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Complete Path of Decision by lulu42 - T - HP/Sandman

Discussion in 'The Alternates' started by Vorpal, Sep 14, 2008.

  1. knothead

    knothead Groundskeeper

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    One thing I can say having read all of your published story thus far is that you do the unexpected, and it's working.

    Another thing I can say is that you're not afraid to kill characters. I was a bit surprised you killed Sirius; that being said, it's difficult to manufacture in Sirius a purpose, or a continued reason for existing, without taking the story away from Harry.

    Very good job thus far.
     
  2. lulu42

    lulu42 Second Year

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    Thanks. I delayed it so it would have a little more shock value. I ended up with some fairly entertaining reviews because of it.

    I feel so lame every time I write in my story thread, but this needs to be said. Next week's chapter is a mind fuck.

    Stay tuned... ;)
     
  3. ChuckDaTruck

    ChuckDaTruck Overlord

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    Cool. I look forward to it.

    SPOILERS ABOUND THIS REVIEW!

    THINGS REVEALED!

    DO NOT READ!

    LAST CHANCE.

    FINE.


    Frankly, you kind of pussied out on Sirius's death. Also, I don't mean 'pussied' as an issue of femininity, as guys can be pussies just as easily, but as common vernacular for 'not going the distance.'

    I mean that you didn't show his death and, more importantly, Harry's reaction. For a dude who frequently deals with death, and Death, Harry certainly hasn't experienced much loss. I'd like to see how he handled it. Also, Harry finally got caught with pants around his ankles, and I'd like to see how he handled THAT as well.


    And the issue of writing here: Don't feel lame for writing here. C'mon! Look at all the other authors who post here! I can't think of a reason not to respond. It gins up your fans, so you get more readers, it gets you more criticism so you can "improve" as a writer, assuming that's the goal; and if you eventually write an original work, you'll have readers with a personal connection as it creates a dialogue. And you get quick feedback.

    The only reason not to respond is ego. Either you don't want to acknowledge that people are actually talking about and reading your story, writing which you make public, as a means to avoid some self-imposed pressure on yourself, or you feel "lame" because your idealized version of yourself is telling you that you shouldn't discuss your work in a casual way; i.e. as an actual human being hunched over a keyboard typing, and burdened with the doubts, self-recriminations, etc. that we all have.

    We all like it, or we wouldn't review it. Personally, I have now literally spent hours reading it. Now get over yourself.

    "Next week's chapter is a mind fuck."
    1.) Definitely didn't need to be said. ;-P


    BTW, can we get more Endless? I particularly like the bits where you overlap HP history with Endless lore. I'm thinking the Mirror of Erised thing you did and the guy who worshipped/attempted to eradicate Despair, inadvertently creating Dementors. There must be one for Destiny in there. A Seer who could read his book or something?

    Also bring Morpheus back. That guy has been left dangling like a porn star's cock after he's tested positive for HIV. What's up with his sand?
     
  4. lulu42

    lulu42 Second Year

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    Hmm... when I said lame, I meant whore-ish. Sorry about the mix-up.

    And I tried writing Harry reaction, but there was one major problem. Nothing's there. As you pointed out, he has familiarity with Death, it's easy for him to compartmentalize those emotions. He's taking the logical route and saying that everything will be fine.
    In other words, he is still numb.

    Remember, my Harry's is an emotional retard. It takes him a while to catch up.

    And I'd like to put more scenes with The Endless, but I couldn't think of anything. I only do it when it makes sense, and I haven't been able to find any good connections in the past few chapters. I did most of them already, and there's a few more I've reserved for the seventh book. Actually half of the seventh book is veering in Sandman territory more than HP anyway.
     
  5. ChuckDaTruck

    ChuckDaTruck Overlord

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    Could you incorporate some of the endless into this book (if it makes sense)?

    We're halfway book 6 anyway...What's half a book amongst friends? :-D

    I think Destiny could step in. Harry's issue with trying to be in charge at all times, etc, could be manifested by Destiny. That dinner scene in Sandman where he provokes Morpheus kind of deal.

