The unforgivables were very powerful spells and was made during the second wizarding war if the wiki is to be believed . We all know AK and Cruciatus curse cant be defended by magical means and imperio the spell made to be the excuse of several DE to avoid repercussion and almost took control of the ministry .

My point is there has been years after this spell was developed. The government, unspeakable or someone somewhere must have researched a way to counter this. So what fic have you read that did find a way to prepare for this kinda spells and if it was you, what are your plans to fight a wizard capable of this spells?

Edit: My ultimate endgoal here is to read a fic (coz i cant write) or hopefully someone would write it.

I havent read a premise about wizard families preparing for an inevitable fight when their opponent could use the unforgivables on them. I dont want the counter to be easy but I cant imagine them to be aware of the danger and not do anything about them either.

I just want to read something like (you're welcome to add):
1. The ministry being better prepared against the threat of imperius.
2. harry having a plan or action against the threat of AK and cruciatus
3. The unforgivables not easily casted by some nobody.
4. Arms race of spell by the families.

 

Snape blocks/parries/deflects (JKR's term for dispelling a spell has been inconsistent) Harry's cruciatus so it definitely can be defended against magically. The killing curse is the only one said to be unblockable. It's also why I've never believed that all three unforgivables can be grouped together magically; I've always simply considered it a classification for spells that are automatically life in Azkaban and nothing more.

Defense seems pretty simple to me. Interpose something physical between a killing curse and yourself or move yourself out of the way. The cruciatus can be blocked like any other spell. And I'm not convinced that a ministry that isn't plagued by corruption and that has voluntarily allowed the enemy in would need magic to deal with the imperiused. When people are imperiused in the books, there are signs. It seems to me that voluntary traitors in government would be better spies than someone under the imperius, and a competent government should be able to catch spies. The issue with the ministry is that there are already a bunch of spies in the ministry, voluntarily let in by the likes of Fudge and Umbridge and it's already too late, the imperius is just the tool of sabotage at that point (Thicknesse).

 

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Ok but cant they create a spell that deadens the pain receptors temporarily to counter cruciatus?

And about the AK you can impose objects (If there's any) or animate (which is hard for ordinary wizards), why cant they make something to dodge it better? enchant their shoes perhaps or a movement spell?

And the imperius for me is the most dangeous spell for a government security. How can the government solve the problem if they cant easily detect who has been conpromised because it has been shown that even harry (a student) can cast imperius (bank scene) according to wiki.

 

They're called Unforgivable for a reason. If a counter was a simple matter, they wouldn't hold the cultural weight they do.

 

The spells are still dangerous and inhumane but there was a lot of time to prepare and research for a counter. My thinking is that wizards must always learn to defend oneself from harm and the unforgivables are too popular in usage for someone not to at least think on how to defend himself in case he fought an enemy who knows how to cast it. Thats why selfcreated spell or spells that are unique should be more dangerous like the duel of volde vs dumbledore.

 

Most magicals can't even cast a Shield Charm, let alone something that would defend against the most heinous spells currently known.

 

I know there's glassy eyes and what not from the imperius curse (is that canon?), but if the signs were that easily seen, it wouldn't have been such a problem, would it?

 

Yes, but shouldnt prominent families like the purebloods think like a paranoid wizard? In order to protect their bloodline and whatnot? Shouldnt their entire advantage against muggleborns is that they keep records of most spells that are dangerous, find a counter or create a new one so they can have an ace against other families or people?

 

I can forgive the ministry back then if they have no counter to imperius but for the next war? Shouldnt the General or the equivalent on wizardkind cant see the danger of it happening again? I mean its ok if you cant counter AK and cruciatus but the imperius? (Worm even has protocols against mind meddlers.)

 

As far as I can see, the glazed look in the eyes of an imperiused victim is film only vis a vis Krum in the maze. It being a perfect method of coersion is the only explanation that makes sense from a story and watsonian standpoint - glassy eyes would male it too easy to see, and the trigger happy DMLE of Voldemorts first insurrection would have noticed it among the myriad of wizards claiming it after his first fall.

You could merge book and film canon, I suppose, by saying that Crouch Jr wasn't talented enough with respect to the dark arts to cast it perfectly to the point where the victim is noticeably bewitched. But that doesn't seem viable

 

And if it was as simple as that to find an answer to the Unforgivables, it wouldn't be such a big thing that Harry survived. The whole point of them is that they're not some slug vomiting jinx that can be reversed. The only defence is not to be hit, or in the case of the Imperius, to have a bigger, thicker, and girthier willpower than the caster.

 

I'm pretty sure the Imperius Curse only shows signs of any kind when the victim is fighting it, like the Crouches. Something that, oddly enough, never seems to happen after the fourth book.

 

If the Ministry had better relations with the Goblins, they might persuade them to enchant the entrances to the Ministry with replicas of the Thief's Downfall, which would be a pretty effective defence against the Imperius.

