Oh so this is the obvious joke that was taken seriously fluff was scum reading terr for. I thought he was taking up for me and was feeling a bit squicked by it. Never mind that burgeoning scumread for odd buddying :/

But yeah, that’s a p obvious joke there.

 

I wish fluffs posts were as good as his doggo.

 

Unfortunately not. I thought this was cobalt and thought it was very weird and a little scummy that he’d announced to the thread he was running and would be back later and to @ him with questions when he’d not really been around for awhile other than sparkle . :/.
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Kinda interesting reading people’s theories on scum behavior in multiball because I’ve experienced the opposite. In most of the games I’ve played in, scum have wanted to seem semi-active but not in a threatening way because lynching the opposing scum team or being too much of a leader draws the nightkill from the other team, and when you have small teams you can’t afford that. That’s somewhat mitigated by the night one no kill, but eh.

I guess I’ve just had widely different expectations for scum behavior than many people here, which uh maybe I need to adjust my expectations and how I’m reading the game

 

Yeah like
Im going back and cobalt read sounds super null (as it should). Fluff theres like a back and forth.
Empoof read is all negative and earlier in the post you even specifically distance from empoof town ("i like him for town" doesnt mean im townreading him" or whatever).
So yeah i dont understand why hed be in the null tier what kept him out of scumreads?
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This is more my expectation, and exactly why ive got jari and keldeo below the rest of my nulls.

I agree about the BPs messing with that a little but eh. You still gotta plan to go far

 

Not sure what to think about keldeo’s readslists. On the one hand I like some of what he says, he’s certainly looking for motivations in behavior which I like. For instance when he considers what me looking at discord to try to get a read on Mendel night say about me, which is way better than sloths condescending kudos for going the extra mile snippy swipe.

The thing that bugged me a bit though was that a couple times he made sure to point out that he wasn’t reading someone for the same reason as someone else he had his own reasoning. This is something I’m going to have to sit on and see if what’s bugging me about that is stupid.

Tom - for both Jari and keldeo I’m not sure what to expect activity wise. Last game I played with Jari I was convinced he was scum for playing pretty much like he is now and was wrong. I should probably go back and look at that game actually. And for keldeo, he was just in the finale, and I made a joke about keldeo not doing anything all day except showing up at eod to say he was fine with being lynched and giving reads. So he’s actually more active than I expected him to be and I don’t ow what to make of that either. I should recheck his readslists actually in that game because they read quite towny.
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And fluffy making a case like that this early has me concerned he might be scum and that makes me feel like a terrible person because like people give fluffy shit all the time for being a low poster who doesn’t do much and lurks, and maybe he’s trying to shake off that complaint and put in some work early and all I see with the work is scum cuz town him lurks. And if he’s town then it’s damned if you do and damned if you don’t so why bother.

 

Yes, that.
But also scumfluff probably knows he doesnt have to make a case and might care more that no one else seems to be suspecting cerber plus strong townreads from me/sloth/someone else i think...

So going with existence of case as NAI and

Well i dont like it and think its wrong

 

I got through the game, but it’s getting late and I have to be at the rink super early before work and need to go to bed. I also need to think about some thoughts because my heads a mess and I don’t feel great about any reads, which is well par for the day one course, but this mafia experiment is maybe a failure I should have left in the past because I still haven’t graded or done lecture prep. Blech.

Anyway

Sloth - if you say “ I like x for town” everyone in the history of everywhere is going to read that as you’re town reading x. If you meant you’re later explanation, ay that. If you actually meant what you said you meant, I’d kinda expect a different reaction or interaction to me pretty much saying the same thing about empoof.

I wish I had a townread I felt comfortable in.

If it weren’t multiball I might be approaching somewhat if a real town read on Tom. He’s still not sparkling, but there’s a gruffness in some of his comments that reminds me of the first game he played at my homesite rip which gives me some favorable feels.

I’m still very squicked by sloths comment yo me about people taking a blunt style. It just feels so wrong and I’m not sure if there’s anything to it concerning Tom. It just really really bothers me. There are some townish notes in sloth though which make me think this might not be a concern, such as his interaction with Mendel and scoffing at an Asta scumread, but eh I don’t know. Probably not partnery, but still just really weird, and I’m probably going to be stuck on this until I make sense of that, and I detest the way he talks to me so bleh.

I want to call Mendel town in part because his emotional quality makes me smile and at times when I read what he says it sounds like something I’ve said, which is an egotistical dangerous read so I’m like woho there Tammy. Anyway not sure if it’s a true town read or not.

And then there’s terr who’s posts I just like in a lot of ways. I like’d the response to me being annoyed. I liked the 42 response. I liked the response to sloth where she says you bolder know my scum game is better than that. I like all these little things where I want to be like let’s hang out and braid each other’s hair, but if I’m honest all the little things I like probably aren’t really alignment indicative, but I can hope.

