Can Hagrid Copy Voldemort's Flying Trick?

Nefar · 09-29-2007, 10:56 AM

Personally, I don't think so, but how else to solve this puzzle?

Let's go all the way back to Harry Potter and the Sorcerer's Stone, paperback edition, page 63:

Quote:

Harry followed Hagrid out onto the rock. The sky was quite clear now and the sea gleamed in the sunlight. The boat Uncle Vernon had hired was still there, with a lot of water in the bottom after the storm.

"How did you get here?" Harry asked, looking around for another boat.

"Flew," said Hagrid.

"Flew?"

"Yeah - but we'll go back in this. Not s'pposed ter use magic now I've got yeh."

They settled down in the boat, Harry still staring at Hagrid, tring to imagine him flying.

Underline mine.

O.K., so Hagrid flew to the island; how? I'll list the known means of magical transportation:

Dragon
Broomstick
Flying Carriage/Motorbike
Carpet
Floo
Apparation
Portkey
Voldemort's Self-Levitation
Thestral
Hippogriff
Winged-Things-That-Pulled-Beauxbatons-Carriage

Dragon is ridiculous, there was no broomstick, carriage, motorbike, or carpet in view, Floo and Apparation and Portkey are not 'flying,' thestral, hippogriffs, and winged-things seem as if they would be crushed by Hagrid's weight, leaving...

Voldemort's Self-Levitiation. So please tell me what huge, obvious fact I am missing here, because it seems odd that a wizard who only completed three years of magical education should be able to duplicate magic that other wizards were in awe of, with a broken wand.

Maybe his coat pockets are magically enlarged to be able to carry broomsticks. Maybe, but in the quote above, Hagrid says he's not allowed to use magic anymore now that he's reached Harry. This implies that Hagrid is restricted from using his wand, not a magical appliance like a broomstick. If Hagrid was prevented from using magical appliances, using Hogwarts' staircase would be illegal for him. So in the quote above, Hagrid was using his wand/umbrella (probably with Dumbledore's permission), to reach Harry, and he's not allowed to anymore.

Hmm... Using a wand negates all the options on the list except for the instantaneous ways like Apparation, Floo, and Portkey, which doesn't fit with Hagrid 'flying,' and of course, V's Self-Levitation.

So how did Hagrid reach the the Hut on the Rock?

ip82 · 09-29-2007, 11:05 AM

Yet another canon inconsistency.

Remember, in book 1 JKR had yet to think of apparation and floo system. That's why Hagrid brings Harry on a flying motorcycle, he 'flies' up to Vernon's cottage, kids go to Hogwarts in Hogwarts Express and Dumbledore needs a whole day (or two) to fly to London on his broom (!!?).

You can either ignore these facts or use them in conspiracy theories (manipulative!Dumbledore profits much from these mistakes).

Nefar · 09-29-2007, 11:17 AM

Ahh, O.K. So it's just a plot hole. I can live with that.

Also, you are completely right about Dumbledore's day-to-get-to-London trip. I never thought anything was wrong about this. This really does help manipulative Dumbledore ideas.

skooly · 09-29-2007, 05:56 PM

Maybe Hagrid pulled a fucking Mary Poppen (spelling?) and flew there with his umbrella.

Evil Shnitzel · 09-29-2007, 06:16 PM

Hagrid cannot perform Voldemort-escue charm on himself because he has a giant's blood and therefore immune to the spell.
Maybe Dumbledore side along apparated him, conjured the boat and apparated out? Not likely..

Alexeyy · 09-29-2007, 06:33 PM

Quote:

Maybe Dumbledore side along apparated him, conjured the boat and apparated out? Not likely..

Yeah, and he brewed up the storm to mask his apparation.

Imagine Hagrid being really a refined gentle-giant, and only acting boorish on Dumbledore's orders. Come to think of it: he should be rich as hell, side benefit of living near Forbidden Forest.

Lecter · 09-30-2007, 05:08 AM

I dunno, Thestrals might be tougher than they look.

Lorelei of the Sea · 09-30-2007, 05:22 AM

I say thestrals. They're strong enough to carry the carriages with the students in them, and since we didn't hear anything about them after Harry and co. landed in the Ministry in OotP, then we can assume that they know to come back to Hogwarts when left alone. As for the wand, maybe Hagrid did us some sort of charm to make himself lighter. But if I remember correctly, didn't he say that he used magic to get the letters to Harry(don't have the books with me)? It could be that he just used it for that and used Thestrals for transportation.

My guess is that he came on thestrals, and maybe used his wand to make himself lighter/impervious to rain. He then released the thestrals to go back to Hogwarts, as you can't ride thestrals/anything else that flys in broad daylight without violating the Statue of Secrecy (we know it was a sunny day).

It was probably just a plot hole, though.

Philly Homer · 10-01-2007, 06:15 PM

If Hagrid can fly then Voldemort's flying ability seems less impressive.