    I still don't buy it regarding Harry's reaction; you could have shown him being an emotional retard. Also, you could have posted in work by author or something for feedback. Although, Work by Author reluctance I can understand as it makes it difficult to measure the popularity of your work. But in terms of notes, it generally works.

    Either way, an imperfect attempt would have been better than nothing. Harry the "emotional retard" didn't really get conveyed clearly, and the reader was left to draw his own conclusions regarding the death.
    In concrete terms, what we readers got is essentially "Harry grabbed the bezoar. List of things that came to pass, which could have prevented this moment of choice. But Harry chooses Nott." Why Harry chose him, how Harry felt about his choice, and his immediate unguarded feelings afterward all are unaddressed. You allude later to Azkaban for Sirius, but its well after you've given up momentum, and certainly out of immediate moment of impact.


    I'll give my shitty example-
    "After the Bezoar was shoved down Nott's throat, the boy began coughing. Slughorn spun his wand, causing the spared Slytherin to sit up, as he turned to Sirius. Harry steadily backed into the corner and watched his Godfather sputter and gasp his last. Slughorn, kneeling by his side, closed the final Black's eyes. "He's dead," whispered the rotund professor. Harry nodded sharply; "I'll tell Dumbledore," he intoned. And then he exited, leaving Death to take his closest confidant by the hand."

    Not perfect, but eh...and it shows Harry as detached.

    Brevity is fine as a stylisitc, but it seems you didn't make a choice. It gives us no context otherwise.



    That said, story's quite good. Generally, I don't expend this much energy on any fanfic, so in that regard, you're well ahead. Kudos to you and your tale.

    So...regarding not writing Harry's (imperfect) reaction to death? I don't buy it. I think it was an oversight. Which is fine, for the record. After all, the larger purpose of this exercise of fanfiction is for you, the author, to improve your storytelling skills and writing ability.

    But you gotta look mistakes in the eye and be willing to learn for that process to work. Otherwise, you're just looking for gratification and fan approval, which certainly has some merit as well. But a person cannot do better next time if they won't acknowledge what went wrong this time. It was a critical moment for your protagonist, and a major event in terms of story and character. And you skipped it.


    My desire to see more Endless is just a fanboy request. Do as you will.

    Although, I'd like more. :)
     
  6. lulu42

    lulu42 Second Year

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    I'm doing an Endless dinner in book seven. I have no idea what's going to happen though.


    I will admit that I tried writing the chapter, blanked on what to do for the scene and cut to the cemetery because it was easy. I will also admit that my knowledge of future chapters gave me a huge blind spot. I consider the ramifications of Harry's actions very carefully, and knowing his character led me to cut away.
    But it's not an oversight.
    Like I said, Harry reaction was boring.
    But Harry wasn't the only one in the room, and there is another individual's perspective that is far more interesting.


    Ugh... why must you be so smart? Why can't you be like most people and accept that my ending was super special and tragic and oh my goodness poor Harry having to chose?

    When I feed you a red herring, your supposed to eat it dammit!


    (BTW, I laughed that you described Slughorn as rotund when uttering such depressing words.)
     
  7. Jeram

    Jeram Elder of Zion ~ Prestige ~ DLP Supporter

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    Hey, it was tragic all right - tragically tragic in every way. Or maybe it just seemed like you were TRYING to make it tragic. But maybe I'm just reading too much into it. I found that the most interesting parts of the chapter was the rest of it, the Sirius bit just seemed slightly tacked on. Maybe if Harry had any kind of emotional connection to either Sirius or Nott, it would be more impactful. This way, we (the readers) can easily believe Harry would make such a cold, clinical choice and save someone he has a debt to.

    And who told you Slughorn was rotund - that was SUPPOSED to be a secret!

    Still, I liked "most" of the chapter. And I don't know about the Endless bit - they wouldn't work if just shoved in randomly, but I'd prefer if they made sense integrated into Harry's story.

    -J
     
  8. lulu42

    lulu42 Second Year

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    Okay, so now that chapter 44 is up, I'll 'fess up. I write this story out of order, and 44 was the first of book six that I wrote. After that, I did the scene with Destruction and chapters 42, 39, 40.

