M=Equals a normal gay relationship between two men where the focus of the story is centered around plot, not hours of OMG sex. There will probably be even woman in the story also.

I think OP is asking for M/M while Salah is spouting nonsense. Thankfully, the majority of DLP got what he was asking. I just thought the above helps trolls to clarify where the hate is needed. Because, there's really nothing wrong with gay relationships in fanfiction.

As for recc's....Lightning on the Waves held my attention. Miranda's has elements of it, but its borderline slash in my opinion.

Perspicacity
07-03-2010, 07:54 AM
I'm not sure if this will help clarify things when it comes to this stuff, but here goes.

Slash=...

It doesn't do much to clarify things when you give an incorrect definition. "Slash" in fanfiction simply refers to stories with same-sex relationships between characters. Nothing is implied about how realistic the relationships are or how good the writing is. Canon-compliant slash is possible (Dumbledore/Grindelwald, e.g.) The term is merely a description of the gender sameness of the relationships, much like how the term, 'het,' refers to opposite-gender relationships.

It's also been stated often on the forum by the moderators that sufficiently good slash stories could in principle find a place in the library, but, as with Harry/Ginny stories, they would have to be something special to overcome people's biases against such stories.

iLost
07-03-2010, 08:27 AM
I know the broad definition of Slash=M/M, but I figured clarity was necessary for DLP, since no one seems to mind M/M, sans fangirl. Or was I mistaken and there is a bias against Slash, sans fangirl. I had assumed normal guy/guy relationships were tolerated on DLP.

Salah
07-03-2010, 08:50 AM
Snip

I might be being biased but I won't read Slash unless the plot is on Shezza's level. We all have our pet peeves and Slash is one of mine.

The Wizard
07-03-2010, 10:16 AM
http://www.fanfiction.net/s/2817585/1/Malignant_Objects

Apothem
07-03-2010, 10:42 AM
Nicca wah? The next thing you know, you're gonna be reading Bottom!Harry with a dominant!Snape!

Nope. I just don't see why I, being a bisexual male, would limit the fics that I read exclusively to hetero.

Thanks for the recommendations thus far, and yes, Santi, I agree that your Durmstrang!Harry is probably the best that I've read, though I haven't delved too far into that genre.

Sree
07-03-2010, 12:09 PM
(09:08:08) (&Narf) Giovanni.
(09:08:12) (&Narf) Do you read Slash?
(09:08:16) (Giovanni) Word Narf?
(09:08:19) (Giovanni) Hell no
(09:08:21) (&Narf) Being a bisexual male?
(09:08:23) (&Narf) K.So yeah. :|

Xiph0
07-03-2010, 12:12 PM
This thread doesn't belong on DLP. Be very happy I can't ban you.

enembee
07-03-2010, 01:46 PM
This thread doesn't belong on DLP. Be very happy I can't ban you.

I respectfully disagree.

Clearly the majority of people who have posted in this thread have nothing against slash itself, but poorly written graphic slash has no place here.

As it is, this is a forum that discusses Harry Potter fanfiction, so this thread does belong here.

Xiph0
07-03-2010, 02:11 PM
As it is, this is a forum that discusses Harry Potter fanfiction, so this thread does belong here.

This site was founded specifically to cater to people who hated slash. There are lines, and this thread crosses it by a lot. It was a huge decision to let slashers even be on DLP without hiding it [Typa was the first]. This isn't a precedent that needs to be set.

Swimdraconian
07-03-2010, 02:42 PM
NMB, I'd give you thumbs up, but I'm all out. I agree for that matter. You said it far better than I could.

Nukular Winter
07-03-2010, 02:56 PM
I respectfully disagree.

Clearly the majority of people who have posted in this thread have nothing against slash itself, but poorly written graphic slash has no place here.

As it is, this is a forum that discusses Harry Potter fanfiction, so this thread does belong here.

Pro-tip: The only slash that's ever going to be widely acceptable to DLP is of the Fem variety (i.e. there are literally hundreds of other places to go for "good" slash recommendations).

enembee
07-03-2010, 03:10 PM
Pro-tip: At least 2/3rds of the people posting in this thread disagree with you.

Nukular Winter
07-03-2010, 03:26 PM
Wow, that's potentially tens of posters right there (except not. Count again).

enembee
07-03-2010, 03:38 PM
My point is, there has been (for quite some time) a shift in attitudes on DLP, from homophobic Ginny-hating Nazis to appraising fiction for the standard of its literature and not for its position on homosexuals or red-heads.

I'd like to think so anyway.

Aekiel
07-03-2010, 04:03 PM
I'm with enembee on this one. DLP may have started out as blatantly anti-slash, but it has changed over time to the point where there are actual slash fics in the library and people are willing to at least give them a try before judging them. Hell, just looking at the last couple of anouncements shows that we've changed a shit load since we first started and that attitudes are completely different than they were even a year ago.

Dark Minion
07-03-2010, 04:05 PM
Well, for those who really are into slash fic I recommend this classic gem:
http://www.walkingtheplank.org/archive/viewstory.php?sid=712&warning=4

There is also already a thread for it:
http://forums.darklordpotter.net/showthread.php?t=1873

Though I think I have to warn you. It's a Harry/Snape oneshot. But really, really! worth a read.

Nukular Winter
07-03-2010, 04:48 PM
DLP isn't anti-gay by any stretch of the imagination (in fact, there was a poll about it not that long ago), but that's beside the point because Anti-Slash != Homophobic. Slashfic isn't about homosexuality anyway, it's about repressed housewives expressing their sexual frustration.

Seriously, though, if you want H/G recommendations go to one of the dozen archives on the net that specializes in that pairing, and if you're looking for slash then open an LJ account.

