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Old 07-15-2017, 07:09 PM   #221
Joe's Nemesis
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Did he just get banned, because admin disagrees with his opinion? Free speech is now limited to well-known users?

edit: Turns out I do have opinions, after all. This is what I fear, you see? That a censor will come, just because he doesn't like me, or something and poof, I am banned, because I said something that local censor (Xiph) doesn't like. That's what my parents fought against in 1993 (communism).
Your parents fought communism in 1993 so Xipho couldn't ban you from DLP in 2017?
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Old 07-15-2017, 07:09 PM   #222
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As far as I can tell, Sree is some kind of racist joke.
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Old 07-15-2017, 07:11 PM   #223
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Did he just get banned, because admin disagrees with his opinion? Free speech is now limited to well-known users?

edit: Turns out I do have opinions, after all. This is what I fear, you see? That a censor will come, just because he doesn't like me, or something and poof, I am banned, because I said something that local censor (Xiph) doesn't like. That's what my parents fought against in 1993 (communism).
I think that not everyone agrees that the user shouldn't have been banned just because of a difference of opinions. However, I doubt that that's all there is to him being banned. There's a notice that clearly says that this forum is heavily moderated and posts are made at the user's risk. User JokeIsAbsolute ignored that.

Arguing the minutiae of politics is tedious and requires extensive knowledge of the topics. This particular user is entitled to his opinion—as I'm sure Xiph0 agrees—but he didn't offer cogent substantives. He made ridiculously broad, undefined statements and didn't have any facts to substantiate them. At the same time, other users made their own contributions but sought to offer proof for their stance (for the most part at least).

Having said that, look at it objectively. Xiph0 has a duty as an administrator to help maintain a high standard at DLP. If I were in his shoes I'd ask myself: does this user contribute positively to the discussion? If no, is he just an idiot shitposting? The answer to the first question is an absolute no, while the answer to the second is an absolute yes.

You might not consider the banned user's posts shitposts. But they are. He demonstrated poorly thought out reasoning and couldn't support his very controversial statements. Him being banned was reasonable, at least that's the way I see it.

Point is, the mods and admins might seem a bit trigger-happy with bans. Before you call them out though, assess their positions carefully as well as the posts of the banned user(s) and make decisions based on your observations. Based on what I observed, JokeIsAbsolute wasn't actually unfairly banned. Feel free to disagree though.

EDIT: Well, fuck. She got her ass banned too, right before I responded. Shame.

Last edited by The Pro; 07-15-2017 at 07:19 PM.
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Old 07-15-2017, 07:12 PM   #224
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Feel free to disagree though.
No don't. Also yeah, I barely looked at his positions, his post was just a garbage fire. Politics is the most dangerous place you can be shitty in on DLP, because garbage folks can very quickly make Politics insanely bad forever.
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As far as I can tell, Sree is some kind of racist joke.
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Old 07-15-2017, 07:13 PM   #225
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Did he just get banned, because admin disagrees with his opinion? Free speech is now limited to well-known users?
No, there simply is no free speech on internet platforms at all, and no, it's not what your parents fought against. See the social media/First Amendment thread to discuss this. (The general issue, not DLP.)

Regarding the particulars, in order to keep the quality of the discussion high, users who consistently fly at underground altitude get removed from Politics. All this is detailed in the Rules for Politics, as linked e.g. from the Must-Read FAQ, so everything's clear.

