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Trumperium 2: We Shall Overcomb 12 18.46%
Trumperium 2: Remember, no Russian 9 13.85%
Trumperium 2: Executive Dis Order 8 12.31%
Trumperium 2: Caesar by the Pussy 24 36.92%
Trumperium 2: From Russia with Love 12 18.46%
Voters: 65. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 05-11-2017, 04:18 PM   #1601
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Trump has admitted he was going to fire Comey anyway. Rosenstein's letter had zero impact on the decision.

And here I thought we were already in the middle of a shitstorm.

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Old 05-11-2017, 04:25 PM   #1602
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Yea, he'd decided by the beginning of the week after Comey's several weeks of "attention-hogging" and went to Sessions and Rosenstein for a written validation.

Very amusing interview with the Economist.

Quote:
E: But beyond that it’s OK if the tax plan increases the deficit?

T: It is OK, because it won’t increase it for long. You may have two years where you’ll … you understand the expression “prime the pump”?

E: Yes.

T: We have to prime the pump.

E: It’s very Keynesian.

T: We’re the highest-taxed nation in the world. Have you heard that expression before, for this particular type of an event?

E: Priming the pump?

T: Yeah, have you heard it?

E: Yes.

T: Have you heard that expression used before? Because I haven’t heard it. I mean, I just … I came up with it a couple of days ago and I thought it was good. It’s what you have to do.
Falsehoods and self-delusions aside, Trump's been adopting Keynesian terminology for longer than he remembers, as Vox notes.

Quote:
E: Would you consider a VAT for the United States?

T: Well the concept of VAT I really like. But let me give you the bad news. I don’t think it can be sold in this country because we’re used to an income tax, we’re used to a…people are used to this tax, whether they like it or don't like, they’re used to this tax. I fully understand because I have a lot of property in the UK. And it’s, sort of, not a bad tax. And every time I pay it, they end up sending it back to me. In fact, my accountant is always saying…

E: That’s a good tax.

T: No, it’s really not so bad. Like, I own Turnberry in Scotland. And every time I pay they say, “Yes sir, you pay it now but you get it back next year.” I said, “What kind of tax is this, I like this tax.” But the VAT is…I like it, I like it a lot, in a lot of ways. I don’t mean because of, you know, getting it back, you don’t get all of it back, but you get a lot of it back. But I like a VAT.
Does he even know what a VAT is...? "I pay it every year, and every year they send it back?"

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Old 05-11-2017, 04:35 PM   #1603
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I'm gonna lay this out in basic outline for those of you wondering why Trump's motivation in firing Director Comey matters:

If the President, in his official capacity, fired Comey in an attempt to impede/tamper with/stifle/otherwise affect an ongoing federal investigation, whether or not he is a subject of said investigation, but in which he has a material interest, that would be chargeable as federal corruption (abuse of powers), obstruction of justice, and interfering in an FBI action.

His stated reason was that it was in response to the recommendations of the AG and DAG. He then said he was planning on doing it anyway, and the DAG disputes the claim regardless. Multiple well-sourced media reports also show that he was angry that Russia was such a focus and that Comey wouldn't 'shut it down'.

You decide.
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Old 05-11-2017, 04:40 PM   #1604
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Does he even know what a VAT is...? "I pay it every year, and every year they send it back?"
He'll be sticking everything he does as expenses against his business - businesses get VAT back.
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Old 05-11-2017, 04:42 PM   #1605
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I'm not disputing that he gets his VAT back, as his accountant must surely tell him. What I'm pointing out is whether he understands what a VAT is.

Seems just another example of the affect bias. "I like the experience I've had, therefore the entire shebang must be good."

"Coke products make me feel warm and fuzzy, therefore I'll put down on a few hundred thousand stock, without examining whether it's currently undervalued."

Not that specifics really matter, I suppose, so long as Mnuchin et al continue to enable his ego, as in the interview, and set forth papers for him to rubber-stamp.

He only has to license his name to sell it, right? Protecting Brand Trump comes first.

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Old 05-11-2017, 06:12 PM   #1606
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Someone who knows more specifically can correct me, but from what I understand, State often has to work according to real-time, on-the-ground constraints, so much of the info they pass around doesn't have time to be classified till after. In those moments, they have to make judgement calls on what's truly vital or can only be transferred through secure channels (as much of what ends up classified can be mundane circumstantial stuff).
This is accurate. State has a pretty bad reputation for information security/adherence to classification standards. This is mostly down to the notoriously lax practices of the Diplomatic Corps. They say in their defense that they do a lot of work 'outside the wire', but that's no excuse.


