I feel like the scum narrative here is dC painting himself into a corner and deciding to just go with the genuine town response of "idfk what I'm doing, why are all of you town, everything sucks, etc"?

---------- Post automerged at 04:51 PM ---------- Previous post was at 04:51 PM ----------

Welcome to my world, dude.

 

Or, yanno, because I found some additional context that I'd overlooked. Like what happened to Regfan, where he hard townread me for my reaction to Zen then decided scum have no daychat and scumread me for it instead.

 

It's just how often this is happening that's bothering me.

 

Okay, but WHY am I choosing this narrative? Like, as I made clear earlier, if I'm scum I've been setting myself up for exactly this endgame. Right down to killing Vaimes overnight when I could be sitting in Vaimes/Stanari/dC/blab world and coming out of the gate on blab instead (side note: The Vaimes kill is the obvious "get dC mislynched" kill. Yeah ok wine but it's a pointless risk for me to take when I'm already on such thin ice). So I guess the first question you gotta ask is why I think this endgame is more winnable than that one. Because ultimately if I'm scum I CHOSE this endgame over that one.

And in response to "but you hard townread blab yesterday", why did I do that as scum??? Like, I bought into "blab/Miner are never scum together" because I like clearing townies? That narrative makes sense if I was forcibly painted into a corner by events outside my control, but you're essentially saying I've invoked hard mode on myself in a game that was ALREADY going pretty poorly.

Like. Simple question: If the scum narrative is dC painting himself into a corner, then why did dC do that? I don't think I got any in-the-moment benefits from anti-aligning blab/Miner and doing all the other crap I listed earlier.

also I've settled on blab as the last scum b/c of the stuff I said earlier, so you're not even all town any more :v

---------- Post automerged at 10:08 AM ---------- Previous post was at 10:06 AM ----------

Meh? I fail to see how this is a problem. Like, ultimately it comes down to I am (or was) V reading everyone but that's manifestly incorrect, so some of the things I'm taking as towntells are actually scumtells, and I'm not sure which because if I WAS I wouldn't be taking them as towntells!

---------- Post automerged at 10:11 AM ---------- Previous post was at 10:08 AM ----------

(well, actually scumtells or nulltells, but whatever)

 

Okay so I need you to very clearly tell me one more time who you think the last wolf is and why and why it isn't the other two people.

 

One of the things that bugs me about blab is that D1 reads on him from within the townbloc are pretty solidly town and the only scumreads are from within the scumteam. I need to check to see if I missed some transient/post-readlist scumreads from town but this is kind mmm.

 

Last wolf is not you because of the whole gladiator fakeclaim thing and high interaction weight. I believe the phrase "quadruple hyperbus" came up at one point. Don't have much beyond this, but both these points are strong by themselves. In addition, I feel like you most amongst the three not-me people could easily claim a win by just driving a lynch on me and have no need for the actual consideration put into today.

Last wolf is not Stanari for a few reasons:
- Weight of interactions, not as heavy as yours but things like sticking it out on Cobalt from an early point are important
- Having that chart from D1 that she posted earlier, she could go to the effort of falsifying it (or have built it D1 as scum), but why? Her position was already fine, and that sort of excessive display is not a hallmark of comfortable scum.
- The whole thing where the scumteam goes on about deepwolves. On reflection, you are correct in that they just don't draw attention to this if there actually IS a deepwolf.
- The main reason I was even considering Stanari is that I kept running into town!blab shit, which I am now questioning. Otherwise there was a townread here for general interaction and feels.

Last wolf is blab partly by PoE on the above, and also for the following:
- Low activity, in what could be strategic silence (uncertain on this point)
- Proposing a lynch chain that appears to cause him to lose, but then in fact reevaluates when Miner flips scum (see also: making detailed towny looking plans for if a scumbuddy flips town is a good tactic because it'll never actually happen)
- Proposing a townbloc that appears to cause him to lose, then abandoning it in short order
- Linking Miner/Reg and trying to lynch Miner first in ways that don't make a lot of sense i.e. proposing Reg 4scum and Reg/Miner 5scum and then lynching Miner first (obvious motivation: get Reg mislynched while bussing Miner, who is doomed)
- My town content on blab has largely been "silver bullet" based, which so far has led me to townread Cobalt and scumread Reg. Thus I suspect it was me fucking up for a third time.

