DLP Slapdown vs Butthurt; Main Event: Giovanni vs Jigokuno

Discussion in 'Hall of Shame' started by Giovanni, May 25, 2010.

  1. Giovanni

    Giovanni God of Scotch

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    t.l.;dr.: Jigokuno GTFO my DLP.

    I have lacked the time to post reviews for a long time now, but I have read the threads. Jigokuno, your reviews piss me off like no other. This is not because they are bad (they are, in fact, awful), but because the only thing they showcase is your own belligerent and willful stupidity. This will be my first and only post in response to you on this board, and after I write it I am putting you on my ignore list in order that my eyes may no longer suffer from witnessing the vapid pools of smegma which you consider adequate for posting, and to which you subject the entire board. Blocking you, unfortunately, will not rid me of seeing the threads you derail with the vacuous ejaculations of absurd speech that you consider posts, since (regrettably) other users respond to them. Hence, this review of your reviews.

    Your posts have proliferated to such an extent that a full and systematic response is impossible. This is not to say that I am about to cherry-pick, but only that I will use several of your most recent posts to illustrate my point. They will be more than sufficient to do so and I see no reason to belabor it beyond reasonable limits.

    1. You have misunderstood the fundamental premise of the DLP ratings system. In this 5-18-2010 post you wrote:

    The objection of the board to your replies has nothing to do with the fact that you are not saying "Update please," and everything to do with the way this paragraph is written. You argue that a lot of people just post spelling errors. Yes. They do this. They do this because spelling errors are annoying. Most of the time they leave comments along with the corrections. This post demonstrates that you can't even be bothered to read those. You claim to have "read numerous stories on this site and other sites where I loved the story and simply never wrote a review because I couldn't find something to criticize." Given the utter lack of depth in your reviews I find this difficult to believe. Given the number of fanfics you are likely to have read compared to the number of reviews you have left, it becomes even more difficult to believe.

    You also speak of refusing to write "Update PLX" to "raise" your post count. By this standard, then, you claim that your posts are of a higher quality than the majority of the posts in the section since -- according to you -- posts which correct grammar, spelling, and cohesion, are simply lazy posts constructed by uncritical fans. Your reviews, then, should be of a higher quality than any others -- particularly those you criticize.

    2. Your reviews are NOT of a higher quality.

    From the same post discussed in 1 (which, by the way, started with you missing the capitalization of the first letter of your first word -- surely this correction of a grammar error means my entire post is favorable and uncritical).

    He's a kid. Kid's don't think about mortality much -- even in the HP series and even in The Santi's version of it. When someone who hasn't even realized that he has a penis yet -- much less what it is used for -- hears about something that can give the drinker unlimited gold, guess what, said kid is going to think about the gold (even to the detriment of considering other things). This is why greed is not only a plausible motive, but THE plausible motive for Santi's Harry. This is something that an able reviewer would have picked up on. Your criticism of other reviewers amounts to "you are all uncritical," but you suffer from the opposite problem: You are overly critical and stupidly so. Militant stupidity has its place, but it isn't here. Go to Ginnypotter for that shit, but don't fucking track it back here thank you very much.

    3. I mentioned this in 2, but your writing is horrible. You don't capitalize the first words of your sentences at the start of your post (for example here, or n the first post discussed, or here).

    And on the subject of your writing lets look at this paragraph (again from a review of The Santi's fic):

    Jesus-baby-raping-Christ I don't even know where to begin with this one. So, as a recent terrible submission to the DLP-digest suggested, I will "begin at the beginning" and attempt to avoid the "radlands" (sidenote: Bitches submit articles to that shit). I don't think I've ever seen a more arrogant and substance-free review. The story interests you, and so (as a magnanimous personal favor to the author) you will continue to read it? This is how your review is phrased. But the fucking story interests you. If anything, The Santi is doing you a favor by continuing to write it. Since your post essentially concludes that it sucks, one must wonder "if it sucks why are you reading it," except, of course, so that you can write reviews which you think are profound, but which the rest of the board thinks are beyond fucking stupid. It is also poorly punctuated and written (see the fourth sentence) in a style which more closely resembles the illiterate scribblings of semi-literate seventh grade students who have just learned that they are angry at things of which they know nothing and to which they attribute everything. Do you see that last sentence? Count the recursive elements. Notice how they flow and are not choppy. Compare it to your fourth sentence (which is shorter!) and observe how it works without comma's whereas yours requires them and constitutes meaningless inchoate drivel without them. Observe how I was able to do that by using the language properly rather than butchering it in ways that would make Ted Bundy blush!