Anarchy
07-03-2010, 06:19 PM
Excuse me? WTF did you just say Anarchy!?!

I'm not going to declare that my story (http://forums.darklordpotter.net/showthread.php?t=14397) is the best Durmstrang fic of all time, but I sure as fucking hell will not let you insult it by saying it's not better than a fic where Bottom!Harry willingly gets graphically, and consistently, fucked in the ass by Voldemort! You are now officially on my shit list. GTFO and go die in a fire.

OP: I'll second Miranda Flairgold.

I've debating on how to decide to respond to this for a few hours (and if I even should), but I think there are a few things that have to be said.

Slash and non-slash are incomparable by its very nature, you you went and compared your story to the one I ( and a guy two minutes before me) mentioned. I thought it was common sense that anything written by me in that post would apply only to slash fiction, as that is what this thread is about. It would be hard to name drop your fic in this thread as it is non-slash otherwise.

However, I will give you the benefit of the doubt and will admit that what I wrote could be taken they way you did, but that was not the intent.

Granted, I did say I have not finish The Black Heir, an I have no plans to. I finished about 200k words of it, and stopped around the point where Voldemort ripped off Harrys pants, and Harry goes "wtf?" and Voldemort goes "I thought that this is what you wanted?" I realized then that the slash was going to be an overwhelming part of the plot so I dropped the story.

What is said is not incorrect. The durmstrang part of the story is very well written. The other parts of the story (DarkArts,dueling,powers,heritage,horcruxes,hallow s,Tom,Grindelwald.Darkish!Harry.HPLV), as written in the summary, are all up for debate and I did not pass judgement on them. I cannot critique slash as it is disgusting, but for someone else who is into it, I can say that the stories plot is decent (for the amount of it I have read) and it is well written.

I am touched that I am somehow 'important' enough of well known to be warranted a spot on anybodies shit list. As far as I know, I am barely one step above being a complete random on this site.

Now, I have read your story. It Actually, before yesterday I had only read the first six chapters (on ff.net) , and then I saw your post and found two newer chapters in your stories' thread. I do like your story. It would be hard to not like it. I do think the black heir's durmstrang is done better though, yours feels too similar to Hogwarts, albeit with Slytherin being the only house. Granted, your story is not nearly far enough along to really make any significant comparison (being just in the beginning of second year), but yours does have the potential to become a lot better. I suppose I should write a review in your thread about it though, instead of here.

enembee
07-03-2010, 06:26 PM
Seriously, though, if you want H/G recommendations go to one of the dozen archives on the net that specializes in that pairing, and if you're looking for slash then open an LJ account.

Or if I want to read quality fanfiction, regardless of its pairing, I'll come to DLP. Thanks though.

mknote
07-03-2010, 07:03 PM
I agree with enembee.

While I wasn't around at DLP's inception, I think that the purpose of the library now is quality. We have the best fics, of all ranges. The reason there is little to no slash in the library is partly because of the bias against it since the beginning of DLP, but also partly due to the fact that 99% of slash is written by fangirls who have no concept of heterosexual sex, let alone homosexual.

Slash, for the most part, sucks, but there are decent stories out there, it's just that most of DLP (myself included) wouldn't touch it with a ten foot pole because it's, well, slash. Still, I think it should be acknowledged for the minority who enjoy reading Harry buggering the hell out of a guy, as long as the writing and plot is good.

Memory King
07-03-2010, 07:15 PM
One of the things I haven't successfully forced myself to forget about Black Heir is the extremely heavy-handed way the author got rid of Sirius.

And now I need mind-bleach because I just remembered the Magical Adoption part.

My interest in Slash is nonexistent, I'm a primarily Harry-centred reader who has yet to stumble on a well executed version of Gay!Harry.

Silens Cursor
07-03-2010, 07:30 PM
Slash, for the most part, sucks, but there are decent stories out there, it's just that most of DLP (myself included) wouldn't touch it with a ten foot pole because it's, well, slash. Still, I think it should be acknowledged for the minority who enjoy reading Harry buggering the hell out of a guy, as long as the writing and plot is good.

The scary thing is that mknote has somewhat of a point (though not much of one). Slash, for the most part, really does suck cock (pun intended). But maybe there are a few gems of stories that can override that.

The problem is, I have yet to see a single slash fic that has proven to me that there are indeed these gems. Lightning on the Wave's Sacrifices arc was okay (let's not kid ourselves here - the angst was unbelievable), and after that, what do we really have? Not a whole fucking lot, that's for damn sure. And the fact that there's simply so bloody much of it means that any search effort to find 'gems' would be a frustrating and unbelievably annoying endeavor, complicated by one simple fact: I can pretty much guarantee that given the choice between slash and non-slash, over ninety-nine percent of DLP would pick non-slash.

So are there good slash fics out there? Probably. Am I going to search for them? No. Am I likely going to read any recommendations in this thread, even though they might be of superb quality. Probably not - I haven't gotten through my backlog right now!

And I've got to ask: am I wrong here? Do people on DLP want to read slash, on the nebulous chance that it's high quality (and given the standard that the Sacrifices arc is held to, it would take some downright fucking incredible writing for me to consider reading it)? Or has fanfic gotten so stale that we're just willing to try anything now?

If the latter, this is a sad day indeed. If the former, what happened to my DLP?

The point I'm trying laboriously to make is that I don't think there's an audience for slash on DLP, or Harry/Ginny. I don't go reccing my favourite ship here for a reason - there's no audience for it. So I've got to wonder - why does this recommendation thread even exist, with the foreknowledge that there's literally no audience for slash here?

