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Wizards v. Muggles Megathread

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by Xiph0, Mar 7, 2016.

  1. Blinker

    Blinker Sixth Year DLP Supporter

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    I think a few of these points have been raised before, but the first question that pops into my mind is how the muggles find the wizards to shoot them? they have no idea where any of the wizards are, and in the most extreme case are literally incapable of seeing or mapping these places.

    edit: the only good HP Cannon is a Chudley one
     
  2. Moukaboy

    Moukaboy Fifth Year

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    I think that in the end a battle between a muggle and a wizard depends who throws the first punch , same goes for a war between the two

    Although i think wizards would need more time since they do seem a little ignorant of muggle culture but i'm sure there are specialists on muggles or maybe a greedy muggle born willing to teach them what they need to know

    Maybe muggles will have to find a muggleborn angry with the wizarding word (which shouldn't be hard) so they know where to throw the bombs
     
  3. Mordecai

    Mordecai Drunken Scotsman Prestige DLP Supporter

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    So you're saying that a wizard victory relies on wizards sticking together, and a muggle victory would rely on a traitor from the wizarding community joining the muggle side?
     
  4. Moukaboy

    Moukaboy Fifth Year

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    Yes and No , it depends on how cameras and videos work , for exemple does a notice me not charm and muggle repelling "wards" still takes effect even in a video ?
    i don't think there is an answer in canon
     
  5. Sataniel

    Sataniel Seventh Year

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    Or, you know, just force the knowledge with magic? Also, Shacklebolt managed to perfectly infiltrate Office of a Prime Minister or however you call that.

    There were aerial photos of London since 1920s, yet Diagon Alley was never found. Seems like a proof enough for me.
     
  6. Moukaboy

    Moukaboy Fifth Year

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    Yes but that's our world's aerial photos , we don't know if the HP world is the same
    it probably is because the only other acceptable solution is that oblivators are working 24/24

    The problem is JK Rowling probably didn't think that far
     
  7. stayintheloop

    stayintheloop First Year

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    Does it even matter if they don't know what the exact location of Diagon Alley is? Like you said, if a Muggle-born would be willing to 'help them along' so to speak, I see no reason why it would be impossible to simply sneak in, plant a bomb, and go. I must confess I am ignorant to any methods of combat magic that have the ability to slay large numbers of people, but I do know that Muggles have bombs powerful enough to destroy entire cities. How could wizards manage to fight this? If a powerful bomb went off in Diagon Alley, one fifth of the wizard population would be dead if not more.
     
  8. Halt

    Halt 1/3 of the Note Bros.

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    Do you even Fiendfyre.
     
  9. Seyllian

    Seyllian Auror DLP Supporter

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    1. Find a half-blood.
    2. Give said wizard an invisibility cloak.
    3. Said wizard apparates into the US, sneaks into Oval Office and Imperius' the President.
    4. President starts a war with all other nations on the Earth.
    5. All muggles die.
     
  10. Sorrows

    Sorrows Professor Prestige DLP Supporter

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    Setting off large bombs in the middle of London has a few obvious issues.
     
  11. Sauce Bauss

    Sauce Bauss Headmaster DLP Supporter

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    A single wizard of Snape/Mcgonagall/Slughorn/Flitwick's caliber could bring a nation to its knees in hours. There's the obvious example of imperiusing various leaders, plus the oft-overlooked utility of legilimancy in such cases. There are 9 internet exchange points in the US which, if brought down, would cut off the majority of internet based communication with the rest of the world. You could go to the half dozen largest/busiest ports and sink large container ships at critical areas. Sticking charm to keep it from being dredged, and unbreakable charm to keep it from being dismantled. You have now brought the US economy to a screeching halt, congratulations. Set the Eastern and Western Interconnections on fire with fiendfyre, and you've now taken out power to a massive swathe of the country.

    Use muggle repelling charms on sections of a dozen major highways and you bring travel and transport of things like food to a halt. Could also go the more direct route and destroy them, whichever is most convenient. The modern world's logistical chain is magnificent and is able to route around many such issues, but taking out the ability to ship things via road or sea would put a strain on the most resilient of systems. Do the same thing to half a dozen railroad hubs and you've now brought all shipping to a complete halt across a continent. There are similar hubs for the phone system. Take a quick jaunt around our naval bases and set each carrier on fire with fiendfyre. Burn down half a dozen buildings in DC and you destroy the upper echelons of government. Supreme Court, Congress, White House. Hit the Pentagon, JEH building, Langley, and Fort Meade. The military and intelligence agencies are now left gutted.