We have a thread topic. Carry on.
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Old 07-16-2017, 09:11 PM   #226
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On topic, Kellyanne Conway said that criticism of her is gender-based and undercuts modern feminism. Thoughts on the matter?
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Old 07-16-2017, 09:26 PM   #227
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On topic, Kellyanne Conway said that criticism of her is gender-based and undercuts modern feminism. Thoughts on the matter?
She's full of shit. She's been criticized for the same reason Sean Spicer has; for telling bold faced lies and attempting to pass them off as "alternative facts." It has nothing to do with her gender and everything to do with her character.
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Old 07-16-2017, 10:47 PM   #228
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She's full of shit. She's been criticized for the same reason Sean Spicer has; for telling bold faced lies and attempting to pass them off as "alternative facts." It has nothing to do with her gender and everything to do with her character.
Yup. I still can't believe she was stupid enough to casually say "alternative facts" when she was called out though. That will never cease to amaze me.
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Old 07-17-2017, 01:05 AM   #229
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On topic, Kellyanne Conway said that criticism of her is gender-based and undercuts modern feminism. Thoughts on the matter?
If a man put his feet on the couches in the West Wing I'd want him hanged. Her dangly bits don't make a difference.
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As far as I can tell, Sree is some kind of racist joke.
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Old 07-17-2017, 01:52 AM   #230
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^Seriously, wth was up with that? I mean, regardless of where you stand politically, you're in the office of the POTUS. Conduct yourself with some dignity and sit like an adult.
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I can't wait till I have grandchildren. "When I was younger, I had to walk to the rim of a crater. Uphill! In an EVA suit! On Mars, ya little shit! Ya hear me? Mars!"
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Old 07-17-2017, 02:20 PM   #231
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Back to the original question from the survey kicking it off, I was thinking that the definition of feminist needs discussing.

Is it someone who:
  • campaigns for issues where women are at a disadvantage?
  • actively campaigns for gender equality?
  • is involved in the academic and public discussion of feminism?
  • thinks that there should be greater equality between the genders and acts on that in their day to day life?
Because I'm starting to try and clarify my personal definition and I'm thinking that it should only applies to those actively campaigning for gender equality. So those who don't campaign but try to treat people the same regardless of gender are not feminists.

Because feminism is not a religion or belief system, it is a social movement, and unless you are actively involved in the feminist movement then I don't think you are a feminist.

Feminism started as actively campaigning for issues where women are disadvantaged, but the better parts have expanded to gender equality.

However it has been accepted that if you think there should be greater equality but don't do anything towards it you are a feminist. Following on from that, if you say that you aren't a feminist because you are not campaigning then you are a misogynist.

Opinions? Maybe feminism is a belief system and so if you think it without necessarily campaigning or publicly acting on it you are a feminist?
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Old 07-17-2017, 02:28 PM   #232
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If a man put his feet on the couches in the West Wing I'd want him hanged. Her dangly bits don't make a difference.
Didn't Obama rest his feet on the Resolute desk?

That's also where Clinton got down and dirty right?

Or do you mean people other than the president.
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Old 07-17-2017, 07:27 PM   #233
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Who cares? It's fucking furniture.

This coming from someone who builds - exquisite - furniture for a living...
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Old 07-17-2017, 08:46 PM   #234
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Or do you mean people other than the president.
Pretty much. The President is the big boss and he/she has the right to chill in the Oval Office however they like.

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Who cares? It's fucking furniture.

This coming from someone who builds - exquisite - furniture for a living...
So, in my case, it's less about the furniture and more about how much you respect the President and their office. I don't respect Trump, but I'm assuming Kellyann Conway does (or at least his money) so what boggles my mind is how she didn't think that sitting like that while everyone else in the office was standing wouldn't exactly look good. Of course, 5D chess Grand Master Trump might have planned this all along in order to distract the internet for a brief period.


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Opinions? Maybe feminism is a belief system and so if you think it without necessarily campaigning or publicly acting on it you are a feminist?
To me, feminists are people who campaign for issues where women are at a disadvantage. On the other hand, not being a feminist or campaigning for their issues doesn't make someone a misogynist. People have their reasons for not wanting to be labeled a feminist and it's not always because their prejudiced against women.
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I can't wait till I have grandchildren. "When I was younger, I had to walk to the rim of a crater. Uphill! In an EVA suit! On Mars, ya little shit! Ya hear me? Mars!"
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Old 07-17-2017, 08:57 PM   #235
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Originally Posted by Immet View Post
Back to the original question from the survey kicking it off, I was thinking that the definition of feminist needs discussing.

Is it someone who:
  • campaigns for issues where women are at a disadvantage?
  • actively campaigns for gender equality?
  • is involved in the academic and public discussion of feminism?
  • thinks that there should be greater equality between the genders and acts on that in their day to day life?
Because I'm starting to try and clarify my personal definition and I'm thinking that it should only applies to those actively campaigning for gender equality. So those who don't campaign but try to treat people the same regardless of gender are not feminists.

Because feminism is not a religion or belief system, it is a social movement, and unless you are actively involved in the feminist movement then I don't think you are a feminist.

