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Old 04-14-2017, 01:29 PM   #81
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That's an interesting thought. More of a metaphorical end than literal? Definite possibility, and has some roots in the old EU, which would be cool.
 
I'd go for that explanation, too. There's the earlier bit with Luke teaching Rey, showing her both the light and darkness, and then saying "balance" is "so much bigger".
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Old 04-14-2017, 01:40 PM   #82
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@Shinysavage, regarding balance:
I always thought the underlying assumption in Star Wars was that the galaxy tended naturally to darkness and that Jedi were needed as a counter-balance to that.
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Old 04-14-2017, 03:07 PM   #83
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No but seriously, this looks super good, if for no other reason than we didn't get a single hint that a bigger, badder Death Star is being rolled around.

Also Mark Hamill.
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Old 04-14-2017, 03:18 PM   #84
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The 'no more Jedi' bit came across to me as Luke refusing to train Rey. Maybe he feels, with good reason, that it would be better that there was nobody trained in the Force left in the galaxy.
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Old 04-14-2017, 04:26 PM   #85
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The 'no more Jedi' bit came across to me as Luke refusing to train Rey. Maybe he feels, with good reason, that it would be better that there was nobody trained in the Force left in the galaxy.
Which would explain why he's the Hide and Go Seek champion of The Galaxy.

Sooo, my guess at the plot?

 
Rey says, Train me!

Stuff happens:

1) Luke flashes back to Kylo murderizing all the new Jedi kneeling next to R2 and putting his Mechno-hand (from the last movie) on top. And Luke tells Rey Nope!

2) Kylo goes to Snoke to complete his training. Snoke makes him destroy his helmet to further separate him from the failure that Darth Vader was.

3) Rey has upsetting visions and starts practicing on her own while Luke broods in the background.

4) Luke gets a surprise visit from (Ewan McGregor)ghost!Obi-Wan, he finally gives in and says okay, one Last Jedi then he's out of the game. But she has to stay and complete her training.

5) Kylo usurps/kills Snoke, takes control of the First Order and wins a major offensive against the Alliance.

6) Rey has more visions and leaves to help her friends.

7) Kylo/Rey Showdown! Rey loses her hand (Because all the leads lose their hands in the second movie)

8) Luke -- because he's not a punk like Yoda was in ESB -- steps in and saves Rey while Kylo is WTFDUDE! NOTCOOL!

9) Luke explains to Rey, while she's getting a new hand, that he left her on that desert planet because she's his daughter and she should hate sand as much as her dad and grandpa does.

10) Que the closing scene with them staring out of really big window looking at The Galaxy... oh and Finn wakes up.

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Old 04-14-2017, 05:38 PM   #86
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They do seem to be following the pattern of Episode V, albeit rather loosely.

I find the bit about 'no more Jedi' to be rather concerning. It's giving off a KOTOR 2 aura, and there are a multitude of ways in which that can be mishandled.

 
I agree that seems likely that Luke intended to go to his grave as the Last Jedi, given how he has been in hiding for decades, and so he won't want to train Rey.

I can only suppose that this means Kylo Ren's fall to the Dark Side has convinced him that Jedi will inevitable fall, bringing ruin and war to the galaxy. If that is the entire plot of the movie (unlikely, of course), it seems rather poorly thought out. Palpatine wasn't a fallen Jedi, yet he was the cause of the conflict in the original two trilogies. It was only because a Jedi rose to oppose him that he was overthrown.

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Old 04-14-2017, 06:16 PM   #87
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My opinion on the "no more Jedi" thing is that Luke has come to the conclusion that it is a flawed system. There existed more organizations/groups of force users besides the Jedi. Maybe he wants to move more towards a sort of "grey Jedi" way of interacting with the force?
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Old 04-14-2017, 06:27 PM   #88
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I'm with the people who thinks the "no more Jedi" line hints at Luke laying the foundations for a new force-philosophy that will replace both the Jedi and Sith and end the moral extremes these organizations embodied, with Rey as the first member who will carry on his teachings. Disney has already hinted at it by introducing Bendu in Rebels. There is no good and evil, only The Force and the will to use it.
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Old 04-14-2017, 06:36 PM   #89
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Remember how little time Yoda actually had to train Luke? It was focused on combat, not years and years of Jedi philosophy and learning. I would never call Luke a "true" Jedi. A powerful force-user trained in the Jedi way, sure, but he's nothing like the Jedi of old. It doesn't surprise me to hear him utter that line, even with how iconic Jedi are to the Star Wars universe.

