You I wasn't attacking Zenzao. I was presenting you with my take on one of his posts and asking what you thought about it. It's a good way for me to read into alignment and it's more interesting and relevant and helpful than if I just say "what do you think about Zenzao". I was townreading him at the time that I made that post, even though I thought he had done some scummy things.
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I'm sad you think I'm treating you like I was that game. I feel like I asked so much of you that game and didn't give enough in return but I don't feel like I've asked very much at all this game and in giving a lot in return.

One sec
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I misread your post, I just realized you said I might be playing like that game, not that I am.

What I would like for you to understand is that my game has changed a lot since we played together the last time.
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I misclicked.
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I don't think it will work if you are trying to read me by old meta. It's totally fine if you think I am weird this game. I probably am? I've been waiting to roll town for months now because I have so many things that I've been working on internally and I want to put them into practice.

Also I'm playing from work so my thoughts are kind of scattered and it's hard to keep a track of everything and reply to everything properly. I can't really do quotes on my phone and everything is a bit harder. So it just means that I might be a little different and it's understandable to notice that and be worried about it. It doesn't mean I'm scum though.

Also, I talked a lot about my scumread on you but it's really weak. I don't even know if I am anymore. All my reads are weak right now, is super early, and they will probably look a lot differently by the end of the phase. My only strong read is Tammy town. But I prioritize you, my read on you and interacting with you and everything else, because it's you and I care about you in this game more than most people.
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@Zenzao you never posted this?

It can't be 132 because you responded to stuff that happened after this quote in that post.
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Why and what does that mean?
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So I don't think any of these are actual things and I think Cobalt is better than this.

He doesn't actually say anything about why my omgus thing with You was scummy. That's not even reasoning.

He is forcing a w/w read between me and lulz because I pushed on Vaimes but it doesn't make any sense if lulz is my partner. If I was trying to break down Vaimes' read then I wouldn't have been trying to understand him and asking him to elaborate on his read and I wouldn't have ended up liking him afterwards, I would just discredit him or ignore him or something. Also I don't understand how he could possibly read me pushing Vaimes as defensive. Also also I didn't say Vaimes was lock town anywhere.

And he just ignores everything else I have done and has nothing to say about it.

It looks to me like he is pushing a narrative to accommodate his reads. I don't think he is trying to read me or understand me at all.

His lulz read is the same.

I see town do that in RVS all the time and there are obvious reasons why town would do it (because they are lazy, because they want to amuse themselves, because they haven't made up their mind, because they want to see how people respond, etc.).

I don't see how missing posts is alignment indicative. That is ridiculous.

The third thing is just describing things that lulz has done and making them seem bad.

I don't think he is real but I would appreciate other perspectives. I don't have more time to talk about this sorry.

Vote: Cobalt
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Oh yeah I remember another reason I voted Vaimes. I didn't like the way he is just going with what everyone else is saying and not putting original stuff into the thread. His "tough pill to swallow" thing about lulz is kind of where I started properly reconsidering my townread I think. He feels a little bit sideline-y.

 

Mean this:

I read this as a scum case on ZenZao. All the words are scumreading words. But it was ignoring the context that it was post 4 so his behaviour was probably just being silly. By word games I mean using lots of jargon and pretty words to make everything shiny but focusing on meaningless stuff. But now a bit below I can see you saying that in this post you were townreading ZenZao and in the post before this one you said you were townreading ZenZao but this post with this scumcase that was trying to get me to say ZenZao was scum, it didn't feel like a real scumread. It felt wrong and then I remembered the conversation we had about how you were more tryhard as scum too so I thought you were doing the thing where you accuse someone of something you yourself are doing so then nobody can call you on it.

And this is really frustrating because I read the post again and I can't see anywhere how I was supposed to understand that you were writing a scumcase about a townread or understand why you would do something like that. But I remember you did it in Ari's game so it's null I guess. But it feels like having the rug pulled out from under me trying to understand what you think.

that was before. I hate having to say this but all meta of me from before last September is meta about a person who has abilities that I don't have reliable access to anymore.

deal. I've changed too. we both changed.

I care about you too. It's okay to be different and busy and more scattered. Quotes are hard, I agree.

I thought someone was buddying me a bit earlier but i don't remember who.

 

Yeah, Gemma's the other wolf in this game with lulz. That's a wrap folks.

 

This was something else. I wanted to quote this before but it's too hard to do on my phone.

This reminds me so much of how Vaimes talked in his previous two scumgames here. It feels so forced and one-dimensional. It's early game but he's talking about a read like it's really strong and the thing he is reading from lulz is really not very alignment indicative at all.

He is basically saying that lulz deserves to be lynched just because he called someone out while voting a different person. It's more nuanced than that but not by a lot. I don't think it makes sense as reasoning for the type of scumread he is displaying here.

So Vaimes if that is a real read then please explain how you are reading into it in the way you are because I don't see any work there, I don't understand why you think that is alignment indicative, I don't understand why you think it is so scummy that there needs to be a lot of weight against the scumread to pull you off it, I don't understand why you haven't engaged with lulz about this and instead just went straight to "the sentence is death". I don't understand any of it.
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He wasn't being silly, though. He said straight away that he was serious and he's maintained that the whole game. I don't understand why you think he was being silly when he has said that he wasn't?

About the rest of it, that makes sense. Thanks for explaining. I don't really like playing scum anymore so I'm not very tryhard as scum. I was scumreading that post from Zenzao, not a lot but enough to have things to say about it. But overall my read on him was a townread. I thought there was no way he could be real when he was making such bizarre posts but then he kept making them so I started to think that he might be real after all and actually believed in what he was doing. Then I started to townread him a bit.