I need to go to bed. I know this is a lot of nothing, but a lot of nothing is where I’m at.
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Oh I should probably actually read fluffys case.
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I’ll do it tomorrow.

 

First of all, rip

Second, wasnt i scum that first game? Gossip girl?
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So i read that as... like questioning if youre reading "the way i am" vs "how im playing this game" rather than being specifically about being blunt or whatever, which. I mean were hopefully beyond that atp but he wouldnt know that.
But you hadnt given any indication and not sure why he'd assume that

But im with you where i mostly think his posts are good but theres a few things that dont quite add up.

 

Oh I should probs b

Oh that was your first game. Maybe it was your second. It was a game that started before I expected it to, and I nearly missed the whole day and I was in a super bad mood and pissed off everyone cuz I was bitchy about the game starting. I think I yelled at whiskey jack to move his vote at eod to someone I was scum reading? Idk I was very unpleasant. I’d check if I could, but I have this memory of you being town leadery and no nonsense gruff in your interactions.

 

I mean i think im being moderately towny.

Kinda sounds like that one where we chose historical figures? Only alt i remember is gemma being sappho though

 

Nah I wasn’t in that one. Oh well.

Thank you for commenting on my thoughts tonight!

I really should go to sleep. Hopefully I’ll have better things tomorrow,
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*better thoughts tomorrow.

I really need to start using my computer.
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https://www.mafiauniverse.com/forums/search.php?searchid=4606724

Mostly just posting that there for my use so I remember to look at it tomorrow and step away from it tonight, but it’s keldeo’s championship game that just ended if anyone’s into meta.

 

Frustrating we cant go find it...

Sleep well. Dream about sloth being a wolf

 

Bro you wolfing?
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Like

I don't understand why you would feel the need to fake reads in a game with multiple scum teams

But here we are.
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@Keldeo I don't remember why I had sloth for town, I'll try to go bad and see tomorrow. Pretty tired and not really worth the effort right now.

Cerbra I had for his feeling of eagerness in his posts. Like a yearning to learn. Idk how to describe it.

I'm remembering feeling minorly pinged about Sloth (now that I'm in squinty OMGUS mode) giving town reads for genuineness as though genuineness would be something that's alignment indicative when it really shouldn't be.
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NGL the townier you've been getting and the more that I feel like we're on the same page... the more I'm worried you're a wolf.

I kinda thought you were townier when you felt less invested
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I think I'm just gonna stick with not lynching Tammy Mendel Cerber and Tom.

Open up Sloth lynch possibilities

Jarizok/Keldeo/Sloth probably good wagons. I'll think about Cerber in the morning if the case fluff wrote has any merit

@CerberAsta We're not no lynching today and you said some stuff that really gave me fat pause in that post. Like the opposite of a townie dumbtell. Consider that in all other games we have about 25% chance of hitting mafia day 1 if it's true random. If you have yourself as town then the odds of hitting mafia in this game are grossly high as long as you don't get yourself lynched. If you have any confidence at all in a single town read your odds are fairly insane to at least get nominal information from creating dissonance among people that you're worried could be wolves.

Like just having Tammy as town and knowing that I won't get lynched is insanely comfortable position wise. I might need to double check my "people who think I'm town" numbers to be sure.

Hum dee dum.
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Kinda like TerRaine fwiw. There's probably some juicy meta inside the sloth/fluff/raine trio that I skimmed over.

I'll be on tomorrow after I drop off some resumes and hopefully get my haircut. Should be like 3-4pm PST. Will power through and reread, get us a lynch, pop the bottle of martinelli's I have and put my feet on the counter in triumph.
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Oh also I think if you're one of the people that's worried I'm scum (Keldeo Sloth) and I'm wrong that you're mafia, just listen to me anyways since if I was a wolf I'd pride myself on getting a day 1 wolf lynch. Depending on the level of WIFOM the wolf kills are going to make I'm either the perfect target or the worst target. So optimally if I was a wolf I'd want to remove pieces of the other team to give my partner a fighting chance to A.) Not be night kill fodder from the other team and B.) Go deep.

I'd probably have taking my bro under my wing given what I perceive my thread position to be. I think I'm narrowed down to only being partners with Cobalt/Fluff/TerRaine/Sloth? Maybe Mendel. Idk hard to say. I guess I have more potential partners than I thought. I'm never with Jarizok/Tammy/Cerber/Tom imo.
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I'll admit that I skimmed over a lot of what Keldeo wrote and just looked at where my name was mentioned so I'll make sure to focus on him harder.

 

Vote tom

hmmm
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I don't even know if I think tom's mafia.