    I brought this piece of your own writing to the fore because it contains some good advice for you to consider. Don't force your reviews. Just naturally allow things to happen. In this case, the natural thing for you do to is to refrain from writing them.

    4. Now onto your review of Silens' most recent writing. Yes, the acid batch was predictable. But this is Crazy! Harry, he might have all the reflexes in the world, but he is rather fixated on the task at hand. People -- even the constantly battling ones -- occasionally concentrate excessively on one task to the detriment of others. You, for instance, focus excessively on the task of criticizing authors who post their work here to the detriment of making your criticisms worth reading or even taking into consideration.

    * * *

    I have written this because your militant stupidity has left me few other options. There are other posts of yours which I could criticize as well, but this post has gone on for long enough to (hopefully) get the message through to your abnormally-shaped skull. Since you are likely to dense to understand that reference, I suggest that you do a Google-image search for 'People With Down Syndrome.' It should clear things up for you. Once you have done that, read this and go cry in your hugbox
     
    Last edited: May 25, 2010
  2. Midknight

    Midknight Middy is SPAI! DLP Supporter Retired Staff

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  3. Torak

    Torak Death Eater

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    Words can't describe how much I love you right now Gio.

    [​IMG]
     
  4. Antivash

    Antivash Until we meet again... DLP Supporter Retired Staff

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    [​IMG]
     
  5. Oz

    Oz The Big Kahuna Moderator DLP Supporter

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    In recognition of your services to DLP, I bequeath unto you my asshole for one day. Do with it as you will. :awesome
     
  6. Alexeyy

    Alexeyy Seventh Year DLP Supporter

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    Silens Cursor, I'm sorry that my post will be entirely irrelevant to your story. Giovanni wanted it to be public when he posted here instead of sending a PM, so I'm only partially to blame.

    I don't care if I will get banned or whatever, but I have to say that Giovanni is mean.

    First off, I haven't noticed Jigokuno before the post Giovanni ripped at (this post), so please note that my favourabe opinion of Jigokuno is uninformed.

    Ok. At large, Giovanni's post is a rant ripe with personal abuse. Ok, I respect that everyone may hate whomever they please, but my objection is to the method. Giovanni is nit-picking, taking words out of context, making an ad hominem argument. In the end, he stated that he placed Jigokuno on his ignore list, depriving him of the chance to defend himself. That speaks volumes of Giovanni's character.

    The first quote. Jigokuno made a bad choice of words, and Giovanni had immediately latched into it, and proceeded to mock Jigokuno for it through his rant. Jigokuno said that correcting spelling errors is not that important for him, because he wants to make criticism on the story itself, which he deems more important. I happen to agree with him. That doesn't mean we despise people who just post spelling errors; I know how much effort and time and competence in grammar it takes. I tip my hat to the people for doing such a huge job. Jigokuno also said that he posts only when he thinks he has something important to say. I also happen to agree with this. Another matter is: what if a person posts something, makes an argument that he thinks is important, but it turns out he was wrong/made incorrect assumption/lacks maturity or the depth of perception? Giovanni has chosen to answer with personal abuse. I think it is better to answer with counter-arguments. It is not a person's fault that he may lack the depth of perception. Regrettably, the quality of his reviews may suffer because of it, but do not forget that a person grows on his mistakes.

    Next, Giovanni had pointed out that Jigokuno forgot to capitalize the first letter of one of his sentences. After that, Giovanni began to make a counter-argument against one point of Jigokuno's review. That's argumentum ad hominem.

    I agree with Giovanni's argument, and can also add that I think The Santi needed a plot device to make Harry drop investigation on Quirrel. Greed is a good explanation for Quirrel's actions. But that's irrelevant here, what's relevant is, Giovanni's made a good argument, but it seems he's structured his review around this one point, neglecting other points Jigokuno has made in the same post. That's nit-picking. If I may, I want to take a closer look at Jigokuno's review to compensate for Giovanni's negligence.

    I agree, though I think it is probably a plot device of some kind.