I'm sorry that was confusing. You hadn't talked about Zenzao or anything that happened there so I wanted to try to get your thoughts on what happened. Usually when I want that from people I provide my own thoughts and ask them what they think of it all, so that's what I did. I didn't like the opening but I changed my mind about him later. That didn't change how I didn't like the opening, though. Does that make sense?

Ok. I'll keep this in mind. Thanks for telling me.
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"and actually believed in what he was doing" - he actually believed, not me. Just to clarify.
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Let me know if you actually want to talk at some point.
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Newcomb probably feels extremely stupid for ever townreading me in Princess mafia right now.

 

I know that's what you said and I believe you that that is how it is from your perspective but that's not a thing I usually have any trouble with at all as scum; it was caused by reading comprehension stuff. You say "I don't scumread you for A but for B" but A caused B and A looms large in my mind.

I didn't want to argue it then because well you were right about me so it doesn't matter that you got there via wrong reasons. But it matters now because I'm town and you're saying I sound just like I did that game so I latch onto the only thing in common between those two games which isn't my alignment.

But, you know, maybe you're right about what you saw and you're just expecting too much of me too early but you'll come round when you see how my reads develop once I start being able to tell people people apart in my mind.

I'm sorry for taking it personally. There probably isn't a way to talk about previous games with me that I won't take personally, but do it if you need to.

 

I keep reading old pages and posting from there then later refreshing the page and when I refresh I see Tammy's post and I get so excited because I think Tammy has posted something new until I realize that it's just Tammy's old post.

 

I'm not Nacho. If I say something like that, I'm not playing or joking or trying to purposefully manipulate. If I do it when I'm scum it still means you're pushing a real button. It means something like "you don't have to change your read but if you can, can you find a different approach?" Anyway, I'm sorry for lashing out and hurting you.

 

I don't think I was expecting too much from you. Just expecting different things. And it's fine to be difference of course. I'm different too.

I was just reminded of that from your post to Tammy.
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You may have taken my read to be more than it was because of Ari's game. I was scumhunting you but I wasn't gearing up for a push on you or anything. I was just talking with Tammy about how I felt about you so far.
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@fontisian ily

 

STOP DISCREDITING ME. Look I get you’re pissy you got caught. Scum do that all the time, but stop discrediting me and that right read.

 

will you fuckers stop posting walls of text my eyes are literally just sliding off the page at this point

also no-one asked me why I wanted three votes it was for you/lulz/vaimes shame on all of you

I'm off to bed bye

 

Tammy please calm down.
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Tammy what are you thinking right now?
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I'm about to sleep but would you like to talk with me for a bit? It sounds like you need to vent a bit and sound out your thoughts/feelings.

 

And this is completely manipulative nd unfair by the way.

I don the think you have reading comprehension problems. I think you perfectly well are capable of understanding the words people are saying. It’s incredibly unfair for you to tel me that I’m not allowed to read you based on how you interpret and narrate your responses based on a game that is textual and is how you read nd write.

Fair to tell me not to read you based on activity, fair to tell me not to read you based on emotion, fair rot tell me not to read you based on length of posts.

Not fair to tell me not to read you based on what you say in the game based on what other people say.

 

Do you complain about walls as either alignment?

 

And I don’t want be awake right now, I still have a headache and am annoyed and trying to go back to sleep.

 

Tammy please, I can assure you that you has reading comprehension problems sometimes. Even if I didn't know that about them, it's against the rules to lie about real life things for a game benefit. I won't comment on the rest because it's between you and you and it's not helpful if I butt in but I don't think it's very nice to call them a liar about that.
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Hugs. I hope your headache goes away and you can sleep. I shouldn't be awake either.

 

Because it would ruin the thing if he says it's fake? This one game, RC faked a Super Serious 100% Scum For Sure read on me from page 1-40 when we were both town because he wanted to ~get reads~ and see what would happen to the game state and see who would jump on. It was pretty awful to be on the receiving end of but let's pretend for the sake of argument that jumpstarting the game in this fashion is a legit way to get reads: if you turn around on page 3 and say "nm i was just being serious for the lulz" then that kills it too early? ruins what you might've got out of it? Page 40 was leaving it way too late because it turned into a noisy slog but for the duration of RVS and then just going on from there with Even More Seriouser Serious Reads once you have them? sure. admitting it's a ploy would ruin it so when he said he was Super Serious For Reals I was like "yeah ok but it is still early so of course you are keeping it going."

In short: I thought he was lying about his level of seriousness but not maliciously so.

okay, that makes a lot more sense. thank you.

I just didn't really have enough of an opinion to post about. seemed like a competent player, one who wouldn't get caught out on page 1, moved on.

ok. this time something about the way you did it felt like trying to lead me in a direction rather than ask what i thought, like asking me a question and telling me what the right answer was so that's part of why i reacted as strongly as i did. i'll try to remember this for next time.

yeah, it makes a lot more sense now. thanks for explaining.

 

Well I only asked you what you thought, and then provided my opinions. I don't understand why you thought that was a leading question, leading questions happen when people hide their thoughts and I was completely transparent.

 

I complain about walls when I'm too tired/drained to parse them. I guess theoretically it could be a scumtell if scumplay is draining me? But it could also be the reverse.

 

I didn’t call anyone a liar.

 

Okay, I misunderstood your post then, sorry. I thought you were implying that they were lying about having reading comprehension problems.
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You should do the sleep thing and then catch up tomorrow and provide thoughts on everything.