In fairness the comics have always had wacky power levels depending on the writer and the story. Why should the movies be any different?

My only problem is Thor being relegated to comic relief.

 

Like Seratin says, retcons and inconsistency is inherent to the medium, I wouldn't worry too much about it. Like pretty much everything, power levels are determined by whatever is most dramatic and the writers' feelings at the time.

That said, I am severely disappointed Ant-Man wasn't the one to finish off Thanos. The internet had the perfect plan for him ready for months.

 

Step 1) Shrink down real small
Step 2) Ride one of Tony Stark's nanobots up Thanos' ass
Step 3) Expand

 

Unless playing with power levels is an intentional homage to the comics, the aim of the films should be to improve on their source material weaker parts. That's my general opinion about adaptations.

Anyway, I read a good comparison that Endgame is to Infinity War what The Dark Knight Rises is to The Dark Knight. Not as good as the previous one which was exceptional, but manages to live up to the hype even if it stumbles in some parts.

 

@Arthellion

Also, Cap 2023 didn't beat Cap2012. Cap 2012 was choking out 2023, and only let go when 2023 mentioned Bucky.

As for the timeline, if old Cap lived a life with Peggy and just returned to the OG timeline afterwards, he should have reappeared at the time machine. Instead they put him on the bench because it was nicer that way. Now we have to make up an additional explanation that maybe in that new timeline Cap met Tony who built him a time machine so Cap could return to the OG timeline.

One more thing that I forgot to mention in my wallpost: the goodbye between Cap and Bucky at the end. Bucky said "I'll miss you" which makes no sense if Cap is back in 5 seconds from Bucky's POV. Cap totally told Bucky that he'd stay in the past to have a life with Peggy, and Bucky didn't expect to ever see Cap again, because he looked surprised when he spotted old Cap. Nice detail there.
--- Post automerged ---
@Celestin the TDK/TDKR comparison is perfect. I have rewatched IW several times over the past year (even this morning before I went to see Endgame), just like I love rewatching TDK. I also enjoy TDKR, but TDK is just superior.

 

Guys, this isn't a video game. Power levels don't matter as much as circumstances and environment, and having 10+ years of experience on someone doesn't necessarily mean you're going to win with ease. Once you get to the upper echelons where people like Cap work as a baseline it can easily go either way, which is what we saw here. Future Cap won because he knew how Past Cap would react to Bucky being alive and used that against him.

The only character I could see outright winning over his past self is Tony, because the Nanotech Suit is a straight upgrade that does everything Iron Man Suit does and more, while being more effective as both offence and defence.

Ragnarok Thor would likely kick Fat Thor's ass as well, because a warrior who doesn't train for 5 years will lose a hell of a lot of muscle memory and reaction time. Fat Thor was way, way, way less competent in battle in this film than he was in Infinity War.

 

Just watched this a few hours ago, and I loved it. I think my only two mild complaints are that I didn't feel Black Widow got quite the send off she deserved, and lack of explanation on Captain America's missing years.

There were quite a few moments I loved, but I think my favorite scene was Cap getting the hammer, not ashamed to admit I squealed like a 13 year old girl at a One Direction concert with front row seats. Honorable mentions go to all the scenes with Tony's daughter, Peter Parker's return (everyone gathering was great but the rambling followed by the hug was something else), and Tony's snap. I'm sure there's others, but those are the ones that really stuck with me.

Very much liked the way they handled the time travel overall, though again, Cap's missing years left me a little confused about what went on there. I think the most coherent explanation is that he lived in the other dimension, and came back to this one after Peggy died. I'm not fully happy with that one, but it's the best I got.

I know a number of people didn't like Thor breaking down and getting fat, but I actually really liked it. I think someone else pointed this out already, but he went through some really rough stuff in Ragnarok. Thought he'd managed to salvage something okay from it, and then had half of his remaining citizens (already reduced by Hela) slaughtered, his recently reconciled brother murdered, and then failed to save half of all intelligent life by hitting Thanos in the chest instead of the head. I can 100% see him having a complete breakdown and feeling like he's not worth shit for the next five years.

Overall, the number of tearjerking moments exceeded my expectations. The opening scene already had me tearing up, and by the end of the movie a decent chunk of my reaction could definitely be summed up as "I'M NOT CRYING YOU'RE CRYING"

As a final note, I normally dislike people who play this card, but if you have a problem with the girl power scene then... are you sure you're not a little bit sexist? Can anyone say that they'd have had a problem or even noticed if an all guy equivalent had happened? Yeah it was fanservice. ...And? It was a cool moment, and it's easy enough to buy that they're the ones that happened to be able to disengage to clear the way.

Definitely going back to watch it at least once or twice.

 

That's the really good question, but I suppose if a scene like that happened in a series dominated by female characters and was an obvious fan-service for male fans, it would take me out of the film for a second too. I'm quite fine with the scene itself, especially when it does get cheers from its intended target, but I would prefer if they somehow managed to make it more organic, if that's the right word to use in this context.

 

So… yeah, I enjoyed my second run through this film a helluva lot more than the first, which I think is quite a badge of honour. I was also a lot more emotional through the two main death scenes. Natasha’s final “It’s okay” and Clint’s raw emotion threatened to break me, but Tony’s speech and goodbye to his daughter (“Love you 3000”) pushed me over the edge, and I must admit that the funeral was a bit of a blur this time, as my realisation that Tony was truly gone replaced the shock from the first viewing.

Since I already knew what was happening, I took my time to look out for the little things, especially with Black Widow. I’m now convinced she totally knew what was about to happen to her and Hawkeye before everyone went back in time. Hence also her immediate acceptance when Red Skull lays out the rules at the top of the mountain.