/thread

Randeemy
07-03-2010, 07:30 PM
The whole point of DLP in its conception wasnt to be a place for people who hate Slash fan fiction, lest in the early days we would not have had a Severitus section in the library. DLP was and still is about an uncompromising dedication to high quality fan fiction. A trait that tends not to include slash fiction. However, it has been maintained that if a piece of fanfiction is posted that is well written with a good plot and character development, it should make the library, regardless of slash (thought it is arguable that such a fic doesnt exist). The same extends to H/G or H/HG.

It's true that lesser works can get away with poor writing etc. if it's het/Slytherin girl/Luna/Fleur/Cho etc etc.. But I dont think DLP is a place where Slash fiction is outright considered unaccaptable, and this is coming from a user that hates slash as much as anyone.

LT2000
07-03-2010, 07:35 PM
No, we really did pretty much refuse to even consider that garbage on sheer principle in the good old days.

deathinapinkboa
07-03-2010, 08:00 PM
So are there good slash fics out there? Probably. Am I going to search for them? No.

I have gone searching for them. I haven't found one. Ever

Perspicacity
07-03-2010, 08:27 PM
And I've got to ask: am I wrong here? Do people on DLP want to read slash, on the nebulous chance that it's high quality (and given the standard that the Sacrifices arc is held to, it would take some downright fucking incredible writing for me to consider reading it)? Or has fanfic gotten so stale that we're just willing to try anything now?

If the latter, this is a sad day indeed. If the former, what happened to my DLP?

The point I'm trying laboriously to make is that I don't think there's an audience for slash on DLP, or Harry/Ginny. I don't go reccing my favourite ship here for a reason - there's no audience for it. So I've got to wonder - why does this recommendation thread even exist, with the foreknowledge that there's literally no audience for slash here?

I think people are taking the thread's existence too seriously. I see it as akin to the Unmentionables thread (http://forums.darklordpotter.net/showthread.php?t=1004), from back when the Ginny hate on the site was running at 11, or the Harry/Hermione recommendations thread from before. Some (myself included) checked out recs in the Unmentionables thread. Some stories were okay, acceptable time wasters. A couple were good. Most weren't. It didn't exactly do a Paul-on-Road-to-Damascus conversion of DLP members to H/G shippers and I seriously doubt the same will happen with slash.

For the record, I don't read slash either, save for the rare, exceptional, highly recommended story.

Sree
07-03-2010, 08:32 PM
I agree with enembee.

While I wasn't around at DLP's inception, I think that the purpose of the library now is quality. We have the best fics, of all ranges. The reason there is little to no slash in the library is partly because of the bias against it since the beginning of DLP, but also partly due to the fact that 99% of slash is written by fangirls who have no concept of heterosexual sex, let alone homosexual.

Slash, for the most part, sucks, but there are decent stories out there, it's just that most of DLP (myself included) wouldn't touch it with a ten foot pole because it's, well, slash. Still, I think it should be acknowledged for the minority who enjoy reading Harry buggering the hell out of a guy, as long as the writing and plot is good.

Your argument just got a lot weaker, enembee.

Palindrome
07-03-2010, 08:53 PM
Stories like The Black Heir were the ones that cemented my absolute hatred of the romance genre.

I see slash as something completely unnecessary; basically masturbation in literature for the writer. The characters' gender preferences are warped simply because the writer believes that somehow a male on male pairing is better than het. At best it's a fetish - at worst it's mindlessly following the trend that so many others have set.

The writers have no concept of relationships: homosexuality is perfectly natural, but slash is a teenage female's distortion of imagination in writing. Seme/uke? Submissive/dominant? How do these roles accomplish anything but to enforce the established gender stereotypes of women and men while hiding behind the excuse that both characters are male?

The fans mindlessly scream for their pairings - and why? Because they've learnt from others who do the same; they've twisted their own minds into believing their bullshit.

Xiph0
07-03-2010, 09:20 PM
It didn't exactly do a Paul-on-Road-to-Damascus conversion of DLP members to H/G shippers and I seriously doubt the same will happen with slash.

That's not what concerns the older members [you'll note everyone posting in this thread in favor of keeping the slash has only been on DLP for a year or two and are thus newfags of the highest caliber]. What bugs us is that DLP set lines for itself, and that included no slash. Not mentioned, not tolerated, on sheer principle. And that line shouldn't be crossed. It's kept the site quality and the netgirls the Fuck Out.

LT2000
07-03-2010, 09:23 PM
That's not what concerns the older members [you'll note everyone posting in this thread in favor of keeping the slash has only been on DLP for a year or two and are thus newfags of the highest caliber]. What bugs us is that DLP set lines for itself, and that included no slash. Not mentioned, not tolerated, on sheer principle. And that line shouldn't be crossed. It's kept the site quality and the netgirls the Fuck Out.

Pretty much this.

Hello
07-03-2010, 09:28 PM
This gives a whole new meaning to "Tits or GTFO".

Sesc
07-03-2010, 09:35 PM
That's not what concerns the older members [you'll note everyone posting in this thread in favor of keeping the slash has only been on DLP for a year or two and are thus newfags of the highest caliber]. What bugs us is that DLP set lines for itself, and that included no slash. Not mentioned, not tolerated, on sheer principle. And that line shouldn't be crossed. It's kept the site quality and the netgirls the Fuck Out.

Thank you.

Perspicacity
07-03-2010, 10:39 PM
That's not what concerns the older members [you'll note everyone posting in this thread in favor of keeping the slash has only been on DLP for a year or two and are thus newfags of the highest caliber]. What bugs us is that DLP set lines for itself, and that included no slash. Not mentioned, not tolerated, on sheer principle. And that line shouldn't be crossed. It's kept the site quality and the netgirls the Fuck Out.