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Speaking of Trump and Russia: have a bit of a weird event. I'll leave the security points to the IC-people in the thread and just wonder how it was possible for the WH to miss that Lavrov's photographer was also on the Tass payroll. I thought background checks were a thing, and it wasn't as if this was an impromptu meeting.
This is fairly amusing. Two possible things happened (or both): Either the WH didn't bother to pass along the names they needed vetted, or it was checked and the security folks didn't think it was an issue. I'm guessing the second.

It wasn't a security concern, really, it's just that the WH got tricked and they feel mad about it.

Frankly, any rookie could have told them this would happen, they're just too stupid to realise it themselves. The Russian Foreign Ministry has a solid reputation of being on top of their public relations game when it comes to interactions with the US.
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Old 05-11-2017, 06:51 PM   #1607
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This is fairly amusing. Two possible things happened (or both): Either the WH didn't bother to pass along the names they needed vetted, or it was checked and the security folks didn't think it was an issue. I'm guessing the second.

It wasn't a security concern, really, it's just that the WH got tricked and they feel mad about it.

Frankly, any rookie could have told them this would happen, they're just too stupid to realise it themselves. The Russian Foreign Ministry has a solid reputation of being on top of their public relations game when it comes to interactions with the US.
I thought the White House and Trump were pissed because they specifically banned American journalists access which first off says one thing, but secondly because on the White House ledgers of who they were meeting Sergey Kislyak's name was notably absent. You know, the guy widely considered to have had great influence and helped orchestrate all the election shenanigans. That guy.

So for some reason the administration went to great lengths to organize a secretive meeting, only for photo's to emerge of Trump smiling and shaking his hand.

That's why they are pissed.
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Old 05-11-2017, 07:12 PM   #1608
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That's why they are pissed.
Their stated reason for being angry was that they weren't told that Russian Foreign Minister Lavrov's 'personal photographer' was also a photographer for TAS, the state news agency, and that they did not know photos would be released.

Exactly why those photos being released would be an additional embarrassment is another matter, I guess. I'll take your word for it, but I haven't heard that from other sources yet. Links?
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Old 05-11-2017, 07:47 PM   #1609
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I try. I really do try. I really fucking do try to look at both sides objectively and analyze the points of view feeding them. I want to find some point to compromise on.

But to call Trump anything other than an idiot is absurd. This isn't political doubletalk or circular logic or buzzwords...it's incoherence.

Even Brietbart is losing faith in his failure to deliver on his promises:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E0ugNFafVV4

And yet people are still convinced that he is somehow playing a part because he's such a keen businessman? He speaks like a lost, unintelligible, old man who can't finish a single disjointed thought. I see similar rambling in my low-functioning autistic kids. And that's not to disparage my low-functioning autistic kids. They will most likely exceed Trump's speaking ability before they graduate.
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Old 05-11-2017, 08:11 PM   #1610
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Issue conservatives are quite happy with the big ticket items so far. Trump has delivered Gorsuch and hundreds of like judges over the next four years. A Sessions-run DOJ is much preferable to a Holder-type DOJ. He's prioritizing deregulation and enabling what conservatives would consider a healthy skepticism that we didn't toss out the baby with the bathwater over the Paris Accords or the Iranian deal.

Trump may be incoherent; he may be a greedy, indecorous opportunist diminishing the office in ways unseen since Nixon, but the majority of those conservatives who held their noses to vote him in as a means to an end are very probably much happier vs. a third Obama term.

Promises to 5D chess believers were rarely going to be delivered in any literal part.



Also, I'm hearing along the grapevine that Trump plans to posthumously donate his tax returns to the Trump Library and Monument to be set on 834 acres somewhere midtown between Central Park South and 110th St. Currently in negotiations to purchase.

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Old 05-11-2017, 08:40 PM   #1611
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, I'm hearing along the grapevine that Trump plans to posthumously donate his tax returns to the Trump Library and Monument to be set on 834 acres somewhere midtown between Central Park South and 110th St. Currently in negotiations to purchase.
They just fished two corpses out of the Great Pond this week (people who apparently drowned for some reason; why anyone who would swim there is beyond me). If he so much as tries it, Manhattanites would happily add a third.

