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Doctor Who

Discussion in 'Movies, Music and TV shows' started by Heleor, Apr 12, 2009.

  1. Solfege

    Solfege Chief Warlock DLP Supporter

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    Catching up on this season. The Rosa Parks episode would be touching if the team's efforts weren't all so pointless. Parks didn't spontaneously refuse to give up her seat --- it was a premeditated event by the NAACP, MLK and fellow church leaders who had their flocks ready to mobilise the Monday shortly. If not this bus, then another bus on another occasion.

    Enjoyed Vinette Robinson's performance though. Didn't recognise her from Sherlock.

    ========

    Quite liked episode four. A suitably unintuitive monster, Doctor in command. Took her a bit long to realise the petien was after energy sources, seemed obvious. Very nice conundrum design overall, very good episode for the children too.

    ========

    At this point I find Whittaker inhabits the Doctor wholly. A generic Doctor to be sure, with all the flaws you guys pointed out, but the Doctor nonetheless. One who's having an understandably extended length of identity discovery. I wait for the moment she feels comfortable imparting her own unique mark.
     
    Last edited: Nov 22, 2018
  2. Joe

    Joe The Reminiscent Exile ~ Prestige ~ DLP Supporter ⭐⭐⭐

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    I think Whittaker is a great Doctor.

    I also think they're playing it safe with her.

    Which is a detriment to the idea of shaking up the character. They're giving her such safe stories, giving her such safe hurdles (such as the sonic failing most episodes this season). It's like they don't dare give the 13th Doctor a defining moment.

    I'm hoping by the season finale she'll be face-to-face with the Dalek Overlord or something, but it just seems they're sacrificing story for cinematography, which I have to admit has been brilliant.

    I know it's a new writer, but I feel like they're ignoring... most everything. Maybe that's for the best. The Rosa Parks episode - previous Doctors would never have stood for the racism. They would have rightly shamed the racism. It felt like they had to restrict the Doctor for the payoff of non-interference on the bus. Sixth episode, demons in Punjab, was fine with great characters and beautifully shot...

    ...but they're doing the same thing. The Doctor, who is meant to help where she can, was reduced to a spectator. Things had to happen as they did. Which is fine occasionally. 9th, 10th, 11th, 12th had to watch events unfold as they do, but it seems like the majority of this season has been passive.

    That episode with the giant spiders was a fucking travesty.

    Latest episode was good - the evil alien robots were actually the good guys, but it suffered from the same flaw. The story would have played out roughly the same without the Doctor's intervention.
     
  3. Sorrows

    Sorrows Queen of the Flamingos Moderator

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    Not to mention poor Kira, who after an episode of connecting with the gang and being tragically adorable, gets murdered by the good guy machine. Does the Doctor care? Like hell does she care, apparently the poor AI was just trying to show George what pain felt like by murdering innocent people (rather than just offing the dude actually doing this since apparently it can do that.) She doesn't even miss a beat before chalking up Kiara as a nessisary sacrifice.
     
  4. Daedros

    Daedros Seventh Year

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    It's even worse, to be honest, because 'chalking her up as a necessary sacrifice' isn't even given enough weight for you to realize a choice was made. If the Doctor had actually come out and said "Her dying is sad but also it had to be done" that would be terribly out of character, but at least it would be a strong showing of something. Instead, the Doctor comments on Kira's death the same way you might comment on a baseball game, a bland description of the way something happened with no acknowledgement of her own agency in the situation.

    This first chunk of episodes was written almost entirely by Chibnall, if I understand correctly. Maybe other writers will actually do something materially interesting with the Doctor's character in the remainder of the season. Fingers crossed, anyway. But if they can't manage to give her powerful character moments, this series is going to be the blandest NewWho has seen yet.
     
  5. Shinysavage

    Shinysavage Madman With A Box ~ Prestige ~

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    This, basically. At no point so far have I felt like she's not the Doctor, but she's not had that defining moment yet, for better or worse. At this stage, I'd probably say that about the series as a whole; I did think the Rosa Parks episode was really good, but other than that it's all just been good, nothing special but never anything bad either.