Fair enough. I see your point and defer to your judgment on the matter. As one who's been here a little over 2.5 years, I guess I'm somewhere between a veteran and a newfag, which may explain my ambivalence toward the whole thing.

DarthBill
07-03-2010, 10:47 PM
I am sick and tired of seeing people reccommend Lightning on the Wave's shit. Through the whole thing (well, through the fifth part, anyway), I had to suspend the crap out of my disbelief, because apparently the ass-backwards wizarding world, that runs like some feudal lords/ victorian era, is a-okay with homosexuality.

Plus, it's like five million words of "Boo, hoo, hoo." Woe is Harry, life is hard, mommy doesn't love me.

Shit.

Edit: Also, Xiph0's right, enembee's wrong.

fuubar
07-03-2010, 10:48 PM
Slash and non-slash are incomparable by its very nature

Oh really? Stories cannot be compared because of the characters sexual preference? Exactly when did this happen?

Swimdraconian
07-03-2010, 11:37 PM
I'm sensing a lot of butthurt here over something that shouldn't even be that important in the long run.

Is the story well-written or not should be our biggest question. What is your criteria for a story being well-written? Characterization? Plot? Setting? Pacing? Homosexual relationships and overtones or heterosexual relationships and overtones?

Why feel threatened by this?

If you don't like the pairings, don't read it and state why in the For Review thread. And if/when enough people have disapproved of the fic, it won't make it into the Library. Considering how many slash fics are in there currently, I think it's safe to say that slash is not a fast growing genre here at DLP. The sanctity of this forum is still safe from the dastardly housewife scribbling away with one hand in her panties.

We do the same exact thing with all of the heterosexual material and 90 percent of that gets tossed out immediately upon arrival.

Anarchy
07-03-2010, 11:46 PM
Oh really? Stories cannot be compared because of the characters sexual preference? Exactly when did this happen?

Well, I suppose this is the part where I say you could compare slash to HP/GW pairing, but I think that has already been said.

Really though, I consider slash to be another story tag, such as dark!harry or indy!harry, So really you cannot compare a gay!harry story to a indy!harry story, but you can compare indy!harry to indy!harry stories. As for the reasons, well, that has already been answered in this thread. The amount of good slash fics (ie. non smut slash fics- do they exist? probably not) is less than 10 and greater than or equal to 0. The amount of good normal fics is probably somewhere around 1000.

aaltwal
07-04-2010, 12:16 AM
DLP should have been the extreme end of intolerance against male slash stories. I don't care if it was well written, the fact that it's slash absolutely disgusts me.

It's a fucking annoying to see some DLP members suddenly declare their acceptance of this genre, even to the point of suggesting a few stories they think are well written enough that it should belong to DLP.

fuubar
07-04-2010, 12:28 AM
~Snip~

I see what your saying and I'm going to have to disagree. A romance subplot should not be the defining factor in how a story is classified (with the exception of pure romance stories).

Your saying that we should classify slash the same way that we do Indy and Alternate, etc? Why then is it that we don't divide things up into H/HR, H/SB, in the library? Because the focus of the story is not on the pairing (or it shouldn't be) and it would make no sense to define a story by something that should be largely irrelevant to the plot. Just because there aren't very many 'good' slash fics doesn't mean that it deserves to be rated differently. It should be rated by the quality of the story as a whole.

tl;dr

Pretty much what Swim said.

Antivash
07-04-2010, 12:43 AM
That's not what concerns the older members [you'll note everyone posting in this thread in favor of keeping the slash has only been on DLP for a year or two and are thus newfags of the highest caliber]. What bugs us is that DLP set lines for itself, and that included no slash. Not mentioned, not tolerated, on sheer principle. And that line shouldn't be crossed. It's kept the site quality and the netgirls the Fuck Out.

This. I've read a few slash pieces... Malignant Objects comes to mind... So;

Your preference is yours, but DLP is hard-line No Slash, and it needs to stay that way. There are a billion billion shitdick pairing sites out there. Go find one if you want slash recs.

Sooner90
07-04-2010, 02:28 AM
I don't think there is anything productive to add to this thread, but I would like to say that in any of the slash fics I have managed to read, the presence of slash (in the decent ones) is always superfluous. For instance:

http://sam-storyteller.livejournal.com/59838.html#cutid1

This is an otherwise great little one-shot. But, the RL:SB pairing, while tastefully done, does nothing to advance the story at all. Why have a slash pairing, clearly outside of canon, if it doesn't add anything at all to the story?

Leaving aside the mindless drivel of HP/DM fics, at least the pairings should add some otherwise unattainable plot element to the story. Not to mention that the story should make some credible attempt to explain how such things came to be.

At least the mindless smut is honest in its transparency. But, adding slash for slash's sake, is mastabatory on the part of most authors or else a way to insert themselves into their own work.

So, in summary: Good stories with incidental slash pairings are bad because they rarely have any justification for the pairings and the honest slash smut it bad because it's just plain bad. Either way, slash=shit, imho.

The same thing goes for anything patently AU. If you're going to show Harry going out of character, for the love of God, explain it. If he is going to go dark and start killing nuns, then the author should provide a realistic reason. If he is going to suddenly start smoking poles, it ought to add something to the story. Probably, most of us at DLP won't want to read it anyway, but at least it wouldn't be a waste of electrons.

Andro
07-04-2010, 03:05 AM
There is some hypocrisy in this. The number of stories with an obligatory pairing is enormously high when it's Harry/girl. But it's true that slash fics that happen to be considered good are good in spite of the slash, rather than because of it. As Silens explained, the threshold of writing quality must be so tremendous it more than compensates.

There are a few things about slash (in general, but still captures all but a handful of stories) that make it unsettling.