    By the time I actually got around to writing 43, I completely failed to realize my readers didn't know I would return to the death scene in the next chapter. Apparently you aren't in my head. Oops.

    I was really amused that I was called out on it. I wished I noticed it before I posted the chapter, I might have ended it at a different point.

    I always viewed 43 and 44 as a two part chapter. I was highly tempted to name 43 the second dance of desire pt.1, but I changed it to There Can Only Be One. Mostly because I couldn't resist a Highlander reference.
     
  9. ChuckDaTruck

    ChuckDaTruck Overlord

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    "“Wait… I think… You weren’t YOU. I, mean, you are you, but not the you that I was talking to. The YOU from the future.”

    What’s going on? Is it another of those weird things like the assassins… Delirium puts her hands on her face, and peers out from the gap in her fingers"

    Chapter 32

    Well done, you did wrap it around nicely. Took a bit to get there, and definitely could have set some of it up in the prior chapter (nothing to lose at that point. Desire next to Sirius or something...)

    Otherwise fine. Ollivander's response when Harry gets a wand makes sense now. (I had forgotten it entirely).

    Eager to see Harry's big moment of choice that is coming. He's hell bent on tracking down Sirius Killer. That's a pretty dark goal/wish/whatever.

    Regarding Sirius in the past, I was wondering what has happened to all of Harry's powers that he got from the assassins (in terms of heightened senses, intuition, and "focus," and "ability to blend"...

    Last, as I was re-reading it seems that the story has shifted directions for something of a loss.

    Character development of Harry with his group, Harry's struggle with his values, etc. Ron was once picked as the "most treasured," for Second Task. What has happened to Blaise and Daphne? He took her to Yule....And Cedric, who has graduated? Is Harry still talking to him?

    The plot is moving more quickly, but a lot of character development and issues have been lost, thus losing the stakes for Harry's character.

    If I had to mark where this shift happened, I think it happened in book 5 when you started jumping around.

    Otherwise fine. Chapter to chapter is generally good. Its losing the big thread of character development sometimes. (I forgot entirely how close Ron and Harry used to be...) Yeah, you move around whilst writing (as most do), but we travel it like a highway...

    I am curious what Harry could do that would change/destroy the Endless....

    EDIT: Nicely done with this, but focus on telling a good story. Don't get me wrong, and it filled some (self-made) plotholes, but it wasn't strictly "necessary." I'm sure if you hadn't thought of it in the beginning you could have Harry get away some other method (escape, mission gone wrong, encounter with a "wizard" etc.

    These kinds of gymnastics can work (and I think worked here), but telling a really good story that progresses, resonates, and has weight is hard enough. That's really all that HP really is, and the first Sandman.

    That said, well done.
     
    Last edited: Mar 27, 2009
  10. lulu42

    lulu42 Second Year

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    Signs your fanfiction is way too complicated:
    A reader quotes one of your chapters and you don't recognize it. (I seriously had no idea until I saw Delirium's name. That's so pathetic.) :(

    Harry's abilities aren't from the assassins, they are from the Endless. His understanding of human nature lets him win where others would fail. That and he has a perfect sense of time. I'm going to put more of that in book 7 because I've been waffling on it.

    I only had that idea that it was Sirius sent back by a member of the Endless, but I had no idea why or which one it was. I went back to the chapters and was really relieved that I kept everything vague enough that I could work with it. Otherwise I would have skipped this chapter, it doesn't really detract from the storyline because Harry will never know. It only fills in some background for the reader and is an example of what the Endless can do for those who don't understand.

    And I completely understand what your saying about Harry's character development. I made book three heavy in that regard so it wouldn't be a pressing issue in later chapters. And I always plan to have a scene with Harry talking to a friend to show that he's not living in a vacuum.

    And I intended for Harry explain how to Apparate to his friends, and have this warm fuzzy moment, but it felt... wrong. His character feels a bit too aloof for that right now, so I had Harry speak to Phineas instead. I suppose it has to do with with his knowledge of Hallows and Horcruxes. He assumption that his friends need protection is keeping him away.