I suspect it's a plot hole, because JKR didn't figure out Floo travel or Apparation yet.

The theory with Hagrid flying a thestral also makes sense.

DarthBill · 10-05-2007, 10:05 AM

I didn't know that apparation hadn't been thought up then. If that's the case, then how the heck did Dumbledore appear out of thin air on Private Drive?

Snarf · 10-05-2007, 12:08 PM

You know their are shrinking spells in canon, correct? If Hagrid can pull small human transfigurations (I.E. Dudley's tail which, while not comparable to Krum's shark head, is pretty damn good) then it seems plausible to me that he could ride a broom over, shrink it down and transfigure something into a boat or even enlarge a shrunken one before going in to get Harry. He's got tons of pockets, as is shown just a few chapters later in PS(SS), and it wouldn't surprise me if he had a shrunken down form of transportation in there somewhere.

vlad · 10-08-2007, 09:41 PM

Hagrid can't fly on a broom - in Deathly Hollows he simply couldn't, and apparently there was no way around that. Also, isn't Harry's accidental apparation mentioned in book 1? Maybe she didn't mean for it to be an actual method of transport back then, but apparition certainly existed.

Dark Syaoran · 10-09-2007, 05:23 AM

Quote:

My guess is that he came on thestrals, and maybe used his wand to make himself lighter/impervious to rain. He then released the thestrals to go back to Hogwarts, as you can't ride thestrals/anything else that flys in broad daylight without violating the Statue of Secrecy (we know it was a sunny day).

It was probably just a plot hole, though.

Definitely a plot hole but your idea works.

Quote:

Yet another canon inconsistency.

Remember, in book 1 JKR had yet to think of apparation and floo system. That's why Hagrid brings Harry on a flying motorcycle, he 'flies' up to Vernon's cottage, kids go to Hogwarts in Hogwarts Express and Dumbledore needs a whole day (or two) to fly to London on his broom (!!?).

Quoted for truth, hence plot hole.

Mr. Merriman · 10-15-2007, 12:36 AM

I prefer to think that Hagrid simply rode Sirius's flying motorbike, which is exactly how he flew at the beginning the very same book. And a shrinking charm shouldn't be too hard even for Hagrid, who managed to pull off some fairly impressive magical tricks with a broken wand and an unfinishd formal education. Of course, the motorbike could have an invisibility option or something similiar. Or perhaps Hagrid rode a very large thestral. ;P

(A pet theory of mine is that Hagrid has been tutored by Dumbledore since his expulsion, and is actually more magically adept than he lets on.)

Jon · 10-15-2007, 01:18 AM

Hey, they went back on a boat right? Hagrid flew over- so how did the Dursleys get back?

The-Hyphenated-One · 10-15-2007, 02:00 AM

Hey look another plot hole!!!

carvell · 10-15-2007, 03:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jon

Hey, they went back on a boat right? Hagrid flew over- so how did the Dursleys get back?

Who care's?

LT2000 · 10-15-2007, 12:57 PM

Vernon swam like the walrus he is. Goo goo gajoob.

09-29-2007, 11:05 AM	#2
ip82 God of Magic Join Date: Nov 2005 Posts: 2,899	Yet another canon inconsistency. Remember, in book 1 JKR had yet to think of apparation and floo system. That's why Hagrid brings Harry on a flying motorcycle, he 'flies' up to Vernon's cottage, kids go to Hogwarts in Hogwarts Express and Dumbledore needs a whole day (or two) to fly to London on his broom (!!?). You can either ignore these facts or use them in conspiracy theories (manipulative!Dumbledore profits much from these mistakes). __________________ IP82 stories: Potter's Resistance 1: Breaking Ties -> DLP Thread Yin and Yang -> DLP Thread Ficwad Profile \|\| HP Recycle Bin \|\| Crap filter C2 Rule no. 1 - You do not talk about Alpha Fight Club...

09-29-2007, 11:17 AM	#3
Nefar Seventh Year Join Date: Apr 2007 Gender: Male Posts: 260	Thank you Ahh, O.K. So it's just a plot hole. I can live with that. Also, you are completely right about Dumbledore's day-to-get-to-London trip. I never thought anything was wrong about this. This really does help manipulative Dumbledore ideas.

09-29-2007, 05:56 PM	#4
skooly Squib Join Date: Jul 2007 Gender: Male Posts: 28	Maybe Hagrid pulled a fucking Mary Poppen (spelling?) and flew there with his umbrella. __________________ Sticks and stones may break my bones But whips and chains excite me

09-30-2007, 05:08 AM	#7
Lecter Seventh Year Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Far away from you Age: 28 Gender: Male Posts: 266	I dunno, Thestrals might be tougher than they look. __________________ “Say you’re sorry. Say it!” said Potter as he thrust. “Beg for forgiveness,” more brutal thrusts. “Forgiveness for having killed everyone that ever meant anything to me: my parents, my godfather, Dumbledorrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrre!” was his last strangle words as he came.