More often than not, the slash is attached with a very suffocating atmosphere. Black Heir is a prime example, in the first chapter Harry's portrayed as a target to be raped by whoever gets to him first: Vernon Dursley or Voldemort.

Same thing in Malignant Objects. I initially liked the melodramatic purple prose, but at some point Harry is so utterly submissive it feels like he's waiting to voluntarily let himself be enslaved by whichever man gets to him first.

Slash overlaps significantly with emotional exploitation by the writers. Let me explain.

The mainstay criticism of slash is that it warps a character in an unabashed, extreme manner. What's worse is when authors try to justify that change through character development.

Unfortunately, the method nearly every single slash writer chooses is abuse, abuse, abuse. Slash writers have this sick fascination with child rape that is horrific.

Dursley abuse is used to shatter Harry, and put him in a broken state where a male character can swoop in and make use of his asshole. That's how the "character development" is achieved.

Substitute Dursley abuse with Death Eaters raping Harry into insanity, but ultimately it's some kind of trauma. Bottom line is, the petticoats of nearly all slash are some fucked up perverse shit.

There was one really fucked up story by lady Foxfire that had Sirius stalk through a darkened Privet Drive to find Harry's comatose body, with his anus leaking copious amounts of Vernon's semen. His personality is literally gone because he goes into a "seeker" mode, which is an emergency response state in which he will seek safety (after he's conveniently removed from the Dursleys and is already safe), and guess which of our favorite potion-brewing bats is ready to capitalize on that?

The other method is the route Malignant Objects and Sacrifices Arc take. Harry grows up in an entirely different environment, which results in his sexual orientation changing. But that doesn't excuse the suffocatingly thick angst and man-comfort scenes, or the subservience delicate porcelain doll characterization.

Very specific slash cliches, like Draco-needs-a-veela-mate, make up for a quarter of the entire slash output. In the other half, there's Harry and werewolves, which beggars the question of why don't they just convert to Twilight and have an entire herd of werewolves make love to Edward, Harry and Lucius Malfoy, Harry/Voldemort which boggles the mind with its utter senselessness, and Harry/Snape, which is another quarter in its own.

So regardless of whether you're disgusted with the explicit slash smut itself, you probably won't ever reach the first sex scene because of the other problems.

There are a few "good" ones, the five or so mentioned here, and the "trap" slash-fics with sudden gory ends in the manner of Harry Potter and the Tradition of Red and the owl/Hogwarts castle/squid ones crack!pairings which are funny. The sad thing is, the most popular slash pairings are themselves crack!pairings, and writers usually fail when they set about proving they're not.

To echo the words of Amerision, who wrote the Long Strips of Metal short, whenever I've opened up a slash fic, thinking "let's be open-minded!" it ends up being a bad decision.

Slash occupies a place where stars don't shine.

Edit: I was referencing Roger Ebert's review for The Human Centipede Swim, the one movie in his entire career he considered so repugnant and sickening he refused to issue a rating. Some of the slash is genuinely horrific stuff for what they inflict on Harry before the first penis is whipped out. The good thing is, slash provides an outlet for these repressed urges, hopefully preventing domestic and child abuse in real life. So that's one positive, I guess.

I stopped hating slash on principle, and dislike it for these legitimate reasons. To the good writers of slash, if any of you exist, great for you, but your cohorts are badly misrepresenting you.

Swimdraconian
07-04-2010, 03:15 AM
Slash occupies a place where stars don't shine.

Okay, I lol'ed. A little tongue in cheek there, Andro.

Edit: I perfectly understand his motivations - I don't blame him, really.

mknote
07-04-2010, 08:29 AM
There are a billion billion shitdick pairing sites out there. Go find one if you want slash recs.

The problem, Vash, is that 99% of what they think is "good" is pure, utter shit. If it's recommended on DLP, you know that it has to be decent, doubly so considering the hate a slash rec would garner. So it's once again a matter of quality.

Sesc
07-04-2010, 08:41 AM
... Yes, it is a matter of quality. And part of what makes out DLP's quality is that there is no HP Slash here. :|

deathinapinkboa
07-04-2010, 09:04 AM
Okay, I lol'ed. A little tongue in cheek there, Andro.

Edit: I perfectly understand his motivations - I don't blame him, really.

:awesome

http://pw0nd.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/12/what-you-did-there-i-see-it.jpg

Silens Cursor
07-04-2010, 10:17 AM
The problem, Vash, is that 99% of what they think is "good" is pure, utter shit. If it's recommended on DLP, you know that it has to be decent, doubly so considering the hate a slash rec would garner. So it's once again a matter of quality.

Problem with that is, you know, that such recs likely won't be MADE on DLP because practically nobody here wants to read that stuff. And even if it is recced, there's no guarantee it won't be complete and utter shit (most of For Review proves that handily).

There's no audience for slash here, and to think of all the fanfic readers here that we haven't managed to find a single fucking story that's good in terms of plot AND characterization (most of which slash bends overs a table and ruins mercilessly), it's not worth mine or anyone else's time to go looking for fics for DLP that nobody wants to read.

Case in point: Andro gave a number of reasons why slash doesn't work, and why it doesn't belong on DLP, and so did I. Case closed.

The Wizard
07-04-2010, 11:04 AM
I wonder if I should link Malignant Objects again.

Scrib
07-04-2010, 11:43 AM
OP, when you signed up for DLP it was your responsibilty to read the fucking stickies, there are reasons why slash is not tolerated, if you don't like that, ask for your account to be deleted and jump on the dozens of other fan sites that could better suit your needs, I think that's far preferable to starting an arguement here on DLP that has the potential to turn fucking nasty.