    (narrows eyes)
    It's kind a freaky how you mention things that I'm intending to bring up the next chapter.
    And I'm rather pleased you care so much to nitpick.


    BTW: Sirius' deal with Desire created the story you've been reading, because it brought about Harry meeting the assassins and continued exposure to the Endless. If he kept his silly little promise to himself, the story would be canon.
     
  11. ChuckDaTruck

    ChuckDaTruck Overlord

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    Yeah. I'm good like that. ;)


    That was not clear at all. I assumed that if Sirius had never gone back, Harry would have been raised by the Assassins. The Endless started shaping things when Harry was a child, from Lily's death.

    Also, regarding Harry teaching apparating due to Harry's motive of protecting his friends...These contradict each other. If he wants to protect them, he'd teach them some skills, right?

    Hallows makes more sense, and it feels like you're setting Harry up to walk a dark road. Dark Desires (deliberate reference to Harry's Desire for retribution for Sirius's death, and Desire the entitity). Essentially it feels like he's starting to succumb as he grows more isolated and distrustful.

    Chuck
     
  12. lulu42

    lulu42 Second Year

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    The Endless were present, but they did nothing that changed the scene that occurred in Halloween night. If it weren't from Death's POV, you wouldn't see the Endless, and the scene would have looked the same. The change only comes around when Harry meets the assassins, and the only reason they met him is because Desire had to make Sirius needed.
    Because Sirius is a fairly useless character in canon.

    Anyway, you can think it another way if you want. This story is flexible. Hell, I didn't even come to the idea of canon vs. Path until after I posted the chapter. It caught me by surprise.

    Did I mention half of the stuff I write only works because of sheer dumb luck? :p

    Harry assumes his friends will eventually learn to Apparate, and they do know defensive skills. But Harry isn't too keen on them knowing about Horcruxes and Hallows because that's a more active role than he wants for them. Unlike canon, he doesn't really talk about it, so his mind is a bit preoccupied.

    Book 7 is...unplanned. I have the chapter titles, so that shapes some of the content, and I know the last four chapters, but leaves about six that need to be filled. I'll probably need to take a small break to figure out what the hell I'm going to do.
     
  13. Memory King

    Memory King Order Member DLP Supporter

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    I personally thought the Time Loop Effect rather obvious, but I'm also a big sucker for Time Travel and weird things.
     
  14. Demons In The Night

    Demons In The Night Chief Warlock

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    Updated.

    Holy shit what a chapter. Totally did not see that coming. Epic.
     
  15. JoJo23

    JoJo23 Unspeakable

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    Truly epic. I wonder what Harry will do now? I assume he will leave Hogwarts.
     
  16. Anya

    Anya Harley Quinn DLP Supporter

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    Great chapter. Did not see that coming.
    Five stars *****
     
  17. Iskalri

    Iskalri Squib

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    I loved this chapter
    One of the best ones, actually
    The chapter managed to surprise me, it really was an unexpected twist
    I don't think I have ever seen that one before
     
  18. lulu42

    lulu42 Second Year

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    Mwahahahahahaha!
    (so that's you know, coming along.)

    Actually, I'm sort of surprised by how many people were shocked. My story ends up roughly at the same place that the books do every time, it's the journey that is different. I thought someone would have predicted part of it beforehand.
     
  19. Memory King

    Memory King Order Member DLP Supporter

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    That's probably the reason for disappointment being a knee-jerk reaction sometimes, but that quickly changes when I've thought about events a little more, or reread the chapter in question.

    I offer you my congratulations for managing to make Dumbledore's murder epic once again.
     
  20. knothead

    knothead Groundskeeper

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    Wow. Beautiful.

    I think this has to be the best Dumbledore murder scene in a fanfic, ever. I'm also trying to think of a better canon character death in a fanfic, and I can't think of one.

    If Harry has a second son (if he decides to have children), he'll name him Albus Draco Potter? Who'd have thought it: Draco Malfoy-- probably the bravest man who ever lived.