okay so
yeah

If we direct the Hunter at a specific player, either they're scum and Demons protect them or they're town and Angels protect them. I...think that makes that pointless? It eats up SOMEONE's protect but eating the Demon protect is only useful if we get another protown kill successfully aimed at scum which seems like kind of a high bar. Then as Kai says, we have a survival on our hands that we don't know what to do with any more than we did previously.

If NEITHER group protects then the target dies. Assuming we've forced a claim and gotten either "no claim" or "claim we still want to kill" this is essentially another lynch which is the best outcome. If the target has claimed something that moves the kill off them though, this is bad. Like, I'd rather have them get run up normally tomorrow and survive an extra night than be forced to claim today.

So I guess it's a balance of "target is scum or unimportant town" vs. "target is important town"? Which...is pretty close to a bonus lynch, yeah. I think Kai is right in that we 100% lynch anyone who survives, which if we take that tack ALSO means Angels won't blow their protect.

Oh! And actually, we can do something like "Angels protect ONLY if target is holy" in which case we lynch 100% of survivors who don't claim holy (and scum that claim holy risk being busted by Inquisitor/CC as usual).

 

One of the reasons I wanted Spiritualist to reveal is because if Mal was specifically EW, Agents should probably always reveal because LWs automatically joining Coven will probably happen?

?

Pretty sure I wrote that earlier. I did want everyone's input on this for a reason...

If agents are town by everyone they should also reveal because no way in hell are they getting picked, lmao, unless you are going for deepwolf wine.

You can't obliterate someone as Agent unless you think that Conspirator is coven and even then, for them, it's a 50/50...

.... Imagine if Agents just outed at gamestart. That would be hilarious. I want to play a short phase game of that so that I don't have to endure in a world where It's Bad.

(More 50/50s in this setup. We found the real CoinHunt, guys!)

Citrus - Process of Elimination is also mechanics.

...

.....

.......

*stares.*

Actually, there IS a world with one dead Agent and (any) Witch Conspirator that would obviously be bad here.

So Agents should only claim if they're both still alive if they think that the Conspirator is a witch.

... but then Coven would probably know regardless of their roles, anyway. In a 2-scum Coven world, this is. Not great.

Actually, never mind, this could be bad. Agents probably shouldn't claim unless they want to YOLO and see what happens.

 

The last page just looks like wordless screaming to me.
Vaimes why'd you move off owner and onto Jarizok after saying... like, nothing I can remember about Jarizok and calling owner all but confirmed witch at start of day?

 

Yeah I don't know what the best play is here.

Like, I guess 'treat it like a second lynch' with the following process is probably best

1. pick someone for the hunter to shoot
2. that person claims if they're a person that wants to claim (then repeat 1 for someone else, if time permits)
3. if they didn't claim, then hunter shoots them and Angels NEVER PROTECT THEM
4. If they die, then they were town, and if they live, then we have to lynch them and they're 'probably' scum.

 

How about we just let the Hunter rock and roll and lynch/shoot wolfy people until the game ends.

Sounds a lot cleaner.

 

Yes I like this actually. Theoretically we're throwing the onus on the Angels in bad worlds where we're saying "hey with all your info, if you guys think it's the correct play to use the one-time use protect, go for it we believe in you", and with them having more info I'm ok with trusting them to make the right play. Assuming they're keeping up with the thread, but between dyachei + rubicon at the least I feel pretty good about them being up-to-date

 

<3 Newcomb.

 

Either this or the one dC proposed. The one thing to be careful of is we have to decide on either "Angels don't protect unless it is 1000000000x the right call even though we're gonna be paranoid as fuck" or "Angels we don't care if we're shooting the priest with 2 true guilty checks DONT protect". Personally would prefer the first scenario (aka if they REALLY think it's the right thing to do, then go for it)

 

Still convinced that optimal play (for town!hunter) is Never Shoot...

Kai. Your theory of process contains holes.... I think. The same hole that's the reason why I'm advocating for never shoot.