It's kept the site quality and the netgirls the Fuck Out

This.

The minute we start entertaining slash we are never gonna be able to close that door, the fangirls will flood in and begin to recommend shit and there's absolutely nothing the old members will be able to do about it. As shown by the continued existence of this thread and Apothem they can't just ban people whenever they feel like it.

Mknote says that if the slash is recommended on DLP obviously it should be good, our members have high standards, it's not like y'know we could get new members who are total fucking idiots who will read anything with buttsecks. Need I remind everyone that the closest thing we have to a wheeding process is the Introductions sub-forum which is completely optional. Take the Methods of Rationality thread, I'm not sure about this but if all the lurkers who jumped out of hiding tool the time to actually vote, instead of throwing around their weak defenses, that story could be in the library despite the fact that most the regular members absolutely disagree.

Can someone fucking lock this now?

Andro
07-04-2010, 01:35 PM
I wonder if I should link Malignant Objects again.

http://forums.darklordpotter.net/showpost.php?p=48903&postcount=29

This review sums up what you'll be feeling.

Now let me clarify with this:

http://forums.darklordpotter.net/showpost.php?p=54697&postcount=34

Which does NOT excuse the author of the problems described in Yarrgh's review.

Even in a potentially decent story with slash, you will constantly be worried that Harry's character will devolve from a ruthless, efficient hitman into a mongrel-type creature that is domesticated. Which is what indeed happens in that story.

Edit: http://forums.darklordpotter.net/showpost.php?p=156512&postcount=58

As it so happens, the downgrade on Harry's character is undone and he's rehabilitated, except it happens again when several Death Eaters decide to rape him for many long hours. Writers will back off on the slash, only to disappoint you again. I don't like reading with the constant (justified) expectation of disappointment.

Agravaine
07-04-2010, 02:23 PM
I don't think there is anything productive to add to this thread, but I would like to say that in any of the slash fics I have managed to read, the presence of slash (in the decent ones) is always superfluous. For instance:

http://sam-storyteller.livejournal.com/59838.html#cutid1

This is an otherwise great little one-shot. But, the RL:SB pairing, while tastefully done, does nothing to advance the story at all.

Simply untrue. It creates an unspoken but clearly present tension between Gaunt and Lupin. It explores Lupin's character -- cursed by both lycanthropy and poverty, he has been struggling all his life to be treated with equality. This makes Pettigrew's betrayal both powerful and painful.

Fantastic story. Thanks for posting it.

Sooner90
07-04-2010, 02:47 PM
Do we really need a homosexual Remus to create tension between Remus and Riddle? Or between them and Pettigrew? How does a struggle for equality correlate with a back stabbing Pettigrew? Not to mention what that says about James Potter. I'm not the world's biggest expert on this, but how many straight men and friends with three homosexuals? The implausabilty of it is distracting and again I say, It does nothing to advance the plot that couldn't be achieved in much easier and better ways.

Agravaine
07-04-2010, 03:19 PM
Do we really need a homosexual Remus to create tension between Remus and Riddle?
Of course not. But it's there and it works.

Or between them and Pettigrew? How does a struggle for equality correlate with a back stabbing Pettigrew?
Because Pettigrew implies that Sirius is a controlling, dominant partner who abuses and takes advantage of Lupin. ("I'm no man's catamite, Professor. Sirius and I are equals," Remus said furiously.)

I agree that Pettigrew being gay felt contrived, but whatever. The author could have found a more convincing reason for his betrayal and I think he took an easy way out. Not a huge deal.

Not to mention what that says about James Potter. I'm not the world's biggest expert on this, but how many straight men are friends with three homosexuals?
Lots. This is an idiotic line of reasoning.

The implausabilty of it is distracting
Why is it implausible? For the love of god, the story has a Tom Riddle that doesn't become Lord Voldemort. It's clearly AU. And even if it weren't, SB/RL makes a hell of a lot more canon sense than a lot of the favorite Harry pairings around here (most of which I also enjoy). Two people consistently shown to care deeply about each other v. Harry and some random Slytherin chick. One's an easier leap than the other.

enembee
07-04-2010, 03:19 PM
The thing that I still don't understand is why same sex relationships have any effect on the quality of the literature.

I'm not really understanding your complaint. Saying you accept good literature, regardless of its sexual orientation isn't going to open the doors to fan girls, because they don't read for quality literature, they read for slash. It won't be any different to how it is now, except that there will be an occasional slash fic posted with appropriate tags and warnings, as there (http://forums.darklordpotter.net/showthread.php?t=87) already (http://forums.darklordpotter.net/showthread.php?t=1434) is (http://forums.darklordpotter.net/showthread.php?t=10868).

Sesc
07-04-2010, 03:43 PM
Andro wrote a long post detailing exactly that, nmb. HP slash and quality is mutually exclusive. That's it in a nutshell: The story you are describing, it does not exist.

Because Pettigrew implies that Sirius is a controlling, dominant partner who abuses and takes advantage of Lupin. ("I'm no man's catamite, Professor. Sirius and I are equals," Remus said furiously.)

I don't even :|

iLost
07-04-2010, 03:51 PM
So the old guard, the founders I guess, hate Slash and all it brings with it? Regardless of quality? I find that disheartening for my views of DLP based on quality, but the site has spoken so M/M is out. Wonder why it touched such a nerve, given its a nonentity on the boards?

aaltwal
07-04-2010, 04:42 PM
WTF? Why are some still insisting on slash can be tolerated on DLP?

7ate9, fine. You find it disheartening for some DLP members for their absolute intolerance against it.

If you like reading a few slash stories, (And I don't care if it was brilliantly written) just don't bring it up here. Go to some other forum for those, and I don't care if the quality far surpasses the stories in the library.