    I agree. Combined with how the Potters treated the news of Harry's Dark Arts accomplishments (yes, I agree again, just comically short of telling Harry how he was going to become a Dark Wizard) it is plain that The Santi needed to give more attention to the conflict and the distance that started to appear between Harry and his parents. I mean, he needed to write about it in more detail. It is possible I lack the depth of perception myself, but I want explanation for Dumbledore's and the Potters' actions, and the story didn't provide any.

    It is clear that both myself and Jigokuno are unable to fully express in words what is wrong with that part of The Santi's story, aside from the general "I think that is wrong". Maybe others will make a better job of it, maybe not. Jigokuno thought it was worth mentioning, and for this Giovanni dedicated the third part of his rant to his bad wording.

    So, in conclusion, my opinion is, Jigokuno's post was useful, Giovanni's was mean.

    P.S. To note, I gave thumbs up to Jigokuno's post more than a few days prior because I didn't have time to compose a full reply. I say this now to avoid misunderstandings.

    P.P.S. I also agree with Giovanni that Jigokuno's latest post in this thread leaves much to be desired.
     
    Last edited: May 26, 2010
  7. Oz

    Oz The Big Kahuna Moderator DLP Supporter

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    If you like him so much then why don't you marry him?
     
  8. Giovanni

    Giovanni God of Scotch

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    See guys? This was what I was talking about. A fan of Jigokuno (any time you have to preface your remarks with "I like the guy" in your defense because other users have noticed its a bad start) is upset. When you then follow that criticism with the admission that your opinion is "uninformed," well it gave me high hopes for the rest of your post to put it mildly.

    Unfortunately, the rest of your post reads like this:

    [​IMG]

    You say that my post was:

    1. "Ripe with personal abuse."

    Answer: Hell yes it was. You know why? I've been a member of this board for near on five fucking years. That means I remember when DLP had a Severitus section -- shit, that means I probably posted in the Severitus section. The rule at DLP, for as long as I have been here, has always been: Don't be a dumbass and bitchslap the people who are. That is why you see a bunch of people in support of my "personal abuse" filled post (and, for the record, the proper usage for your sentence is rife, not "ripe").

    2. That it took words out of context.

    Answer: Considering that I quoted entire paragraphs of Jigokuno's text, that's a difficult claim to make. It is why you spent the remainder of your post attempting to explain why a post you liked was good even though it wasn't. It's ok: We all have egos. The problem with yours is that it is actively supporting a person who is fucking up the board.

    3. That I did not send this as a private message.

    Answer: Look at the people supporting my post. Jigokuno was an asshole who needed to learn the score. The board agreed and I agreed to be its voice.

    I think that we should conclude by looking at your conclusion:

    After you spent your reply attempting to explain why my post (although mean) was more right than it was wrong but that you liked Jigokuno anyway, before your final addition of:

    That's the understatement of the century. Hey Silens, I'll be leaving a review of your story later (probably tomorrow).

    EDIT: And I noticed one other thing in your post -- or, rather, Vash brought it to my attention -- you decided to bust out the Latin for logical fallacies (also, nouns borrowed from other languages are italicized in English -- something for you to remember in the future since you seem to have forgotten it here). While we are on the subject of logical fallacies, I have a few for you to look up: Arguing from ignorance, the fallacy of division, and the aptly named fallacists fallacy (your entire post is an argument that because being mean is wrong, my post must be wrong because I am mean some of the time).
     
    Last edited: May 26, 2010
  9. Oz

    Oz The Big Kahuna Moderator DLP Supporter

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    Reductio ad absurdum!
     
  10. Seratin

    Seratin Proudmander Prestige DLP Supporter

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    Dissapointed in you Alexeyy, dissapointed.

    /predicts Jigokuno will never post in this thread.
     
  11. Kai Shek

    Kai Shek Supreme Mugwump

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    Is it already time for another cry for attention from Giovanni?

    Your parents love you Giovanni. You don't need to act out.
     
  12. Giovanni

    Giovanni God of Scotch

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    Ah yes, here comes Kai Shek to the rescue with a pithy and original comment after the thread was pretty much over with. True to form friendo, true to form.
     
  13. Antivash

    Antivash Until we meet again... DLP Supporter Retired Staff

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    Cant resist trolling, can you, Shek? Well guess wut! NO ONE CARES STILL!