Are they gonna try to make him into some sort of Revan 2.0? Balance and stuff?
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Old 04-14-2017, 08:27 PM   #90
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My opinion on the "no more Jedi" thing is that Luke has come to the conclusion that it is a flawed system. There existed more organizations/groups of force users besides the Jedi. Maybe he wants to move more towards a sort of "grey Jedi" way of interacting with the force?
I wouldn't be surprised if they went that way. The Grey Jedi philosophy has always been a fairly popular one amongst the fandom, but back when Lucas was running the show it never really went anywhere since he much preferred the classic Jedi (I vaguely recall him trying to mandate Grey Jedi ideals as just a Sith trick to lure Jedi to the dark side). Now that Disney's running things, I could see them adopting the fan-preferred cosmology.
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Old 04-14-2017, 09:18 PM   #91
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Remember how little time Yoda actually had to train Luke? It was focused on combat, not years and years of Jedi philosophy and learning. I would never call Luke a "true" Jedi. A powerful force-user trained in the Jedi way, sure, but he's nothing like the Jedi of old. It doesn't surprise me to hear him utter that line, even with how iconic Jedi are to the Star Wars universe.

Are they gonna try to make him into some sort of Revan 2.0? Balance and stuff?
 
I would agree with that. We don't know what actually happened between Episodes VI & VII, whether Luke was trained by multiple force ghosts, holocrons (if there even is such a thing in the new continuity, but I think the Clone Wars show might have made use of one), or whether he found some secret Jedi archive and is essentially self-taught.

All of the above could point toward a somewhat incomplete education, which in turn could be set up as the reason for why Luke failed to reach Ben. I do hope it gets cleared up in VIII, because that's one of the things I'm looking forward to most.


Also, a personal grievance of mine: While I like the English title, in German it translates to

 
"Die Letzten Jedi," which not only takes away from the ambiguity as it specifically makes use lf the plural form of Jedi, but also, to me as a native speaker, sounds terrible. The German translations have never been my favourites, but this one is particularly atrocious.
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Old 04-15-2017, 06:01 AM   #92
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The trailer gives me the same bad vibes as the awful first rehash movie.
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Old 04-15-2017, 06:03 AM   #93
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The trailer gives me the same bad vibes as the awful first rehash movie.
Don't make such a snap judgement, dragon.
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Old 04-15-2017, 12:18 PM   #94
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Its just a first look, we dont really know the plot yet. I think the concept of the "living force" will have a big part
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Old 04-18-2017, 02:31 PM   #95
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I have to say I'm not a fan of the whole balance between light and darkness thing, it sounds like the start of so many grey Jedi stories.
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Old 04-18-2017, 02:55 PM   #96
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I have to say I'm not a fan of the whole balance between light and darkness thing, it sounds like the start of so many grey Jedi stories.
Bringing balance to the force is literally the central focus point of the entire Star Wars saga. Anakin brought balance by giving in to the dark side and helping the Sith rise from the shadows. But then they wiped out the jedi and the scales tipped in favor of the dark.

Along comes Luke, he gets dear ol dad to kill the emperor, bringing things back into balance. But then he goes on to restore the jedi order, and lo and behold there's a dark side power vacuum once again.

I'm guessing that with the destruction of the new jedi order at the hands of Ben, Luke finally realized that any attempt to restore the supremacy of the jedi would throw the force out of whack, and that for true balance to be achieved, he had to stop pitting himself against the dark side and learn to simply coexist with it.
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Old 04-18-2017, 03:13 PM   #97
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Bringing balance to the Force was supposed to mean the eradication of the Sith, not "hey evil deserves a fair shake ya know, better just sit back and watch."
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Old 04-18-2017, 04:39 PM   #98
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Bringing balance to the Force was supposed to mean the eradication of the Sith, not "hey evil deserves a fair shake ya know, better just sit back and watch."
Through the lens of the original trilogy only, yes you are correct. But throughout the prequels and especially in Clone Wars, Lucas completely reinterpreted the meaning.
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Old 04-18-2017, 05:51 PM   #99
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for true balance to be achieved, he had to stop pitting himself against the dark side and learn to simply coexist with it.
That sounds well and good if you consider 'the dark side' this edgy and rebellious concept that all the cool kids choose, but not so much when you realize that it's by and large a bunch of homicidal maniacs that would be classified as deranged and/or evil in literally any other setting. 'Dark side' and 'necessity of balance' does not excuse one's actions or the repercussions they have for the greater whole, nor does it make rising against such people any less right and morally obligatory.

Basically 'dark side is necessary' is -and has always been- a heap of steamy, edgy bullshit.

I'm not necessarily advocating the stance of the old Jedi Order, mind. I'm just highlighting my above tl;dr.
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Old 04-18-2017, 06:13 PM   #100
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Through the lens of the original trilogy only, yes you are correct. But throughout the prequels and especially in Clone Wars, Lucas completely reinterpreted the meaning.
Anakin brought balance and fulfilled the prophesy when he offed Palpatine. What in I-III contradicts this?
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