    The US is now without the ability to transport food, water, or people, communicate, travel by sea or by land, use electricity or the internet. Other nations would be unable to offer any meaningful assistance due to the crippling of communication and shipping. This is can be done in a matter of hours given a wizard/witch's ability to teleport via multiple avenues.

    All of this can be accomplished by a single magic user in a single day. What does it matter if you can drop a bomb on Diagon Alley in the face of a threat where each individual has all the power of a nation state with more difficulty to find and deal with them than any guerrilla group in history?



    I'm also on a list now, thanks.
     
  12. Seyllian

    Seyllian Auror DLP Supporter

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    Don't worry, you were already on one before.
     
  13. Halt

    Halt 1/3 of the Note Bros.

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    I'd guess that the effect carries over. Spells as a rule work as concepts or ideas that impose themselves as laws unto the muggle universe. They don't work by finding a way within "science", so it doesn't make sense that finding a non-magical loophole can allow a muggle to defeat a spell.
     
  14. Sauce Bauss

    Sauce Bauss Headmaster DLP Supporter

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    This is the bit that most of the pro-muggle side don't tend to understand. They think of HP magic like DnD or Dresden magic. One more force of nature that operates within nature. An expenditure of some kind of energy for an effect. HP magic is conceptual. A repairing charm doesn't just put pieces back together and weld them tight, it fixes the item. The silencing charm doesn't block soundwaves, it silences. A notice me not charm prevents people from noticing the thing or person under the charm. It doesn't matter if you're looking at it with a camera or with your eyes, it stops you from noticing.

    If wards did not work on video, one would be left with the question of how nobody noticed things like extra roads in London, or intact Scottish castles where there weren't any. Either muggles are even more clueless and stupid than wizards at their worst, or muggles are unable to see them even through things like cameras and satellite imagery. One of these answers is more likely than the other.
     
  15. Moukaboy

    Moukaboy Fifth Year

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    A nuclear war would mean everyone would die , not just muggles .

    Also I'm pretty sure that the president alone can't start a war , you'd need to imperius more people (which is doable , just saying) .



    Other than that i like the idea that magic doesn't submit to the common scientific rules , makes sense .
     
  16. Halt

    Halt 1/3 of the Note Bros.

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    This would really depend on whether you believe magic has the capacity to reverse or counteract the effects of radiation. I think it's possible for a skilled wizard to do.
     
  17. Taure

    Taure Magical Core Enthusiast Prestige DLP Supporter

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    Or indeed, whether you think radiation would harm wizards in the first place. They don't seem to get cancer for a start, and we know for example that wizards can shrug off poisons which would kill a Muggle.
     
  18. Moukaboy

    Moukaboy Fifth Year

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    It's just that most of the magical places we see in Cannon are placed in the middle of heavily populated areas (so an obvious target for bombs)
    Worst case scenario : The magical population would decrease drastically
    Best case scenario : They have to rebuild most of the infrastructure (Diagon Alley , Gringotts etc)


    After that radiation is the next obvious problem but do wizards get sick like we do ? and can magic fix everything or does it only help with the average/common diseases ?
     
  19. Taure

    Taure Magical Core Enthusiast Prestige DLP Supporter

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    You're assuming the bombs would be able to destroy the magically protected areas in the first place. Given that magic can create and destroy matter, allow you to teleport, time travel -- in short, completely ignore physics -- it would seem strange if it were not able to deal with the effects of a bomb.

    With respect to disease/injuries, there are three categories:

    - Problems that wizards are more resistant to by nature (poison, physical injury)

    - Problems that wizards are still vulnerable to but can cure with incredible ease (Muggle illnesses such as the flu)

    - Problems that wizards struggle to cure (magical injuries and diseases).
     
    Last edited: Nov 13, 2017
  20. Moukaboy

    Moukaboy Fifth Year

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    Every spell has a limit though , and we still don't know if wards (or protective enchantements if you will) protect against everything or just spells and spell based attacks .

    Maybe a little strange but not unthinkable .

    Well i think radiation and by association cancer would be in the the third category .

    edit : I could also argue that your common wizard shows absolute ignorance about what muggles can and can't do but maybe there are special divisions for muggle research
     
    Last edited: Nov 13, 2017