    Just felt like posting. >_>
     
  14. Alexeyy

    Alexeyy Seventh Year DLP Supporter

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    That's what I call "taking words out of context":

    What I meant to say was that I don't care about the abuse you shovel on anyone. I care more about the fact that you publicly humiliated Jigokuno and left him no chance to defend himself by ignoring any of his follow-up posts. I find that dishonourable. It was also irritating because the post you have chosen as a pretext for abuse was useful in my opinion.

    Also, as chance would have it, I happen to register on these forums about just as long ago as you did. You may dig up my introduction if you want. That argument is entirely childish. Yes, I don't participate in the forum's activities, and as you suggested I'm trying to barge in in a monastery with my own set of rules. But your behaviour was inacceptable in general and immature, and I had found it important to stand up against such a bully like you, because the person you humiliated couldn't do it. End of the story.
     
  15. Luda

    Luda Seventh Year

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    You do know that this is DLP right? No-one cares if you're feeling butthurt over Gio's well-developed and relatively rational argument dissecting Jigokuno. It's been a long time coming and well-deserved. You seem to be the only one that doesn't know what Jigokuno is like, you admit yourself that your opinion of him is uninformed.

    Well let me enlighten you: He goes to every story threads and baaws about what apparently turned the corresponding story to absolute shit and how the author must comply with what he says to make the story readable and tailor it to his personal tastes. It's not constructive criticism either. He's needlessly argumentative and I've never seen him say anything good about anyone's story, period.

    Jigokuno has far more flaws, but I have neither Giovanni's time nor patience to go into depth discussing them, without being quite...mean. So make of that what you will
     
    Last edited: May 26, 2010
  16. Giovanni

    Giovanni God of Scotch

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    Alexxey:

    1. Active membership. Learn it. "Yes, I don't participate in the forum's activities," and "I'm trying to barge in in a monastery with my own set of rules." Your own words. So basically, your argument is that you've been a member for 3 years and that you haven't participated in the forum's activities. Yet you expect this lack of participation to be rewarded by us as you give us sacred laws down from on high. Quit White-Knighting. No one gives a shit.

    This attitude, however, is indicative of your posts today. You admit to having no knowledge of the subject at hand and to not participating on the board or giving two shits about its rules and norms. However, you expect this community to follow your rules. Wow broski. That's even more arrogant than I could ever hope to be.

    2. You still haven't shown how I took words out of context. Your argument was that I could hate whoever, but that my post was "ripe with personal abuse." The first part of that was irrelevant to the discussion and the second part of it was the motif of your post. So here we have it, if I say exactly what you said in the context in which you said it I am unfairly "taking words out of context." That's a bit of a "heads I win, tails you lose" set up now isn't it?

    Tell me Alexxey, when did you stop raping your neighbor's daughter?

    3. You claim that I am a bully. Tell me, good sir, how is it bullying to stand up to someone else whose posting history in the fanfic review section consists of nothing but that? I do not know where you grew up -- or who taught you how to comport yourself -- but where I'm from you punch the bully in the face. Hard (or take a debilitating cheap-shot and run). That was what my initial post was. Had you not been a non-participant on the board, had you read the posting history of the poster in question, had you not been someone coming at this from a position of admitted ignorance, then you would know this. Instead, you ran off half-cocked after convincing yourself that you were what this board needed: A White Knight to bring civilization to us savages.

    With all due respect (a commodity of which you have earned very little) go fuck Jigokuno in his hugbox.

    EDIT: Luda if you ever need to flee Australia due to censorship of your internets I have a floor for you to crash on.

    EDIT 2 (Kai Shek): Nah, this post is just the final dismissal of Alexxey's garbage because he didn't get the memo the first few times.

    EDIT 3: Proving my point from Post 1.

     
    Last edited: May 26, 2010
  17. Kai Shek

    Kai Shek Supreme Mugwump

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    I figured it was the polite thing to do in a trolling thread. I guess there's a post requirement to trolling that I just haven't met yet.

    Your post above proves that the thread is not over with.
     
  18. Tylendel

    Tylendel Sixth Year

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    In all honesty, i find this post quite amusing. And very conform with what I'm expecting on DLP.