 

If that was the typical plan, then we might as well just play vanilla town vanilla scum

 

bonus points: the first person we pick is the hunter.

 

Ironically, Hunter would have to be one of the roles that should claim in that scenario

---------- Post automerged at 10:29 PM ---------- Previous post was at 10:26 PM ----------

Any REVEAL roles should reveal in that situation. Scum!REVEAL would likely use it anyways, Town!REVEAL needs to to not waste and lose it.

Claim: Holy, Assassin, Hunter, DoB, Loose Cannon, Spiritualist

Don't claim: PT, Pagan, Inquisitor, Ranger, Conspirator, Butcher (Zealot is taken, UT is a scum!scrub)

You'd have to sell me on any of the DON'T CLAIM people, but I think all of the CLAIM people above should claim? Actually I think that's true of for general lynches imo (except Hunter)

 

To see what would happen / prevent stagnation.

p much

 

I would toss Fortune Teller into the don't claim pool also

 

Hunter only gets one shot.

Also no your proposed plan should be to get Hunter to claim and then lynch them :V

To clarify, I think Angels protect SPECIFICALLY if they think we're shooting holy. Holy players have a bunch of safeguards to make fakeclaiming them harder and are powerful enough that scum basically have to kill them immediately (possibly excepting Acolyte?), which means they can claim holy tomorrow and then scum have to waste time killing them. If a scum is rescued by Demons and fakeclaims holy, then the scum will most likely end up busted anyway at this stage in the game.

Anyone else though I don't think they should bother saving and I think we should pre-commit to lynching.

Elaborate on your worst-case worlds? I think town!Hunter does not shoot unclaimed players, so...

...hm. Could just get them to shoot Fable. He's definitely not holy and is probably scum and if he IS town is unlikely to survive to halftime anyway.

Anyway, if we don't pressure a claim out of anyone then that's a de facto "no shoot" order I think is the status quo here.

 

Even Newer Current Votal Because Thanks, Fluff:


owner (5): citrus (#2759), silvercrys (#2791), jarizok (#3132), weiyaoli (#3155), his fluffiness (#3174)
jarizok (4): dichotomousCreator (#2918), owner (#3102), newcomb (#3106), vaimes (#3172)
vaimes (1): fable (#2798)
beruru (1): miner (#3075)
citrus (1): kaiDASH (#3079)

Abstaining (1): beruru (#2756)

Beruru descending order votal is ugly, should put from largest to smallest wagons. Also you need to put your vote somewhere.

What do people think of the 2 leading wagons rn? t/t vs. t/w vs. w/w?

 

I don't want hunter to go off because if we're in four-witch worlds, the game could be over.

Is that clear enough for everyone?

I also feel like directing like that is bad and oh my god we're all going to die :facepalm

Vaimes

Give thoughts on everything. Please?

 

No, roles are good, they spice things up, they add variety and they add limited but confirmable information which is also good.

When it snowballs like this, though, it's like. Subjectively it's the most boring thing in the world for me personally. I play mafia to Figure People Out, for the moments when you look at their mindset and just... see it.

And objectively, it just completely bogs the game down and lets wolves coast. Like, anyone could wolf pretty easily in the environment. It wouldn't be hard. Town wins when you make it too hard for wolves to fake. How are you making it hard right now?

 

Angels would only know who the priest is, so to keep holy!obfuscation we have to keep them grouped in the CLAIM set. Or else we have to say the Bishop + Acolyte should claim, and the Priest should NOT claim. But then the demons 100% haunt the priest and the priest can't be protected again. Meaning we might as well have the priest claim with the claim group.

tl;dr all holy's should be part of the CLAIM group, so that doesn't even apply.

I think kai's plan is best, where we set a CLAIM and NO CLAIM groups. Whoever we want the Hunter to target either said CLAIM or NO CLAIM. Then we determine if we want to narrow it down further or not from there (ex: if you're holy we want you to now post "HOLY", etc.)

 

What happened?