09-30-2007, 05:22 AM	#8
Lorelei of the Sea Unspeakable Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Southern California Gender: Female Posts: 753	I say thestrals. They're strong enough to carry the carriages with the students in them, and since we didn't hear anything about them after Harry and co. landed in the Ministry in OotP, then we can assume that they know to come back to Hogwarts when left alone. As for the wand, maybe Hagrid did us some sort of charm to make himself lighter. But if I remember correctly, didn't he say that he used magic to get the letters to Harry(don't have the books with me)? It could be that he just used it for that and used Thestrals for transportation. My guess is that he came on thestrals, and maybe used his wand to make himself lighter/impervious to rain. He then released the thestrals to go back to Hogwarts, as you can't ride thestrals/anything else that flys in broad daylight without violating the Statue of Secrecy (we know it was a sunny day). It was probably just a plot hole, though. __________________ Sig by Cathal "God is a concept by which we measure pain." ~John Lennon

09-29-2007, 06:16 PM	#5
Evil Shnitzel Order Member Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Israel Age: 23 Gender: Male Posts: 424	Hagrid cannot perform Voldemort-escue charm on himself because he has a giant's blood and therefore immune to the spell. Maybe Dumbledore side along apparated him, conjured the boat and apparated out? Not likely..

10-01-2007, 06:15 PM	#9
Philly Homer Death Eater What you call elephant cum I call mouthwash Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Look at the name, it should be obvious. Gender: Male Posts: 559	If Hagrid can fly then Voldemort's flying ability seems less impressive. I suspect it's a plot hole, because JKR didn't figure out Floo travel or Apparation yet. The theory with Hagrid flying a thestral also makes sense.

10-05-2007, 10:05 AM	#10
DarthBill Avatar Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Texas Age: 26 Gender: Male Posts: 1,662	I didn't know that apparation hadn't been thought up then. If that's the case, then how the heck did Dumbledore appear out of thin air on Private Drive? __________________ Fear leads to anger. Anger leads to hate. Hate leads to suffering. You shall all suffer. Badges: Electric Grass Normal

10-05-2007, 12:08 PM	#11
Snarf Avatar Thunder! Thunder! Thundercunts! Hoooo! Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Forty-Six & 2 Age: 23 Gender: Male Posts: 1,776 DLP Supporter	You know their are shrinking spells in canon, correct? If Hagrid can pull small human transfigurations (I.E. Dudley's tail which, while not comparable to Krum's shark head, is pretty damn good) then it seems plausible to me that he could ride a broom over, shrink it down and transfigure something into a boat or even enlarge a shrunken one before going in to get Harry. He's got tons of pockets, as is shown just a few chapters later in PS(SS), and it wouldn't surprise me if he had a shrunken down form of transportation in there somewhere. __________________

10-08-2007, 09:41 PM	#12
vlad Avatar Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Georgia Age: 25 Gender: Male Posts: 1,792	Hagrid can't fly on a broom - in Deathly Hollows he simply couldn't, and apparently there was no way around that. Also, isn't Harry's accidental apparation mentioned in book 1? Maybe she didn't mean for it to be an actual method of transport back then, but apparition certainly existed.

10-15-2007, 12:36 AM	#14
Mr. Merriman Fifth Year Join Date: Jun 2006 Gender: Male Posts: 178	I prefer to think that Hagrid simply rode Sirius's flying motorbike, which is exactly how he flew at the beginning the very same book. And a shrinking charm shouldn't be too hard even for Hagrid, who managed to pull off some fairly impressive magical tricks with a broken wand and an unfinishd formal education. Of course, the motorbike could have an invisibility option or something similiar. Or perhaps Hagrid rode a very large thestral. ;P (A pet theory of mine is that Hagrid has been tutored by Dumbledore since his expulsion, and is actually more magically adept than he lets on.) __________________ "In the fell clutch of circumstance I have not winced nor cried aloud. Under the bludgeonings of chance My head is bloody, but unbowed. Beyond this place of wrath and tears looms but the horror of the shade. And yet the menace of the years, finds, and shall find me unafraid." -from Invictus, by William Ernest Henley

10-15-2007, 01:18 AM	#15
Jon The Demon Mayor Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Australia Age: 23 Gender: Male Posts: 4,437 DLP Supporter	Hey, they went back on a boat right? Hagrid flew over- so how did the Dursleys get back? __________________ FFN Profile \|\| Patronus

10-15-2007, 02:00 AM	#16
The-Hyphenated-One Dark Lord Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Seattle Age: 24 Gender: Male Posts: 1,191 DLP Supporter	Hey look another plot hole!!! __________________ 4 8 15 16 23 42 Harry Dresden-Wizard When an Underscore just won't cut it

10-15-2007, 12:57 PM	#18
LT2000 God of Magic Join Date: Jun 2005 Gender: Male Posts: 1,923	Vernon swam like the walrus he is. Goo goo gajoob. __________________ If I died and went to Hell, it would take me a week to realize I wasn't at work.

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