Some may say that I have to respect those who read slash stories, but they should also respect my decision for not reading it. It's not a matter about emotional maturity, or a matter of homophobia or whatever.

I just don't read the stuff, plain and simple.

Does that make me racist? I don't think so.

DAMN you OP for posting this thread.

enembee
07-04-2010, 04:55 PM
Andro wrote a long post detailing exactly that, nmb. HP slash and quality is mutually exclusive. That's it in a nutshell: The story you are describing, it does not exist.

Just because it doesn't exist, doesn't mean it can't.

EDIT: aalt, I don't give a shit what you read, I don't read slash myself. I just don't see any rational arguments against it being here.

I might just write the greatest slash story ever, just to prove everyone wrong.

Zennith
07-04-2010, 05:00 PM
So here's the thing. I've never personally been into slash stories, I haven't read many and am not a particular fan of the genre. However, that being said, I don't see how this:

The thing that I still don't understand is why same sex relationships have any effect on the quality of the literature.

I'm not really understanding your complaint. Saying you accept good literature, regardless of its sexual orientation isn't going to open the doors to fan girls, because they don't read for quality literature, they read for slash.

is anything but rational. You don't have to read it. There are things in the DLP library that I don't read for a number of reasons. What makes a homosexual relationship in HP any more AU than anything by Joe or a Harry/Pansy story or for that matter, Harry/Fleur or any other non-canon relationship?

So Xiph0, here's something you said:

...no slash. Not mentioned, not tolerated, on sheer principle.

What principle is that exactly? A principle to deny quality writing because of prejudice? Even if it isn't in real life, only the world of fiction?

I don't like slash. I don't generally read slash. But the fact that slash exists is simply a fact, and I see no reason that quality slash cannot exist within the genre. Regardless of my personal feelings, the fact is that what I've seen in the time I've been here has been a general dedication to the fostering of creative and intelligent fiction - hell, there's even an HP/Ginny story or two in the library. I fail to see how censoring an entire genre to cater to the whims of a few helps in this pursuit.


EDIT: Enembee, if you write it, I'll read it.

Inverarity
07-04-2010, 05:03 PM
Are you defining slash as "has homosexual characters in it" or "pairs canon characters in non-canon homosexual relationships"?

I've always understood slash to mean the latter, but it's not clear whether some people are objecting to the idea of encouraging Harry/Draco fangirls, or seeing homosexual characters period.

(I'm generally uninterested in slash stories, but I'm generally uninterested in most shipping fics.)

SmileOfTheKill
07-04-2010, 05:21 PM
I'm going to have to agree with enembee and some of the more open minded people here. The things I read are based off enjoyment, and with good enjoyment tends to come with good writing. Pairings do not matter, it is just that more often than not good writers do not write slash.

Sesc
07-04-2010, 05:28 PM
Come the fuck on, 7 and zennith. You did not just write what I think you wrote :|

One tries to be snarky and bring up the homophobe thing again. Yeah, you can just GTFO. And zennith, are you seriously arguing that gay!Harry is not more OOC than Harry/Pansy? Read your own post, man.

The principle has been that since there is no quality HP slash in the first place, it is banned in general, as a simple and great working means to prevent the influx of A) crap and B) slash fangirls. So far, this has worked great, and I see no reason whatsoever to change that.

Zennith
07-04-2010, 05:39 PM
Come the fuck on, 7 and zennith. You did not just write what I think you wrote :|

One tries to be snarky and bring up the homophobe thing again. Yeah, you can just GTFO. And zennith, are you seriously arguing that gay!Harry is not more OOC than Harry/Pansy? Read your own post, man.

The principle has been that since there is no quality HP slash in the first place, it is banned in general, as a simple and great working means to prevent the influx of A) crap and B) slash fangirls. So far, this has worked great, and I see no reason whatsoever to change that.

I'm not arguing that it is MORE OOC at all. I'm just saying that both are AU, and therefore both have to exist outside of the typical bounds of canon and must in some way be justified. I'm also not trying to play the homophobe card. I'm just saying that slash stories should be held to the same standard as every other story - the vast majority of which are not fit for this site. 95 percent of het stories are complete shit, and are not included here. If a slash story isn't amazing, it shouldn't be in the library. All I'm saying is that I don't see the problem in holding all fics up to the same standards, regardless of the pairing.

Swimdraconian
07-04-2010, 05:47 PM
Okay, I have a problem with one of your arguments, Sesc.

Why the fuck would slash fangirls come here? Especially in the numbers you seem to fear? DLP gets maybe a handful a year wandering through the Introductions and they're usually run off the site within hours after showing their faces.

I simply can't see this forum having a problem with them. Anybody who advertises this forum on their profiles tend to mention the slash hatred here.

Sesc
07-04-2010, 05:51 PM
... Yes. That is because it is hated here. From what I understood, some would like to change that. I thought that was what we argued about?


Edit: And zennith, get back to me if you have found a reason to justify a gay Harry :/

Zennith
07-04-2010, 05:56 PM
What if he were raised by two gay dads?

... I kid. But I'm sure its possible and doable. Because prior to HBP, he doesn't really show real interest in anybody, and so if you start before then, why not?

Swimdraconian
07-04-2010, 05:59 PM
I have no intention of changing the hatred here. It's one of those pointless endeavors in life.

However, I would like a little tolerance. Like say, I don't know, this thread. Somebody asked for recs. And it was okay for awhile. And then someone caught wind of this thread and now you've got this shit-storm.

Wouldn't it have been easier to just roll your eyes and do something better with your time?

