Such a great movie and we're wasting most of our time discussing a ten seconds scene. It was bad, but just as Stark and Strange eventually were hit with reality checks, Shuri will have her turn.

Speaking of her, since we haven't seen Shuri dying or being caught by Thanos' minion, she probably was able to run off with Vision's database. We can assume he'll be making a comeback in Avengers 4.

 

You can't ignore valid criticism because a disgruntled comment is also thrown in -though in no way the main argument. Or you can, but it's a stupid thing to do.

Similarly, a character you like being black and/or female doesn't make them invulnerable to criticism because 'oh my god you're saying the scene was bad you're totally sexist and racist'.

As for some people not having valid reasons; no fucking shit. Someone might dislike her for the shape of her eyebrows. That doesn't instantly invalidate everyone else who's giving solid reasoning as to why her scene was disrespectful and badly handled.

 

But you can ignore that I do offer a valid counter argument to critics of the character and keep only focusing on the racism and sexcism. I’ve said in every post that some people are making valid arguments on why they dislike the character. I’ve responded to those and offered up my own reasons why I liked the character. Republic you’ve said literally nothing concerning that. In fact you brush it aside just to say that I’m brushing it aside, which even if I agreed with you and I don’t because I’d like to think I’m making a kinda rational argument, it’s just the pot calling the kettle black. You don’t want to talk about perceived racism then focus on my other comments. Talk about how the technology of wakanda isn’t enough to put Shuri in the level of Banner and Stark. Do as other posters did and make the comparison that Shuri didn’t have to put in as much work and has to stand on the shoulder of those before her.

Being black or female is no reason to defend a character, unless those things specifically are being mentioned and targeted. And if literally saying that society won’t let characters talk back because she’s a black female isn’t just a little bit racist then call me Toby.

 

Thread about a two and a half hour movie: spend pages discussing a 10 second scene.

Seriously, the way everyone is obsessing over what, two lines of dialogue, is insane. I didn't even bother to think back on that moment until I went through this thread.

With that said, I'm going to go with "damn right she's smart enough to know things they don't." Wakanda is the most advanced civilization on Earth by far, Shuri would have gotten the best education in an already advanced society, and all that tech just so happens to revolve around vibranium, a magic metal practically non-existent outside of Wakanda and what Vision is made of. If anyone could figure out a solution right away, it's Shuri.

And honestly, the way everyone is nitpicking about this one quick interaction instead of the actual movie is kind of insane. There were things I liked about it, and there were things I didn't like. Shuri talking back to Banner is neither of those things.

 

I honestly think that's all fine. She could have been less of a dick about it, though. Point isn't that she knows what to do. I, personally, am fine with that. It's just that the feeling of a proverbial, "Bitch please," delivered to Bruce Banner felt insulting to a character people have a very soft spot for. She could have sounded competent without being condescending.

 

Bruce wasn't emasculated because some girl talked down to him for a few seconds, it was because his character was treated like shit the entire movie. Hulk got beaten like a red headed stepchild by Thanos, Bruce's reunion with Natasha was relegated to a pithy one liner from another character, the aforementioned scene with Shuri, and then him tripping and slamming face first into the ground while in the Hulkbuster. He doesn't have a single moment of real competence or agency throughout the film. It's a superhero film where one of the superheroes was relegated to being just some dude, and his one area of actual competence being used as a prop to show how another character was better at something. As for the bonus points bit, I included it primarily because that's what @bonnerr2 was fishing for without stating it directly. It's not about me, it's about how some people will feel the need to attack Shuri regardless, just as some people will feel the need to defend her from any criticism by crying racism and sexism regardless. The inevitability of the defense is what most of the people referencing it were mocking because any criticism was always going to be interpreted as such. It's simply the reality of the current culture war.

 

In other news, I was spared by Thanos. Chance is in my favor. I'll see the rest of you poor souls in the sequel.

 

Honestly I agree with you on Banner's incompetence throughout the film, though I wouldn't call it emasculating. That gives this idea that he's become less of a man because he can't use his abilities and gets nervous when seeing Natasha again, which give the man some credit he hasn't seen a human female in a couple years at least. Interesting theory I saw on reddit though is that Banner will have his time to shine in A4. There were clips of Hulk himself fighting in Wakanda and since it wasn't in this movie some people think he will appear in the next one having overcome his demons and finally gotten some measure of true peace. In light of that it kinda explains some of his actions in this movie as the Russo's wanted to bring him down for a triumphant return, I just don't think the Shuri scene was part of it. I wouldn't say that Vision is his area of competence either. If he were powered by some type of Gamma Radiation or something within that sphere I might be able to agree, but Banner has no connection to AI or Vibranium technology. Also agree that no matter what Shuri is gonna be a tense issue in the modern political climate. The idea that she has to tear Banner down to prove her competency doesn't help those arguments because it's one of the base fears of those who are targeting her for sexual or racist reasons. She and Banner have entirely different specialties and their competency in them does nothing to bring the other down.

