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The Trumperium 2: Caesar by the Pussy

Discussion in 'Politics' started by Jon, Jun 15, 2017.

  1. Sesc

    Sesc Slytherin at Heart Moderator

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    Wait ... so WL is now a Warez site too? Why would they need to "leak" a book anyone can buy in the next bookstore?
     
  2. ASmallBundleOfToothpicks

    ASmallBundleOfToothpicks Professor

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    Taking a stab at the logic, I'd assume Wikileaks wants the book to be available, even if the cease and desist goes through.
     
  3. Sorrows

    Sorrows Auror Prestige DLP Gold Supporter

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    Considering it is currently available, it seems pretty shitty (and illegal ofc) of them to publish someones newly released book. That has to hurt sales. Its not like they couldn't have waited and done it later if it was pulled. Not really seeing any moral justification for it.

    As for the book, I've not finished it yet but my first impression is always be weary of something that tells you exactly what you want to hear. This book is catnip to a despairing democrat or liberal, its like a warm blanket of everything you want to hear about the Trump administration and because of that it will make a shit-tone of money. That kind of wish fulfillment tends to turn off the critical side of our brains. Its entertaining, but its written by a journalist with a dodgy reputation for accurate reporting who has a clear agenda and has yet to produce his corroborating evidence.

    Is it a pack of lies? Probably not and considering this administration so far it is perfectly believable that he was not corralled in the way most journalists would be in previous administrations. However he has previously been accused of reconstructing conversations according to his own imagination and there are several recalled here verbatim that he was not present for. Considering both silence, refutation and lashing out are being taken as confirmation by the gleeful public it is hard to say how accurate any of that is. There's a lot of gossip in here passed on from a lot of people with a lot of other agendas. I think that we would be less accepting of it had Trump not been the kind of person who produces and revels in trashy gossip on a daily basis.

    So yeah, by all means read it, just keep an eye on what your own biases.
     
    Last edited: Jan 9, 2018
  4. ASmallBundleOfToothpicks

    ASmallBundleOfToothpicks Professor

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    Worse than the cease and desist order would? Maybe it's their way of trying to force the hand of Trump's lawyers- proof that there's no way to stop the book getting out. That said, I both bought the book and downloaded the file.
     
  5. Oment

    Oment The Betrayer

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    The issue with Wikileaks is that, regardless of where you stand on them; from Assange being a full blown FSB agent since '10 (as I saw argued somewhere recently) or if they're just committed to the idea of freedom of information no matter its source, they are the only source who release it. Governments whose data is leaked cannot counter-release - not only were they second and he who accuses is in the advantage where politics and public opinion intersect, they also have a few laws stopping them from releasing stuff unclassified - and this presents opportunity to influence public discourse as its only real provider of news regarding the leaked information. It would be folly to ignore that option entirely.

    FWIW: I would neither be surprised to find that there has been doctoring, nor would I expect it to go beyond very subtle changes that aren't easily caught - the equivalent of changing two or three words in a post of this length. And then, they wouldn't occur often either: the act of self-limitation is how mastery shows itself, to mangle my Goethe, and Wikileaks is pretty decent at doing this thing, whatever your opinion of them.

    In non-WL news: there is to be an official Senate Vote on the FCC decision to roll back various net neutrality related rules. It's unlikely to go anywhere if it remains just party line voting, but this will at least provide ammunition.
     
  6. Sesc

    Sesc Slytherin at Heart Moderator

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    Wikileaks doesn't even need to doctor stuff. If you have ten documents of which three show what you want, you release those and not the other seven. Or the opposite, if you want to push the opposite narrative. There's enough material to go around on all sides because people are people, and the true power is not in the released stuff, but the stuff that isn't.

    Kinda reminds me of this wave of shoddy ph.d. theses by politicians we had here a couple of years ago. A collaborative effort by platforms went down to tear them apart and prove plagiarism -- which it was, in at least two (IIRC) cases (seriously, fuck those social "sciences" -- a ph.d. for comparing studies my ass, in real science that doesn't even pass as a homework) -- but they all were conservative politicians. Now no one in their right mind would argue that on average, conservative politicians would be more prone to plagiarism, but simply by the virtue of the political orientation of web activists, that's where the focus was.


    Also, talking about plagiarising. The original book's author likes this.
     
  7. Dark Belra

    Dark Belra Minister of Magic

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    Feinstein just released the 300 page document regarding the Fusion GPS testimony. 300 pages, so it's a huge amount to process but I imagine there will be news stories about this testimony. Some interesting stuff in there already. Apparently the FBI had an insider in the Trump campaign who was telling them parts of the Steele dossier before they got it.