Why would I say that? Immediately before the jump, she looks at Cap with a somewhat awkward smile and says “See you in a minute.” But she doesn’t say it with a confident voice at all, she says it as if she actually knows she’s never going to see Cap and the others – her family, as Cap so aptly put it in the aftermath – again.

I also have to say that her and Clint’s final scene went up my favourites list by a mile this time. On Wednesday, I was panicking as my mind ran through possibilities for eventual cop-outs, but now I could actually enjoy the scene for what it was. It was beautifully shot, the image of Clint and Natasha pressing their foreheads together with the colourful sky in the background will definitely be going up on a poster at some point. I know I’m repeating myself, but it really was fucking beautiful.

It was a similar story with Tony’s snap. The long, drawn out “And I… am… Iron Man” was perfection, you could see all the weariness and acceptance on Robert Downey Jr.’s face. Spectacular acting.

I’m actually thinking about going a third time. What has this film done to me?

 

It’s one of the best movies of all time. Enjoy it in the theater as often as you can I say.

 

Definitely my favorite Marvel movie to date, and probably always will be now that my boy Tony is gone. Really happy with how much love they showed the original Avengers, and ending the battle/the movie with Iron Man and Cpt. America was A+.

The choice to have Falcon take the shield instead of Bucky was weird and I still don’t think it makes sense given their movie interpretations. It’s not like there haven’t been comic iterations where Bucky becomes Cpt. America, from what I’ve heard. Just doesn’t seem like the shield is all that useful to someone like Falcon who flies around and shoots stuff.

Iron Potts was good stuff, hoping she shows up in one of the future Spider-Man movies to help my boy Peter out. Also hope Peter gets to play uncle to little Morgan. Also hope Peter becomes the team’s next up and coming tech/mechanical guy. Honestly, just looking to see more of Peter Parker and Dr. Strange. Those two plus Tony were by far my favorite part of Infinity War, and the twenty minutes of screen time they had in Endgame was killer, too.

The girl power scene was funny to me because Cpt. Marvel didn’t actually need any of them to clear the way for her. Would have made more sense for them to show up and beat on Thanos while she was fighting him, I’d think.

Asgardians of the Galaxy should be fun. Seems like Gamora isn’t with them anymore, at least going off the last scene with everyone in the ship, but eh. Can’t say I’m really interested to watch Starlord try to woo her all over again. Hopefully my boy Thor shapes up soon. Builtfat is still fat.

I almost laughed when Rocket told Tony he was only smart on Earth. Yeah, same dude.

10/10 will be watching again on Tuesday.

 

So, I'll start with the negatives. Peter was dead for five years, but appears to be the same age as all his classmates? Easily explained by 'they got Snapped too', but that's very convenient. Cap living with Peggy is a little off logically, but worked emotionally. Some of the wider logic of time travel is fuzzy, although the main bits worked fine.

Um. I think that's it, other than a few matters of personal preference. I thought it was incredible. Personally, I'd have killed Clint over Natasha, but it worked perfectly well. At the moment, still riding the high of it, I'd say basically everything else was fantastic. A worthy finale to the MCU so far, and to be honest I'd be satisfied if they just called it a day now.

Favourite moments, in no particular order:
"Hail Hydra."
"Good. Just so long as we're all on the same page." *eyes flash with lightning*
"On your left." and "Avengers...assemble."
"I am Iron Man."
Old Steve.
"Thor, that kid's insulting me again."
Thanos raining down fire on the battle...before all the guns swivel to focus on something else, just before Captain Marvel takes the whole thing out, no-selling a barrage of artillery fire.
Actually, just Captain Marvel in general. Yes, she's OP. I love that. I love that we've got back to a stage of comic book movies where characters can be that powerful, and things don't get sacrificed in the name of realism.
Cap wielding Mjolnir.
"I think it's a bit gratuitous, but fine."

And so many more.

Personal theory about Steve's last trip through time. He was putting the Stones back where they were found, right? So he took the Soul Stine back to its shrine...guarded by the Red Skull. And this time, rather than a shield, he had Mjolnir. So I'm assuming he spent a little longer there than he really needed to, just indulging himself.

 

I actually thought she was a little underwhelming compared to her portrayal in Infinity War. Picking Thanos up and scratching his armor a bit fell flat compared to her holding off him with the gauntlet while killing Vision.

 

i actually have to agree with Jon here. Scarlet witch was amazing and I'd love to see a movie with her.

Especially now that..ya know...Marvel once again has the rights to the X-Men.

It could be a good movie. She finds out her father is still alive and hunts down Magneto.

 

I think the reason why the scene sticks out as feeling somewhat artificial (which of course does not mean that it's not awesome) is that people seemed to come from all across the battlefield to participate. It wasn't just "these people just so happen to be here, and just so happen to be women". It was "the women are doing a charge, I'm going to teleport across the battlefield so I can join in" (looking at the Wasp especially, who literally pops up out of nowhere). I think the scene might have worked better (i.e. felt more natural) if it had still been a women-only charge but not literally every named woman in the series.

There is a big difference between a scene happening to involve only women and a scene involving all the women but no one else. I think it's somewhat disingenuous to claim that the latter can occur entirely naturally.

Because equally, while an all-male charge would not raise any eyebrows, a charge which involved every single male character but none of the women would. People would be asking what unlikely coincidence had led to the battlefield having become gender segregated such that all the male heroes were in one location and all the female heroes were elsewhere.

 

While it’s possible Tony just snapped her without realizing she’d changed sides, I really doubt it. It would have been shown.