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Expression and regulation online

Discussion in 'Real Life Discussion' started by ScottPress, Apr 11, 2019.

  1. Arthellion

    Arthellion Lord of the Banned ~ Prestige ~

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  2. Sauce Bauss

    Sauce Bauss Minister of Magic DLP Supporter

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  3. ScottPress

    ScottPress The Horny Sovereign ~ Prestige ~

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    Last edited: Aug 5, 2019
  4. Agayek

    Agayek Half-Blood Prince DLP Supporter

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    The cloudflare blog link is turning up a 404. Not sure if it's been taken down or retracted or what.
     
  5. Majube

    Majube High Inquisitor

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  6. ScottPress

    ScottPress The Horny Sovereign ~ Prestige ~

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    I just don't like tech companies trying to be moral arbiters. Cash your check and fuck off.
     
  7. Agayek

    Agayek Half-Blood Prince DLP Supporter

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    Scott's been pretty consistent about not liking moral judgments and content arbitration performed by large corporations.

    And philosophically, I can't help but agree. The only meaningful connection to the shootings listed in the article is that some twat posted their bullshit manifesto to 8chan right before doing so. They could trivially (and if/when there's another one, they likely will) do the same thing on facebook, twitter, 4chan, or any of dozens of other alternatives. Does that mean Facebook gets pulled then? It's an equal level of association, after all.

    I've never been on 8chan, or 4chan for that matter. Frankly, I'd be pretty happy if all of the chans just abruptly vanished; I don't see much of value coming from them at all. But this move leaves a bad taste in my mouth. It feels a lot like empty virtue signaling, or at best an attempt to get in ahead of potential regulation they heard about rising from this weekend's events, and I can't help but dislike that. Maybe there's evidence of some more substantive links to 8chan that they can't publicly talk about, in which case my opinion would change dramatically, but as it stands, I don't like it.
     
  8. ScottPress

    ScottPress The Horny Sovereign ~ Prestige ~

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    cough Christchurch livestream cough

    Ever heard of HWNDU? 4chan at least has been a major source of lolz. I would hate for this vault of fun to vanish off the net.

    And the blogpost spells it out pretty clearly: 8chan is no longer Cloudflare's problem, but it remains the Internet's problem. Tech companies think those sites are "problematic", but they just don't want to be bothered with doing anything, so you get stuff like this move, which signals what they need Vox to report and otherwise doesn't affect their bottom line.
     
  9. Agayek

    Agayek Half-Blood Prince DLP Supporter

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    I haven't heard that acronym, but a quick google search says it's the Shia LeBouf thing with the flag, and I did hear about that. That was definitely a pretty entertaining display of peak autism, so that's fair enough I suppose.

    I still wouldn't shed any tears if the chans up and vanished, but I've gotta give you that point.
     
  10. Oment

    Oment The Betrayer

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    The can has been kicked successfully down the road, it seems, by CloudFlare. Congratulations, have a cookie now that all is well and good again. Huzzah, huzzah, huzzah.

    And by 'down the road' I mean 'two tiles over'. It'll be back soon and nothing will have changed. Deplatforming can work for individuals, but networks/communities such as the -chans are more or less immune because they'll make their own new site with blackjack and hookers.
     
  11. ScottPress

    ScottPress The Horny Sovereign ~ Prestige ~

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  12. Longsword

    Longsword Groundskeeper

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    It is just an opinion piece.
     
  13. ScottPress

    ScottPress The Horny Sovereign ~ Prestige ~

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    From a teacher preaching censorship. He shouldn't be a teacher.
     
  14. DR

    DR Secret Squirrel ~ Prestige ~ DLP Supporter

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    And you shouldn't be defending white supremacist publications.

    We've talked about this, Scott. If you don't want us to think you're a Nazi, stop defending all the Nazis.
     
  15. ScottPress

    ScottPress The Horny Sovereign ~ Prestige ~

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    Think what you like. I'm not putting my reprehensible views into the heads of students. I bet this guys does.

    Source to where I defended white supremacist publications.
     
  16. Plotless

    Plotless High Inquisitor

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    He has a PhD in politics and teaches at a university. I've never met anyone more outspoken of their politics than university professors - I particularly learned that they all hate Hunt and Gove in Britain.
     
    Last edited: Aug 16, 2019
  17. Longsword

    Longsword Groundskeeper

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    A teacher is no government official.
     
  18. ScottPress

    ScottPress The Horny Sovereign ~ Prestige ~

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    Censorship is bad no matter where the sentiment comes from.
     
  19. Villanelle

    Villanelle Seventh Year

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    Academia is largely left-leaning, to the point that UT Austin philosophy professor, Daniel Bonevac, made the news for being pro-Trump. While professors aren't government officials, they do exert a lot of influence on their students, and some of them will be in government some day.

    Extremists on either side of the political spectrum are worrying. The only caveat is those on the far right (or alt right?) are a hell of a lot more noticeable than the rest, and it's a lot more socially acceptable to dislike them.

    Suppressing speech isn't going to fix racism. They're just going to find other places to congregate.

    At least now it's out in the open.

    I get why Holocaust denial is illegal in most of Europe, but I don't think it's a good thing. People ought to be allowed to deny it happened, and people ought to have the right to be flat-Earthers. I think it's retarded, but it's their business and theirs to do what they please with it. Sure, it's dangerous, but what's the alternative? How do you regulate speech?

    Edit:

    Censoring addresses the symptoms, and does nothing to identify or address the root cause. Is the expert word on the subject not that people are more alike than they are different? What makes someone unable to recognise that someone who doesn't look like them is just as human as them? Usually, it's a series of ridiculous notions that are repeatedly validated by the people around them and/or confirmation bias.

    The answer shouldn't be to antagonise and isolate racists. Granted, there are people who are just fucked and no amount of exposure therapy will bring them to their senses, but most people have it in them to not be (completely) bigoted.
     
    Last edited: Aug 16, 2019
  20. Plotless

    Plotless High Inquisitor

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    This is like people saying that deplatforming Milo Yiannopolous would only increase his popularity with his racist and bigoted fanbase. What really happened is that he practically disappeared. Sure you have every right to say what you want, but other people and companies have the right to judge you for what you say.
     
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