Quote:
Promises to 5D chess believers were rarely going to be delivered in any literal part.
Length, width, height, time and....bullshit?
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Old 05-11-2017, 08:55 PM   #1612
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I assumed redditors had upgraded by now to some ungodly transcendental fifth dimension.

I fucking hate the idea too. This came quite accidentally, and incidentally, my way from a source with the personal history to know persons close to Trump. Now I want to see if I can anonymously talk through some people I know about the possibility of these "extensive and secretive negotiations." Just in case.

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Old 05-12-2017, 05:14 AM   #1613
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Their stated reason for being angry was that they weren't told that Russian Foreign Minister Lavrov's 'personal photographer' was also a photographer for TAS, the state news agency, and that they did not know photos would be released.

Exactly why those photos being released would be an additional embarrassment is another matter, I guess. I'll take your word for it, but I haven't heard that from other sources yet. Links?
https://twitter.com/ShaneGoldmacher/...43231366934529

The image has the White Houses release of the meeting.

Notably this meeting happened the day after Comey was fired, so it could have just been optics given Kislyak's role in the Russian interference. Given the reaction to the photos afterwards though, I'm personally suspicious.
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Old 05-12-2017, 08:57 AM   #1614
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Is Trump losing it guys? The day has barely started and he has threatened Comey about leaks of their conversations. And he has also thrown out the idea to cancel all press briefings because it is hard to always talk with 'perfect accuracy'.
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Old 05-12-2017, 09:45 AM   #1615
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No, he's just being Trump.

Leaving aside that he doesn't even care for accuracy, so regardless of whatever form of communication, it would just be the same lies anyway (cf: his -- written -- tweeting history), it's probably even true. Trump is the dark and extroverted version of myself; he's all of my downsides with none of the upsides.

So I, too, find it hard to talk with 'perfect accuracy' off the cuff, picking just the right words to say and having a clear structure, and prefer written communication if that kind of accuracy is needed; it's got something to do with how you process information. However, I'm not the president of the United States, and as such, that statement is ridiculous. Or in other words, Trumpish.


By the way, here's why you will be stuck with Trump for a long while.





You see the problem.
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Old 05-12-2017, 11:18 AM   #1616
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The optics definitely were bad. The public tends to favor security.
For what it's worth, a large part of the "classified at the time" emails were simply cases of forwarding media reports and articles that contained classified material. It's not criminal mishandling of classified matter to share such over open channels unless attention is drawn to the classification status, in which case there's a possible argument to be made of criminal intent. This is why the Abedin emails were a nothing burger.

The interview with Lester Holt was amusing. Here's the money quote:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Donald J. Trump, President of the United States
...And in fact when I decided to just do it I said to myself, I said, “You know, this Russia thing with Trump and Russia is a made-up story, it’s an excuse by the Democrats for having lost an election that they should’ve won.”
In other words, he just admitted to felonious obstruction with an ongoing investigation on national television.
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Old 05-12-2017, 11:23 AM   #1617
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By the way, here's why you will be stuck with Trump for a long while.






You see the problem.
... that the Washington Post can't line up bar graphs in a meaningful way?

Or that 84% of Republican would rather double-down on a bad bet than admit that they were wrong?
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Old 05-12-2017, 12:08 PM   #1618
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Some of those looked odd to me, is there some other poll option that was given, and just not shown, because not all of them equal 100% together.

*I added a close approximation of where the percentages lined up.
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Old 05-12-2017, 01:14 PM   #1619
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Er, what are you trying to do? I suppose it should be linked in the WaPo article (or you could google the survey), but it's clear that "All" includes Republicans, Independents, and Democrats, and that those (the latter three) aren't equally large groups, right?
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Old 05-12-2017, 01:25 PM   #1620
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Er, what are you trying to do? I suppose it should be linked in the WaPo article (or you could google the survey), but it's clear that "All" includes Republicans, Independents, and Democrats, and that those (the latter three) aren't equally large groups, right?
Yes...

I was assuming that the opposing votes, i.e Appropriate vs. Inappropriate or Serious Issue vs. Distraction, for each group would equal 100%. However not all of them total 100% that I can see.

Edit: Perhaps this will better illustrate my point.

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