Edit: That's a fairly apt assessment for any pairing with Harry, Zennith. Makes me wonder why nobody else has seen it. There was Cho, but that always seemed like less of a crush and more of distant admiration. Really, I don't think Harry understands most relationships.

Edit2: Thanks, Sree. This is probably the best note this argument can end on.

Dark Belra
07-04-2010, 06:16 PM
Inb4HoS.

The problem that most people have is that DLP is a site for those that prefer quality straight pairings. Of course the people of DLP will not like Slash around here. It's the same in that you wouldn't go to a site that focuses on one specific genre of music asking for a different genre entirely. You just don't. Doubly so when the members of the site tend to be aggresive.

Sree
07-04-2010, 07:10 PM
Are you defining slash as "has homosexual characters in it" or "pairs canon characters in non-canon homosexual relationships"?

I've always understood slash to mean the latter, but it's not clear whether some people are objecting to the idea of encouraging Harry/Draco fangirls, or seeing homosexual characters period.

(I'm generally uninterested in slash stories, but I'm generally uninterested in most shipping fics.)

Aha, and here, we address the actual problem that DLP has with slash (in my opinion). Most of us aren't homophobic, so why do we all abhor slash so much? Just because of the fangirls? I think that plays a large factor, but not fully. It's that the homosexuality is not canon. Harry, in 7 books and over a million words, never once expressed any attraction to Malfoy, Snape, Ron, Blaise, etc, etc. Snape? It is a fact that the one person he ever loved was Lily Evans. We see Harry only lusting after the opposite sex: Cho and Ginny. When time for the Yule Ball came, Harry never once thought of asking a guy. He never once said to Ron (while both were desperately searching for dates), "Hey, you want to be my date for the dance?"

The only verified homosexual in canon is Dumbledore -- and this was told in an interview with JKR. DLP didn't like that very much, we felt that JKR was being a pussy by not revealing the fact in the books, instead deciding to reveal that after the prime market had already bought the seventh book. There's no way to tell, but I feel that if Dumbledore came out as gay in the books, DLP would have wtf'd, but mostly ignored it.

Recently I read a slash fic. Why? Because I didn't know it was slash. I thought it was your generic Independent!Harry, and since I was bored, I decided to read it. Harry is found to be the descendant of a powerful race that lives in another realm, blah blah blah, goes there to train, blah blah blah. Comes back to Hogwarts, and lo and behold, Malfoy is looking at him strangely. A couple of chapters in, the Headmaster calls a meeting, and it is revealed that Malfoy is a male Veela and that he has chosen Harry as his mate. If Harry refuses, Malfoy will die.

You'd think that given his past history of never liking dudes, Harry's first reaction would be, "Wait what? I don't like guys. Why would I be your mate?"

No.

His first and only reaction is bitterness that once again something is controlling him. He doesn't care that Malfoy is a guy, that didn't once enter his thoughts.

Needless to say, I rapidly clicked the back button to get out of that fic.

If you read my review of Emma Lipardi's fic, An Aunt's Love, you'll remember that my main complaint of the fic was that there was no logical progression. Petunia went from a xenophobic bitch who hated Harry and verbally and emotionally abused her nephew to suddenly becoming overprotective and loving within one thought process.

That's the same thing that happens with slash. There's no logical progression. With so much history and canon contradicting slash, there has to be a slow progression towards becoming gay.

Recently one of my friends decided he was gay. Or bi. He doesn't even know yet. It took him years of self reflection to finally come out and admit it to himself.

It's not just, "Hey, that guy that is hot, I wonder if he'll go out with me."

And I'm not saying that there aren't people who've never been attracted to the opposite sex. It's just that we know Harry began as a hetero male, and somehow, within a scene or two, he's making out with another guy.

Vir
07-04-2010, 07:19 PM
Snip.

Jesus Fucking Christ this.

Xiph0
07-04-2010, 07:35 PM
However, I would like a little tolerance.

Request denied. Thread over.

The Wizard
07-04-2010, 07:36 PM
Or is it? Muahahaha!

Blaise
07-04-2010, 07:42 PM
The only verified homosexual in canon is Dumbledore -- and this was told in an interview with JKR. DLP didn't like that very much, we felt that JKR was being a pussy by not revealing the fact in the books...he was unmarried, his eyes always "twinkled," he said "my dear boy" all the fucking time, and wore rainbow-colored robes.

And that was book 1.

On "topic:" OP was pretty silly for making this thread, but not because of the potential for getting razed. I don't read slash, and therefore know nothing about slashfics. I was honestly surprised at the recommendations that the few other members were able to provide at all, because I figured that they didn't read it either (It makes no sense to say that "all slash = fangirl dickshit with no substance" if you don't actually read it, but that's another discussion).

Since it was more than understood that the most vocal members here - the ones also recc'ing the most stories - did not seek out and read through slashfics to completion, I thought the OP was simply utilizing the wrong resource.

It's like going to a mechanic's shop that says, in big bold letters, "specializing in foreign cars for 20 years," and asking them to do a tune-up on your motorcycle.

Dark Syaoran
07-04-2010, 07:48 PM
...he was unmarried, his eyes always "twinkled," he said "my dear boy" all the fucking time, and wore rainbow-colored robes. I think that's what annoyed the majority of us the most. The flamboyant person just had to be gay, right? Stereotype much.

Anyway, some nice discussion and all, but there isn't much more to say on the topic.

I don't mind members reading slash in their own time. It's their business and if they enjoy those stories, fair enough. Have at it. But DLP will stay clear of that particular genre, now and always.

If you've been here even a few days, you would know this is not the place to ask for slash recommendations. Just like going to Portkey is the wrong place to ask for Harry/Ginny recommendations.

You aren't exactly a new member OP - Feb 2008 is the join date listed - so you really should know this by now.