At 193 he hadn't mentioned anything from Cobalt, and put me and Jari as scummy null for lacking over Cobalt. Does that make him actually likely to flip mafia? Maybe he mentioned who he did because we were top of mind?

I thought I saw Sloth kind of softly defending him (top of 194) and then he has a legit townread of him later on. The semi-spat he and Sloth had maybe counteracts that, idk. I don't really understand the issue he has with Sloth's Empoof read in that big post.
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I guess what I've been gradually coming around to about CerberAsta is... even if I think what he's saying is tonally scummy, if he's mafia, he's doing a pretty good job at projecting new-town-ness. I know he's posted little content and some of it is contradictory and maybe some awkward is because he's mafia and he would be purer as town - I reread fluff's case here because I didn't get the same sense reading through but it actually makes valid points. However, in the end he doesn't seem to be pushing an agenda.

Maybe he wouldn't want or need to push an agenda besides "lay low and float by" as a new mafia, though I feel like on a mindset level that contradicts the boldness of e.g., immediately voting me, asking about the value of scumhunting d1.
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I was going to talk about Jari making an observation about Cerber's post there. It's a sound observation. I don't really think it means anything for Jari's alignment.

idk, Cerber pings me, a lot, tonally. He's avoided giving a solid stance on several different things. I guess I just wanna think he's town for no good reason besides agendalessness.

So how this circles back to tom was that tom said earlier that Cerber's reads list was sensical given the premises Cerber was repping, but his reads list doesn't really seem to have an underlying consistency actually, so I think that's a weird reason to townread someone.
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Okay, could you point me to a particular moment where that happened? I want to get a better sense of how you're processing information so this answer doesn't really help me.

Sloth because you had them as a higher town read; the people I mentioned are ones I have different positions on from you so I was wondering if you could elaborate on them more.
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I kind of skimmed Sloth's big post first couple times through, so I guess I should reread that more closely.

His walls are difficult for me to parse (I know, I'm a wallposter myself)
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ehhh I'll do it later.

I liked Tammy's posting on this page a lot. Feels like a really organic development of her reads. I know that doesn't mean as much as it should because mafia are attempting to read too, but the doubling back and emotion just feel genuine.

Tammy, can I ask what your opinion on Cerber is right now, and how that if at all interacts with your thoughts on people who have townread him like tom and Sloth, and fluff's case on him? Also, the search link you posted expired - you have to use a link like this for it to work. For completion here's my wildcard (mafia) and qualifier (town).

And rereading this page to articulate that read on Tammy, I see tom mentioned why Jari and I were null over Cobalt, which I think makes sense, so never mind that part...
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I do not really see a yearning to learn in Cerber's posts. I see eagerness. I guess I don't really think of that as a towny marker.
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@Empoof Could you walk me through why you don't want to lunch tom again, or direct me to where you've already talked about him if I'm being silly and forgot about it?

Not entirely sure why you think I think you're mafia if that's what you're saying, I'm actually relatively towny on you and I don't agree with a lot of Sloth's points about that. I think The Fear and some smaller things or maybe the lack of things are holding me back from a full send townread.

wrt Cerber's post on scumhunting, it felt towny to me because it's a sentiment I've seen a decent amount of newer people express and I think it was worded in a pure enough way, especially compared to some of his other posts' tone. That was the post that sparked my "new-town-ness" read. I don't think it's really an anti-dumbtell in the sense that I think you're using it.
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I guess I probably shouldn't be devoting this much time to trying to solve someone new who will maybe eventually self resolve
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Okay I'm gonna go back over everything again actually, and sleep

I have an exam tomorrow night, wish me luck
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I'm with Empoof here, like... if you just liked him personally, why not just say that, or you would like if he was town. I know it could just be a phrasing thing, but it was pretty easily misinterpretable.

My guess was that your read was based on Empoof being suspiciously friendly, but then #65 was a conscious effort to not cozy up to the thread, so your read didn't apply anymore or something.
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I still dislike that a couple of the questions in Sloth's post still seem more like criticism disguised as pointed questions. I think the reasoning for his reads in that post are fair enough, though. I think his mind working about things like his analysis of Jari and Ter's interactions, which I hadn't noticed. I enjoy the fact that he included the "devil's advocate" section in his townreads.

I guess this moves Sloth a bit up for me, but then I have like no scumreads, just the pile of null people who haven't posted that much and fluff's case on Cerber didn't do much to move the needle.