    I did enjoy tonight's episode; again, not a great episode, but pretty fun, a little spooky, based around a cool idea and a couple of decent guest performances, even if Cumming campy approach felt a little out of place at times.
     
  6. KHAAAAAAAN!!

    KHAAAAAAAN!! Troll in the Dungeon –§ Prestigious §– DLP Supporter

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    Thoroughly disliked the mud people episode. Crappy effects, silly plot, and Cumming was so over-the-top theatrical he broke my immersion every time he opened his mouth.

    This and the spider episode were probably the weakest so far.
     
  7. Heleor

    Heleor EsperJones DLP Supporter

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    Strange. This felt like a early series RTD episode to me. Cumming fit perfectly from that perspective.

    This was a forgettable episode, like most this season. So far nothing's been terrible-terrible, but nothing's been above-average either. Mostly just a boring season, which I guess isn't the worst they could have done.
     
  8. Sorrows

    Sorrows Queen of the Flamingos Moderator

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    Felt like Blackadder dropped into my granny-drowning episode. Almost got whiplash from the tonal change.

    It was not terrible or anything, I liked the concept of the mud-corpses, they are really trying to stay away from scaring the kiddies, so many ways they could have a made those hide-behind-the-sofa scary.

    Still waiting for the Doctor to get a defining moment. Was going through netflixes collection of nu-who with my brother and we could point to at least one episode per season that was genuinely great, not had that yet this season and that's a shame. She feels like the Doctor-by-committee, rather then the role handed over to a talented actress who can make it her own. It feels like the BBC have taken this bold new step but were so worried about killing the golden goose they have carefully sanded off any new interesting edges the character might have found in this new shape. The result is a decent embodiment of the ideal of what the Doctor should be, but without any of the flaws that made him/her interesting.

    She's bland. There's no rage or wrath or grief or pride or superiority or irreverence or sarcasm or weariness or pain. There's just a little loneliness and a bit of insecurity (but even that's not allowed to tell us much about her.) Where is the depth?

    Considering the rumours that Chibnall is already fighting with the BBC and next season might be both cut to 6 episodes and be the last for both Jodie and him she might never actually get to make her take truly great. That would be a damn shame for the first female Doctor.
     
  9. Shinysavage

    Shinysavage Madman With A Box ~ Prestige ~

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    I thought that was much more like it. A big, actual SF concept, weird as it was, some big emotional moments, a creepy monster, some laugh out loud lines and even what looked like a quarry!
     
  10. Heleor

    Heleor EsperJones DLP Supporter

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    That went in a completely different direction than I was expecting. Definitely a stand-out episode!
     
  11. Shinysavage

    Shinysavage Madman With A Box ~ Prestige ~

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    And a pretty decent finale to wrap things up before the New Year special. It wasn't a massive surprise to see Tzim Sha back again, but it was fairly effective, especially in the scenes with Graham, and there was a nice sense of tension building up through the first half of the episode. Second half was a little less interesting, all space magic technobabble, but it all revolved around a couple of cool ideas, so I won't complain too much (although I did keep thinking that they were saying Uggs when they were talking about the Ux, which was an odd image.

    All in all, I think they've done a decent job of laying the groundwork for the 'fam' and 13, and I quite like the general idea of the series, broadly standalone stories focused on more emotional themes than alien monsters, even if the execution hasn't always been there; a series of consistently fine if never quite great isn't a bad result. I just hope the next series has a bit more oomph to go with the ideas.

    Edit: Just seen that there won't be a series in 2019, but there will be one in 2020, definitely with Jodie Whittaker and presumably with the companions, depending on how the special goes for them I suppose.
     
  12. Rhaegar I

    Rhaegar I Death Eater

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    As someone who only started watching Doctor Who several months ago just so I could be all caught up before the new season, I was fairly disappointed. It isn't terrible per say: I liked Whittaker way more than Smith, Graham was a surprisingly good companion, and there were some decent episodes here and there (the Rosa Parks and Punjab episodes in particular).