- This, assuming it's true.

---------- Post automerged at 10:35 AM ---------- Previous post was at 10:33 AM ----------

oh also I just never felt particularly good about blab. pie's argument for blab being town was that his content wasn't PURPOSEFULLY low-impact, but I think it has been low-impact and most likely either purposefully so or due to scummy mindset (i.e. what impact does scum even want to have on the game?)

---------- Post automerged at 10:39 AM ---------- Previous post was at 10:35 AM ----------

But yeah so tl;dr blab because the reasons I had for him being town fell apart under increased investigation (whereas the reasons for Stanari/Fable town were only ever discounted as "I have to be wrong about SOMEthing, and it might be this")

 

That was a bit more detailed then I was expecting.....

*sigh*

Fine I'll read blab AGAIN.

---------- Post automerged at 09:05 PM ---------- Previous post was at 08:54 PM ----------

Rereading this, not really seeing how dC goes from townbloc to lynch him after miner?

blab

Clarification please?

---------- Post automerged at 09:08 PM ---------- Previous post was at 09:05 PM ----------

Shit we have under an hour to figure this shit out.
Stanari

Where's your head at right now?

 

Fable isn't EoD tomorrow??

dC you can't just quote me posting interesting things without analysis and expect me to take that as a case.

 

Is it?

Hold let me double check.

 

Every few hours I make up my mind to lynch dC and then dC posts and I feel doubt again is where my head is at, tbh.

 

IT IS! \o/

 

I tacked that on at the end when it appeared in preview :V. I was also more focused on answering Fable's question than building a case (distinction being it was why I internally read blab as scum, not necessarily a concerted effort to convince others), and that interesting thing IS in fact interesting

also rereading those quotes I missed his second set of lynch plans but it's notable that they at no point include lynching blab if Miner flips scum.

 

Okay dC explain why the quoted behavior in question is scummy!

 

Uh, because scum tend to be more alert for scumbuddies fucking up so they can hop on and bus before town notices (and may in fact pick up things town will NEVER notice or that only look like fuckups if you know blab is scum ahead of time), and because it's a pattern that indicates TMI on the part of blab's buddies knowing he's scum and therefore if they're trying to read the game like a townie would they'll naturally bias towards scumreading him?

I mean I assumed you knew that and it's why you were pointing it out :v

On an absolutely basic level, scum all behaving differently around someone compared to town implies they know something about them the town doesn't, and the only thing that makes sense for that in this context is that they know blab is scum. The specifics are interesting but almost irrelevant, as ESPECIALLY if they don't have daychat the entire team congregating around scumreads on a random townie just makes less sense than congregating around scumreads on an actual scum.

---------- Post automerged at 11:24 AM ---------- Previous post was at 11:23 AM ----------

EBWOP: goddamit I missed an opportunity to say "that interesting fact is, in fact, interesting"

 

I toneread this post town when I read it (specifically the second paragraph?) but now I am Reconsidering.

Also, something something people having weird progressions on me.

---------- Post automerged at 06:34 PM ---------- Previous post was at 06:25 PM ----------

Yes, but, also there are reasons that could be +town.

 

Could you elaborate on those? I'm not seeing them. In particular, the conventional wisdom that scum don't bunch up on a town wagon would seem to preclude scum all throwing scumreads at the same town player...

 

Um.

Something something trying to push back on townreads to make mislynches? I didn't think about this too hard so maybe not.

 

Yeah, while I agree that happens I think usually only one or two scum do it on a given player at a time. There's a natural aversion to being seen together too much, and if the mislynch actually HAPPENS the end result is a bunch of them (if not all!) end up getting busted.

 

It's not the whole scumteam though, it's literally Cobalt and briefly Miner.