Agreed that only the Killing Curse is unblockable. Fake Moody goes through the whole explanation of the Unforgiveables without saying anything about unblockability until the Killing Curse comes up, at which point he only states that the Killing Curse is unblockable. There's no basis for saying the others are unblockable too. That's the whole point of Harry being unique/special: he's the only person to have ever blocked the only unblockable piece of magic in existence.

As for developing a block to the Killing Curse, since its unblockability represents the inevitability of death, I doubt developing such a block is possible. Or at least, if it is possible, it is of a similar level of difficulty to Muggle civilisation figuring out how to reverse entropy.

 

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I can stomach the AK to be unshieldable it would defeat the purpose of unforgivables if it was too easy. My main problems mostly is the requirements to cast it especially the imperius. The people that could cast it are the ones who should be good at the mind arts and not just anyone. And people imperiused should be recognizable unless spell is layered (to hide the telltale signs) which means the caster should be near the vicinity of the victim and cant be just controlled remotely from too far a distance.

And the second thing is dodging. For a dangerous spell to be dodgeable means the spell is slow. So why dont wizards create a better movement skill to make the AK (not nerf it) deadlier.

 

Honestly my view on the question of "why don't wizards make x more deadly/why don't wizards have defense against y" is simply that combat isn't really something that's on most people's minds. Why would you research more deadly killing curse when you can just as well come up with something actually useful, like ways to induce lewd daydreams on teenagers?

In canon we don't see any kind of arms race of spell development beyond teenage edgelords (Snape) fantasizing about hurting their "enemies".

 

Pureblood Families could. Narratively you can make it like families tend to hoard dangerous spells and enchanted items and pass it to the heir or family members who had learn to defend himself against mind intrusion (to keep the secret safer) like in the name of the wind (secrets of magick only gets passed when your in the know). Though thinking about it i havent read a fic that made a premise like that for the purebloods. I mean whats the point aside from culture? Shouldnt wizards entire creed about secrets? (coz they are pretty good about it with all the secrecy against muggles)

 

Most wizards aren't researches, they dont devote their life to finding about more about magic, magic is just a tool to help them enjoy their lives. That includes Purebloods.

Why would someone like Lucius Malfoy for example waste his precious time trying to come up with new dark magic, when he'd much rather use that time to improve his financial position and expand his influence, or just spend time enjoying himself with like minded wizards.

 

I see your point. So i change my post again because I didnt express what I wanted to discuss clearly.

So what fic have you read that did find a way to prepare for this spells and if it was you, what are your plans to fight a wizard capable of this spells?

 

I think this speaks to a fundamental difference in view that a lot of 'muggles looking in' have when compared to the witches and wizards living in the world. There's this expectation, probably driven by the simple fact that the narrative of the Harry Potter books is driven by external conflict, that magic is about fighting, or, at the very least, fighting is a major concern of all witches and wizards.

To reply to that, I would point to guns. There are plenty of places around the world where various weapons are available to the general public. Guns, knives, big knobbly clubs. The thing that typically decides whether those weapons are broadly owned/carried/used is not simply their availability. Regardless of how strict a nation's laws are on carried weapons, there's always something which you could carry which would give you a significant leg up over an adversary, be it a concealed carry hand gun, a penknife, or a can of pepper spray. No, the most important factor which decides the 'readiness' of a population is probably the perception of safety, or, more accurately, the perception of danger.

The US, in many states, allows for fairly easy access to guns, and while a large number of people do swear by their guns, it is estimated that around 32% of adults own a gun. The next question I'd ask, is what proportion of those do you think actually practice with their firearm? How many of those who did receive basic firearms training are actually 'combat effective'? Finally, I'd ask how many people own 'bulletproof' vests or the like?

These may seem like they're unconnected, but my point here is that even in a society where the individualistic ability to defend oneself, one's family, and one's homestead is lionised the actual number of people able to do so is small. When people believe they are safe, they are content to ignore their own ability to defend themselves. It seems fairly clear to me that witches and wizards (in the UK at least) believe they are safe.

All we see of the Wizarding World is the conflict. We see it building, and we know it's coming, but that is not true of most of the population of that world. For them, the sudden rash of attacks must have seemed to come out of nowhere.

At the end of the day, magic to a witch or wizard is not like a gun. It is as natural as something like the internet is to us. It touches every part of their day, and every part of their life. Can it be used to harm others? Certainly. Do most of us do anything more than the bare minimum to avoid that potential harm? No, and those who do are often regarded as a 'bit weird'. Transfer that attitude to witches and wizards and you end up with a populace that is more likely to brag about a new spell they found for making chicken pies than they are to even think about remembering their school lessons on how to properly cast a Protego. Knowledge of how to fight simply isn't useful to a wealthy, peaceful, safe populace.

 

You're probably right but I was thinking someone like the aurors and hit wizards must be better prepared than that or someone in the know like the unspeakables perhaps? Nonetheless, Imagine if it was you and its your job how do you go defending yourself? What is your go to strategy if you find yourself in a fight with a difficult situation (like open space or terrain disadvantage)? And if you were moody how will you teach a student to go defending himself against the unforgivables?