 

Damn. I was slain. Also they put the result of the initial coin flip in the cookie, so reloading will give you the same answer until May 3rd of next year, which is the release date of the next one. Very nicely made.

 

Don't suppose any of you guys watch Agents of Shield? (It's gotten a heck of a lot better since the first half of season 1). The last three or so episodes of the current season is a tie in to the movie and I'm wondering if any of the main cast will get snapped away.

There have even been rumored sightings (There might be pictures but I'm not sure) of the cast on the set of Infinity War Part 2. Considering Clark Gregg's reincursion into the movies, it's a very real possibility.

 

I watch the show but I haven't seen the last 4 episodes, gonna catch up soon.

 

??? where

 

He will be in the upcoming Captain Marvel movie which takes place in the '90s.

 

He's gonna be in Captain Marvel. Granted, the movie is set before his death but one can hope. Plus, him being involved with whatever happened with Captain Marvel explains events that occur in late Season 1 and early Season 2 of the show.

 

Why don't we all agree to kill the Shuri discussion right here. It's pointless and going nowhere.

Pretty much a given that Fitz or Simmons, and Mack or YoYo will poof away in the season finale. By the law of happy couple abuse. All of the minor chars will probably go poof too.

 

What would you do to improve the film?

First of all I was a bit miffed that the whole plot of Thor Ragnarok except Thor losing his hammer and Loki getting the Tessaract again was made pointless by them all being killed. At the very least make it more interesting, and introduce Thanos' minions a bit more since two of them seemed to be pretty much interchangeable.

So, I'd start off again with the distress signal, but show the Asgardian defenders getting ready to defend ship while Loki is shitting himself and trying to get Thor to run away with him. Have the viewpoint following Thor around, and then when Thanos and his troops breach the ship Thor gets knocked out immediately with one backhand from Thanos. Then you have the brief glimpses of the fight while Thor goes in and out of consciousness. You'd see more of the brutality of Thanos with the defenders dying in an awesome way, including Valkyrie trying to get civilians to an escape pod and Hulk trying to protect her but getting beaten down casually by Thanos and being forced to watch Valkyrie die, making it more understandable that Hulk is hiding.


Another slight underwhelming feeling I had was with the last big battle and the hordes of monsters. The usefulness of the characters varies a lot. Some were useful against the hordes like War Machine napalming dozens at a time whereas others like Cap were just mobbed. I'd be tempted to split them up a bit, with some of them facing the horde and others splitting up and going into an enemy spaceship to fight a multiple types of enemies in the corridors of the ship- you could still have huge corridors to have clear shots but against fewer enemies they'd stand out a bit.


Thoughts?

 

I generally agree with the opinion that killing the Asgardians off-screen was ridiculous, but this:

wouldn't work very well. Even without a weapon, Thor should at least put up a bit of a fight before losing.

 

I second the Thor bit with the beginning. Infinity Wars really went out of its way to make Thor Ragnarok pointless, and doing something as simple as showing some of the Asgardians getting away would make a big difference.

I'd also propose having a major character die (for real) outside of the beginning with Loki and Heimdall. Seriously, other than them all the "dead" good characters are all but certainly going to come back to life in Avengers 4.

 

For some reason, I was under the assumption that Thanos only killed half of the Asgard survivors (As is his modus operandi) and the rest he let escape on an escape shuttle. If there is a Thor 4 (Try saying that with a lisp) then it will most likely be Thor trying to reunite and rebuild Asgard. Or, my personal headcanon, this would how Thor gets written out of future movies. When someone asks why Thor can't help with whatever crisis, they'd just say he's too busy rebuilding Asgard.

I dunno about Fitz and Simmons They've both taken a hiatus for the first halves of seasons 3 and 5 so they may not do another. Plus, perhaps it's the romantic in me but I really don't want to see them separated again. My guess is probably Coulson (Because of what he's currently going through) and Deke (Because of the whole Future thing and Skye needs to make up for not meeting her quota of dead boyfriend) and one of Elena or Mack, most likely the latter

 

How i'd make infinity war better.