    While I do not agree with the way Giovanni handled things, I can understand why he acted that way. Jigokuno never seemed to learn when to shut up, and Gio post about Jigo actions should have been publish some time ago. When all you do is critize for the sake of criticism, I hope you are ready to take the backslash of you actions.

    And even thought Giovani comments were mean, you are on DLP. I registered less than 2 or 3 months ago and I know that such post are common when someone is disagreable for not reason.

    PS: The question may sound stupid, but may someone explain to me how to make a "thumbs up"' on a post ? I didn't understand the explanation given when it was introduced.

    PS2: I'm sorry if I'm not as clear as water, I still have some difficulty to express my thought in English.
     
  19. Kai Shek

    Kai Shek Supreme Mugwump

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    Bottom of the post, there is a thumbs up image that you just have to click on when logged in(Right of quote)
     
  20. Jigokuno

    Jigokuno Seventh Year

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    Not sure who Alexeyy is but I would like to start off by thanking him for defending me even though he doesn't know me.

    Next is:

    Hello Giovanni. I will try to go more in depth later about your criticisms but I have just stumbled onto this because Antivash showed me the link in Renegade Causes topic. However it is late and I don't have the time to read and reply to this long dissection of my personal character at the moment.

    Edit: I seem to have made the time to read and reply to everything you said since it was kinda annoying having words put in my mouth and being misinterpreted.

    "Given the utter lack of depth in your reviews I find this difficult to believe. Given the number of fanfics you are likely to have read compared to the number of reviews you have left, it becomes even more difficult to believe."

    Not even sure what this means Gio. Your saying I couldn't find something to complain about because my reviews lack depth? Denarian series was 3 books long and I only had one criticism the entire time which was the way Voldemort got the Elder Wand in the third book.

    "You also speak of refusing to write "Update PLX" to "raise" your post count. By this standard, then, you claim that your posts are of a higher quality than the majority of the posts in the section since -- according to you -- posts which correct grammar, spelling, and cohesion, are simply lazy posts constructed by uncritical fans. Your reviews, then, should be of a higher quality than any others -- particularly those you criticize."

    You merged two things that I said together in order to make me look bad here. You also added in one thing I NEVER said.

    I have not once stated I believe my reviews are of higher quality. In fact I know my reviews are poorly worded so I try to wait till someone else points out the flaws and agree with them(My bad I should have waited till Amerision posted his complaint about Renegade Cause and just agreed with him.). Taure and Howdy come to mind here because I have found myself agreeing with their criticisms of stories on multiple occasions and I KNOW they have stated the criticisms much better then I possibly could.

    The two ideas you merged are me not wanting to say update plx and people pointing out flaws in grammar. I have bad grammar so I CAN'T point out grammar flaws. That has nothing to do with me complaining about people saying update plx. If people can find grammar flaws in the story to help out the author more power too them but I simply lack the skill to do it so I stick with trying to point out flaws in the story. I seem to be doing this well since like 9 out of 10 people pretty much agreed with me on Silens recent update.

    I find it hard to believe you would sit here and say people don't go into threads and say "Hey I like the update glad to see you kept going". I am not going to say the name but I have a story on DLP open right now and skimmed the replies to the story on that page to see if I could find what I am talking about and here it is: "Once again I'm lost. Update more :wizard:" Ironically it is someone who agrees wholeheartedly with you about my uselessness.

    Santi's story DOES interest me but like I said it wasn't a favorite anymore. I AM glad he is writing it. Whether he is writing it for personal reasons or the enjoyment of others. I actually thought telling him the flaws in his story weren't so bad I would quit reading was being nice but apparently even that is a flaw of mine from your POV. I was trying to show that the flaw I was pointing out wasn't story ruining. Other people agreed or understood what I was saying your the only person so far who has brought it up to me.

    On your fourth point you agreed with me about the predictability. So what are you yelling about? Silens to this point has written in a very unpredictable way which has been interesting. Their was nothing wrong with the scene he posted since it was well done it just didn't seem to flow well with the unpredictability of the rest of his story and I thought it needed to be reworded to fit more with Silens style of writing. If that had been posted in a regular story it would be fine but unless Silens has decided to make his story more open he should probably try to reword it and not foreshadow as much about how Malfoy was about to get his head put in acid.

    Edit 2.0: Giovanni you mind if I use that pic with my name on it as my Avatar?
     
    Last edited: May 26, 2010