    But it suffered from not being particularly memorable: it never quite reached the heights I'm used to seeing, and even the lows were never so bad I actively hated them. Whittaker isn't exactly the most active Doctor, and other than Rosa Parks and Punjab I was rarely that interested in Ryan and Yasmin. The villains were usually either boring or outright ridiculous. And unlike previous seasons, there was absolutely no overarching conflict to deal with.

    For the season finale, it had all the usual qualities I expected from the season. Graham's the only interesting companion, I do not particularly care for the villain or his evil plot, and the Doctor doesn't do all that much. Which is a shame, because I'm used to the season finale being a defining moment of the seasons, with dangerous baddies, threats to destroy the world/universe, iconic lines, and so on. This one wasn't even a two-parter!

    All in all, I'm going to be cautious about the Christmas special. I've made it a habit to avoid Doctor Who previews, so I haven't the faintest idea what's going to happen. And for all I know, this will be Chibnall/Whittaker's Growing the Beard moment when their run begins to improve. It certainly can't get much worse.
     
  13. KHAAAAAAAN!!

    KHAAAAAAAN!! Troll in the Dungeon –§ Prestigious §– DLP Supporter

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    The series finale was much MUCH better than the last several episodes. It had Ryan and Graham go through some real emotional growth (Yaz continues to be a bit of an 'afterthought companion'), and Jodie had some good Doctor-y lines. That said, the plot was not anywhere near interesting enough for a finale episode, and the Stenza / Tim Shaw are just overtly boring antagonists.

    Pretty disappointing season overall. Hoping they get some better writers pronto.
     
  14. Heleor

    Heleor EsperJones DLP Supporter

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    Hm. The New Year's special was a fine riff on one of the classics of the first season of the new series, but it still felt like there was something lacking.

    I didn't care about Ryan's dad at all. Basically any scene with him I checked out. And six people on the Tardis was spreading the attention a bit thin.
     
  15. Shinysavage

    Shinysavage Madman With A Box ~ Prestige ~

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    It did feel like the movie adaption of that episode, yes. I enjoyed it though, for the most part - the last ten minutes or so induced a few eye rolls, but nothing too bad by the standards of the show. And I felt the character moments were some of the best of the episode; the cafe scene was very well done, IMO.
     
  16. KHAAAAAAAN!!

    KHAAAAAAAN!! Troll in the Dungeon –§ Prestigious §– DLP Supporter

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    It was passable. UNIT being closed due to budgetary reasons made me chuckle.
     
  17. Rhaegar I

    Rhaegar I Death Eater

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    So I had the brilliant idea to watch all of classic Doctor Who. I just finished Pertwee's Third Doctor run, and boy do I have some thoughts on it:

    1. Color! I didn't realize how much I missed it before. Although does anyone have any idea how many British homes in the early to mid 70s actually had color televisions? How long did it take before people watching the show in color was actually the norm?

    2. Now that I've spent ten seasons with the older style credits, made with the camera pointed at its own monitor, it actually made me appreciate the newest opening credits all the more. I grew strangely fond of it, and now I think of the new credits as a glorious update to the older ones.

    3. I was not a fan of the UNIT era. Everything about it just felt wrong, no longer Doctor Who. The Doctor working with the military over a long period of time, staying almost entirely on Earth, even that ridiculous car Bessie and the even sillier WhoMobile, it all rubbed me the wrong way. We didn't even get to see in the Tardis for over a season and a half! At its best, there were hints of a proto-Torchwood, but even that just reminds me of how much that part of the show's history had very little to do with the show and Doctor I know and love. UNIT in small doses is perfectly fine, this was not. And yes, I know the show did it to help save money, but that doesn't mean I have to particularly care for it.

    4. Ironically, despite my feelings towards UNIT, I love Brigadier Lethbridge-Stewart, now one of my favorite Who characters ever, Old and New. He was the perfect straight man for the Doctor, the one person I could possibly buy having any real control over him. Hell, anyone who can make a line as silly as "chap with the wings there, five rounds rapid" come out as badass as him earned his place as one of the show's finest characters. I think Sergeant Benton was an amazing background character, if that makes sense. As for Captain Yates, he was just awful in every way, even before he randomly betrays everyone in that dinosaur story.

