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U.S. 2020 Elections

Discussion in 'Politics' started by momo, Jan 20, 2019.

  1. Oment

    Oment The Betrayer

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  2. tikkier2000

    tikkier2000 Third Year

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    Democrats winning in Indiana is not happening barr some kind of absolute certain catastrophe on Trump's part. I live in one of the most liberal cities in the state, and we still elected Braun instead of Donnelly, and mostly because Donnelly was in a lose-lose situation with the Kavanaugh confirmation. Living close to the Ohio border is its own ride, too. It feels like, comparatively speaking, Ohio is always on fire, and campaigning is going to be a mud-pit come 2020. But the idea of Indiana voting blue like it did for Obama in '08 is laughable. If you look at election turnouts in the last 100 years, Indiana goes red more often than Texas. Trump himself appeals to a lot of Indiana voters and Pence is a double-win: he isn't governor and he's VP. But mostly he isn't governor.
     
  3. vlad

    vlad Professor Prestige

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    Im not saying it will go blue. Im saying it is the reddest state in the lakes, *and therefore when it leans blue it signals a landslide election*

    As opposed to Iowa, which goes back and forth without really signalling anything.

    Edit: i see my syntax was confusing. I was pointing out trends in modern presidential elections in general, not making any sort of prediction to how they would vote in 2020.

    Fwiw, I currently put the 2020 line between Michigan and Wisconsin. Though I wouldn't bet anything beyond chump change against anyone putting it as far over as Ohio/Pennsylvania.
     
    Last edited: Feb 7, 2019
  4. Giovanni

    Giovanni God of Scotch

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  5. Psychotic Cat

    Psychotic Cat Death Eater

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    Sssh, no spoilers, the rest of us haven't read that far yet.
     
  6. Rah

    Rah Order Member

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    What are people's thoughts on the introduction of the green new deals outline by AOC and Merkley.

    I'm hoping it becomes a driving point in the dem primaries like M4A has (although some of the candidates are trying to back out of it and make it a fix for Obamacare, most likely because of Big Pharma lobbying).
     
  7. Agayek

    Agayek Prisoner

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    It's a nice sentiment, and would be nice if we reached it, but it's not really practical in a lot of ways. Frankly, it's simply too expensive, and even the additional taxes proposed by Cortes would pay for less than 1% of it all, so it's a bit of a pipe dream. I wish them all the luck in trying though, cuz it certainly can't hurt.
     
  8. Johnnyseattle

    Johnnyseattle Order Member DLP Supporter

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    Without a significant technological jump, it's just not going to be feasible due to expense. It's a great idea obviously, and something we should definitely strive for, but it's just way too nebulous an idea to get any real progress on. I mean, we can't even give everyone in America clean water, or fix bridges that have needed repair for years, or any number of things that a first world country probably should have done a long time ago. Best current way to move towards carbon independence is to make nuclear power more available, and paranoia has all but eliminated that as a possibility, for fuck's sake.

    It's the most American thing in the world, to speak all day long about what we should all be doing, and then continually make it more and more difficult and/or cost-prohibitive to be done and yet still wonder why people aren't doing it.
     
  9. Silens Cursor

    Silens Cursor The Silencer DLP Supporter

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    See, I see the 'simply too expensive' argument and then I see the frankly gross amount of military overspending on defense contracts and bailouts given to major corporations (and that's not even getting into some frankly gross tax exemptions given said corporations at both state and federal levels), and I'm left thinking that argument has some massive holes, especially if said green new deal is set to drive infrastructure development along the way anyway.

    For me this seems more like a question of whether there'll be the willpower to push past the massive lobbying effort to hamstring this deal rather than it just being 'too expensive'
     
  10. Perspicacity

    Perspicacity High Score: 3,994 Prestige DLP Supporter DLP Gold Supporter

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    The so-called Green New Deal is a non-starter as it is for many reasons: it's too much of an omnibus of socialist cruft hiding in the shadow of facing down anthropogenic climate change, the technology still needs development in many areas, it doesn't avail itself of market-based solutions (carbon tax) and technological approaches (lowering the entry for nuclear power plants) that would be effective today, and it's being pushed at a time when it's impossible to pass Congress, much less the President's desk, making it symbolism instead of substance.

    But it's a still a more worthy way to blow trillions of dollars than an F-35 program or our federally subsidized corporate stock buyback program (a.k.a. the Republican tax bill).
     
    Last edited: Feb 9, 2019
  11. Agayek

    Agayek Prisoner

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    I mean, if you can find the money, all the more power to ya. Carbon independence is a worthy goal, and I certainly wouldn't be sad to see it happen, but no matter how I run the numbers it doesn't add up. Maybe I'm just blind and missing something.
     
  12. Arthellion

    Arthellion Chief Warlock

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    There is a lot of waste in the military budget, but even if it was all cut out it wouldn't be enough to fix the issue.
     
  13. Rah

    Rah Order Member

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    The way I look at it,

    Either we pay the costs of climate change now by taking real action to stop the world from reaching the 2.0 C warming benchmark or we pay for it later in the 10s of millions of extra lives lost and the trillions of dollars in property and infrastructure damage that could've been avoided with earlier action.

    We go more into debt almost every year for stupid shit, this is something important enough that having to finance it through deficit spending isn't a real non-starter for me.

    Also it's not going to pass this year or next. But starting the conversation now is important, making it part of the public discourse before the primaries really take off will only help. Expanding the Overton window or whatever.
     
  14. Darth_Revan

    Darth_Revan Secret Squirrel Prestige DLP Supporter

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    The GND espouses some worthy aspirations, but it is short on actual solutions and high on costs.

    Two things that jumped out at me were the total lack of any idea of how to eliminate nitrogen pollutants from farming, and what to do about air travel. It mentions something about expanding high speed train travel, which I think would be great, but that's not really a solution for trans- or even semi-trans-continental travel, or trans-oceanic international air travel.
     
  15. Giovanni

    Giovanni God of Scotch

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    Drip drip drip.

    Just wait. Crazy Amy has thrown a lot more than binders at members of her staff.
     
  16. Invictus

    Invictus Half-Blood Prince

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    Washington Post also just did a piece skewering her.
     
  17. Oment

    Oment The Betrayer

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    I wasn't expecting the next chapter this soon.
     
  18. Arthellion

    Arthellion Chief Warlock

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    In politics, Giovanni writes his own fan fiction...and makes it real
     
  19. momo

    momo Seventh Year

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    "Crazy Amy" sounds like a nickname Trump would come up with, not gonna lie.

    That said, this one actually works.
     
  20. Stealthy

    Stealthy Seventh Year

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    More out of HuffPo on Klobuchar. Featuring a cameo appearance by Harry Reid, and some leaked documents.
     
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