The reasoning for a lot of his reads scans fine when I read through it, but I end up disagreeing on a lot of the conclusions. Sloth, can you talk to me more about why you think Cerber would be conferring with a potential scumbuddy on everything because I'm a lot more torn on him, why you don't have Tammy higher, and why tom having answers ready would have a strong bearing on his alignment, because I think it's also true that he'd try and figure things out instead of making stuff up as he went along, even as mafia, in this game? Also, I would think Empoof as a player would be comfortable chilling out being townread no matter his alignment... I don't really see that as a red flag.
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Oh yeah, also mendel. I guess my earlier townread of him has been waning as time goes on. I guess it felt like a thread spew thing but it wasn't actually that?
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Empoof, also, has your lighter-town read on mendel changed for you at all? Like, more light, or less light / more fully in your town circle
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Tammy, would also appreciate you going more in depth into your mendel read, like pointing to some specific posts that you like, or addressing his content?

I don't know whether or not I agree tom's case on mendel's read on him - the issue of why claim to be sheeping Tammy when mendel also independently disliked things from tom. But I don't think mendel mentioned that as a very large component of his own read, because at first he seemed to think that Tammy followed him, too.
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Uhh, what? Is Sloth saying that mendel is bussing... Sloth? I'd think it isn't saying he was bussing someone else because no one else is mentioned here, but it's so weird to even mention bussing as a possibility related to oneself.

Is there some different meaning of bus here? This doesn't make any sense to me.
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Like, yeah, it could be a slip that mendel is attempting to bus Sloth

but Sloth seems like a pretty considered person just based on his posting style and I don't really think the prickly interactions between them earlier were faked? So I doubt that's the case.

so... ?
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oorgh I will think about it tomorrow

Not today: Tammy
Towny but with reservations, so he's not really my second highest town, but I guess he actually is: Empoof
Liked stuff from them but should reevaluate: Cerber, TerRaine, Mendel
Still ???: Cobalt, fluff, Jari (I should probably be able to try to read fluff and Jari by now?)
Ehhh?: tom, Sloth

 

I'll comment on anything else in that big post after work, but Cerber is a conundrum for me. I'm not the greatest at reading new people at times, and he's not really moving the needle for me much at all. His reasonings for his reads are ones that yeah I guess an early townie could be making. I think the town read on him for suggesting no lynch because a partner would never let him say that is pretty naive. I'd probably tell my partner to post something like that just because it makes him appear doe-eyed new. Though sloth's scoffing at someone else for scum reading Cerber probably makes them not partners cuz that felt like genuine scoff and not a fake town read you give your partner. I didn't like Cerber's first post when he said "really pumped for this" - tonally flat for the statement is the best I can probably explain it since I don't really know why it hit me wrong it just did. But I don't put a lot of stock in that early feeling. IDK I was basically gonna try to work around Cerber to see where I ended up on him if that makes any sense.
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Oh you also asked about Mendel, I'll talk about that later. Running late right now.

Also, duh, I just realized I don't need to fret about having town reads; I just need to figure out who I don't want to lynch today and who Im fine with. Things you forget when you haven't played in a while. That makes things so much less stressful for my head.

 

I'm going to assume that is because I have been less present and not pushing anything lately.
This is mainly caused by thread volume going up and my time for the game going down.

 

I'm not even remotely caught up, but will try to do so soon. I've seen some of the analyses of my game-playing and it's uhhhhhhhhh interesting! (I can see why Fluff might scumread me, based on Sloth mentioning that a NL is a hilariously scummy thing to do Day1. But the post about how pushing the lynch from Day 1 to Day 2 just makes Day 2 the new Day 1 made sense. Mafia is a hard game to parse!) It's hard to maintain a heavy presence but I'll hopefully be able to drop an actually major post on my lunch break. I mostly just don't really know what to look for, though I'm thinking about asking if anyone has ideas regarding partners.
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Mendel mentioning thread volume going up and time for game going down is a strong second from me right now lmao

 

...uuuuuuuughghghg. So...much...text.

Gotta catch up on a work project then I'll wade into the swamp here.

 

OK, I just spent an hour on Sloth and only got to post #100
still don't understand what he's doing, but he's definitely stirring things up in an antagonistic way
like what he did to terRaine and "talking for Asta" turniong into buddying
and misconstruing Keldeo asking him about his change in stance on Empoof being "slightly suspicious" to "like as town"
and I still don't like his thing re: me and the LHF (and his excuse to not know the terminology when he asks me later to "gun to head")
and other weird things, like the level of thought going into his questions

if that is a town strategy, I have super no clue how it is supposed to work
but I see it working as scum strategy

will continue later
gun2head on sloth right now is scum, tho
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it's like, if Sloth's intent is not to bury the thread in useless trivia and petty fights, he's building psych profiles of us, and while that would seem NAI, the last people I've seen that do were scum (who then went on to win), and I don't quite see why you'd have to go to that length and effort as town

 

cerber- my thought is not to worry about partners right now. It’s not entirely useful day one without flips to base it off. World building and what looks/doesn’t look like partner interactions is something that comes with time and experience and still not that many people are that great at it. Anomalies in interactions are still good to note and bring up, but I wouldn’t worry about the partner thing too much right now.