    5. Liz was a wasted companion. She only appeared in four stories, never got a chance to do anything, and was never given the chance to say goodbye. Jo was a bit dense, but she was a pretty good companion who got the best goodbye for any companion since Susan. And after only one season of Sarah Jane, I'm already a big fan and am eager to see her in the Tom Baker years.

    6. Ah, the first Master. He started out quietly menacing at first, but the show overused him really quickly. It got a bit ridiculous how he kept showing up every story in a season, and his schemes and plotting became less and less impressive overtime. And I know the actor who played him, Roger Delgado, died in that accident and Turkey, and it sucked both that he died so tragically and he never got a proper goodbye in the show. Apparently, they were planning on having him sacrifice himself to save the Third Doctor in the later's last story, which would have been pretty cool. But in any case, now I'm just curious how the other Masters will compare to him.

    7. To be blunt, I didn't like Pertwee's Doctor. Too mean, too arrogant, and so conservative I've read two separate blogs refer to him as a Tory. Considering how there were no less than two stories (The Curse/Monster of Peladon) that were partly about why the UK shouldn't join the EEC (which became unfortunately relevant today thanks to Brexit), I kind of agree with that verdict about the Third Doctor. The fact his outfit is suspiciously similar to Austin Powers doesn't do him any favors for me either. Maybe it's just because I'm against his era as a whole, or he came right after Troughton (my favorite Classic Doctor so far), but at the moment he's my least favorite Doctor, both all the New Doctors and the old ones I've seen so far. Congratulations Matt Smith, I now hate Pertwee's Doctor more than yours.

    8. I'd have to say my favorite episode was Carnival of Monsters, followed by The Three Doctors. My least favorite would have to be The Monster of Peladon.

    And now, Tom Baker. I've been looking forward to him for ages, since he's considered the best Classic Doctor of the bunch. And as he had a seven year run, he better be just as good as everybody says.
     
  18. Rhaegar I

    Rhaegar I Death Eater

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    So I just finished The Talons of Weng-Chiang, and can someone explain how on Earth that incredibly racist story was ever considered one of the best episodes of Classic Who?

    Yeah, it had its moments. And I'm always a sucker for period episodes. But the way they consistently treated Asians was so mind-numbingly awful that I was more than a little relieved when it was finally over. Everyone (including the Doctor and Leela) referred to them in a consistently bigoted and dismissive manner, bringing in plenty of Chinese stereotypes (from the whole Fu Manchu aspect to a freaking opium den), none of the Asian characters being remotely interesting characters other than evil bland Asians. And that's not to mention how the most prominent Asian character is literally a white guy in yellow-face, which only becomes more noticeable and uncomfortable every time he's on screen with an actual Asian actor.

    And do you know what the best part is? This was Hinchcliffe's last Who story. Afterwards, he was fired from Doctor Who thanks to a lovely ratbag of a woman named Mary Whitehouse and her one-woman crusade against Doctor Who (and anything else that offends her delicate religious sensibilities). I never even heard of her until now, but the more I learn about her the more I think she has what the Germans call a backpfeifengesicht, or a face in need of a good slapping. And for all I hated Talons, it seems maddening such a great Doctor Who producer was sacked not for this episode, but for a bloody freeze-frame shot of the Doctor "drowning."

    The next story better be a good one.
     
  19. KHAAAAAAAN!!

    KHAAAAAAAN!! Troll in the Dungeon –§ Prestigious §– DLP Supporter

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    Ehhhh. I wouldn't even put it in top my top 10 Tom Baker stories. Not even close. The Sherlocky aspects are kind of fun, and I think Baker does some truly excellent acting as always, but the story is not mindblowing. Also, fuck Leela.
     
  20. Rhaegar I

    Rhaegar I Death Eater

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    I actually like Leela. I know I'm still relatively early in Leela's run, but so far she seems pretty good so far. Or does she get worse over time?
     
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