Feminism started as actively campaigning for issues where women are disadvantaged, but the better parts have expanded to gender equality.

However it has been accepted that if you think there should be greater equality but don't do anything towards it you are a feminist. Following on from that, if you say that you aren't a feminist because you are not campaigning then you are a misogynist.

Opinions? Maybe feminism is a belief system and so if you think it without necessarily campaigning or publicly acting on it you are a feminist?
That definition is absolutely not applicable anymore, as feminism itself has several different facets, and some of those facets is exactly a belief system, however, I'm getting ahead of myself.

First (in presentation, not in importance), it's a philosophy. That philosophy gets applied in several academic pursuits such as feminist hermenuetics in historical and biblical studies.

Second, feminism only applies to white, North American women. So, to expand on that, we must expand to other movements such as the womanist and Mujerista movements. The last proclaims itself a theology for Latino women.
....
Dang, gotta go, whill come back later.
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Old 07-17-2017, 09:06 PM   #236
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Immet View Post
Back to the original question from the survey kicking it off, I was thinking that the definition of feminist needs discussing.

Is it someone who:
  • campaigns for issues where women are at a disadvantage?
  • actively campaigns for gender equality?
  • is involved in the academic and public discussion of feminism?
  • thinks that there should be greater equality between the genders and acts on that in their day to day life?
It all depends on the individual's definition of feminism. The one that fits most would be the emboldened definition though, like @awinarock said. It makes sense when you think about it, because feminism is supposedly "campaigning for gender equality by advocacy for women's rights". At least, that's what it's supposed to be.

Quote:
However it has been accepted that if you think there should be greater equality but don't do anything towards it you are a feminist. Following on from that, if you say that you aren't a feminist because you are not campaigning then you are a misogynist.
I might be misconstruing these statements, so it's probably best if you explain what you mean.
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Old 07-18-2017, 04:04 AM   #237
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Or do you mean people other than the president.
That is literally who I mean, yes. If the people elect you to have the final call on nuclear strikes, you can put your fucking feet up, that's part of your rights. If you're an unelected tag-along, you treat the Office like the Office.

And let's not pretend Kennedy didn't pump skanks in the Oval.
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As far as I can tell, Sree is some kind of racist joke.
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Old 07-18-2017, 07:18 AM   #238
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I might be misconstruing these statements, so it's probably best if you explain what you mean.
That was badly worded. Okay, here's an example. Often one of the questions asked of public figures is 'are you a feminist?'. Without the opportunity to explain your position and personal definition of feminism it boils down to a split of 'do you support the feminist movement or are you a misogynist?'

Lots of public figures have been asked this including recently Angela Merkel. So, unless they answer the way that feminist movements would like them to they are attacked. Just imagine what would have happened and the uproar had Angela Merkel said that she wasn't part of the feminist movement so she isn't a feminist.
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Old 07-18-2017, 09:12 AM   #239
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Second, feminism only applies to white, North American women. So, to expand on that, we must expand to other movements such as the womanist and Mujerista movements. The last proclaims itself a theology for Latino women.
....
Dang, gotta go, whill come back later.
European feminists would like to have a word with you, sir. Far as I know, the origins of the movement are situated with gals like Wollstonecraft and Dohm - all perfectly non-American. :P
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Old 07-18-2017, 11:07 AM   #240
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That was badly worded. Okay, here's an example. Often one of the questions asked of public figures is 'are you a feminist?'. Without the opportunity to explain your position and personal definition of feminism it boils down to a split of 'do you support the feminist movement or are you a misogynist?'

Lots of public figures have been asked this including recently Angela Merkel. So, unless they answer the way that feminist movements would like them to they are attacked. Just imagine what would have happened and the uproar had Angela Merkel said that she wasn't part of the feminist movement so she isn't a feminist.
This is incredibly stupid reasoning. Just because I don't support feminists means I automatically hate women? Bullshit.

People have their own reasons for not wanting to be affiliated with feminism. Some don't want to be affiliated with the extremists. Some just don't care enough. Some just don't want to engage in any activism. It could be anything.

That whole line of reasoning is precisely why there are people who don't want to be labelled feminists. The face of feminism is no longer equality for women. The movement has devolved nowadays and is associated with ludicrous, silly people like the ones who use that kind of reasoning.
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