     
  8. Johnnyseattle

    Johnnyseattle Unspeakable DLP Supporter

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    Holy fucking bombshell. Well done, ma'am.

    About time someone decided that both sides can play the same fuck-fuck games.
     
  9. Darth_Revan

    Darth_Revan Secret Squirrel Prestige DLP Supporter

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    On the contrary, bad move, Feinstein. The Trumpians will just take up the news cycle rage-tweeting that Obama and the Intel community were spying on Trump and were out to get him from the beginning.

    That does not help.
     
  10. Oment

    Oment The Betrayer

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    Perhaps I'm a tad too cynical, but this is different from business as normal... How?
     
  11. Darth_Revan

    Darth_Revan Secret Squirrel Prestige DLP Supporter

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    My point is that giving Trump and his ilk ammunition for willfully distorted misinformation is counterproductive.
     
  12. Invictus

    Invictus Totally Sirius

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    Basically like Tapper cutting of Miller. What did it accomplish but give them more fuel to their narrative? Ofc CNN has its own RESISTANCE Narrative so it smells like a cynical ploy to feed that, but still. You don't see things are on fire and then throw more fuel cause whatever.
     
  13. Darth_Revan

    Darth_Revan Secret Squirrel Prestige DLP Supporter

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    Arguably, it could be worse to give Miller a platform and an audience when you know for a fact he's spitting venom and lies, and therefore it's worse to let him continue to have that platform. The platform gives him a level of legitimacy he doesn't have a claim to.

    Reinforcing the Trumpian negative view of CNN doesn't really hurt anyone, because they're a lost cause already.

    But, I take your point. It really is a double-edged sword. You're dinged whatever you do.
     
  14. Oment

    Oment The Betrayer

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    Federal judges have told North Carolina to redraw its Congressional map.

    An appeal has been signalled to be filed, and I think there is one (maybe two?) case(s) about gerrymandering in front of the SCOTUS this term already, if I'm not mistaken. This (gerrymandering) could be an interesting story as the year goes on, I think - or am I completely wrong about that?
     
  15. Darth_Revan

    Darth_Revan Secret Squirrel Prestige DLP Supporter

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    There are currently three sets of gerrymandering cases wending their way through the courts. The Brennan Center has a good summary.

    --

    In other news, if you thought you'd had enough of Sheriff Joe Arpio, too bad! He's apparently running to replace Jeff Flake in the Senate in Arizona. My question: Is this good, because he's crazy and will lose, a la Roy Moore? Or, is Arizona that crazy?
     
  16. Invictus

    Invictus Totally Sirius

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    The problem with that is that aguarbly Miller's platform really isn't CNN. He has other places for that that actually have a lot more views than CNN like Hannity and co., Breitbart and shit. And again they invited him to talk and got him into their studios. They knew him and knew what he was like. They can't act surprised that a guy that wanted to run against teenage girls to prove his male superiority is anything but poisonous. Hell. He built his Fame by doing what he did at CNN from freaking high school.

    Seeing all that, CNN by inviting him, getting him on air and then cutting him they're giving him a lot more than just letting him rant or not inviting him at all. And CNN knew that and did it anyway because it also allows them to continue their own narrative. All it did was CNN keep claiming that somehow it's real journalism for RESISTING and let Trump shout to the winds with another example of how Fake News MSM is putting those like him down. An expected and unnecessary shitshow that benefits both parties but poisons the debate more.

    Maybe with all red states going somewhat crazy at least, Arizona is jealous or the crazy, what with Flake becoming sane and McCain being McCain.
     
  17. Darth_Revan

    Darth_Revan Secret Squirrel Prestige DLP Supporter

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    Usually politicians book themselves onto the shows, rather than get invited. Probably CNN asked the WH to provide someone to provide their side of the story, and the WH chose to book Miller on the slot.
     
  18. pbluekan

    pbluekan High Inquisitor DLP Supporter

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    I ... might actually argue this. I mean, politicians lie, almost as a rule, but in current US politics it has hit an almost absurd level. The Dems are not excused, to be sure, but their base tends to be less tolerant of baseless rhetoric. Most of what flows out of the mouths of GOP pundits and politicians these days is bullshit or distorted religious dogma. It isn’t even lies based in truth anymore.
     
  19. ASmallBundleOfToothpicks

    ASmallBundleOfToothpicks Professor

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    Arpio is probably a net positive for anyone not supporting Trump. I guess it depends on who he runs against, but I'm having a hard time imagining a politician that wouldn't be able win against him. Maybe a real dead fish, without even a hint of populism.
     
  20. Darth_Revan

    Darth_Revan Secret Squirrel Prestige DLP Supporter

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    @Xiph0 it's your lucky day. Darrell Issa announced he's not running.
     
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