I’m good with all of that sloth. I wasn’t trying to tell you what questions you should or shouldn’t ask. I’m not in the business of policing people’s style unless it’s damaging to the gamestate but eh. But if things seem weird to me, I’m gonna inquire see what pans out. Fair enough on the blunt thing. The sparkle thing didn’t refer to that though, but I can see how from an outside perspective it could look that way.

I don’t have a case on fluff. I’m not even sure I want him lynched more than I’m interested in seeing how things shake out. My main concern with fluffy is that while he’s a low poster who’s relatively low impact, I think he’s actually pretty insightful when he wants to be and the reasonings he’s given for things are kinda cursory.

My read on terrain reminds me of the past couple times toms been scum at my homesite rip. Since we played behind alts you could adopt any persona you wanted and Tom would often be this kind of inoffensive fun loving type that I just liked the style of for nothing alignment indicative and stuck him in my blindspot for a coupe days until I realized my read was based on nothing. Wouldn’t mind seeing terrain be a competing wagon today to see how things went. (Also it’d be pretty cool if I was right in my initial feeling that I was being approached by scum.)
--- Post automerged ---
Scum buddying town is also correct. Pocketing is relatively new really.
--- Post automerged ---
Thank you Mendel!

 

"he's trying to make me look bad without actually committing to it by voting me"

like, shading?
If it is scum-on-scum, then it's distancing if there is no vote, and bussing if there is one. Fluffy used "bussing" correctly in #62, btw.

Other than that, it's just suspecting someone, or casing someone, or scumhunting?
Like, saying someone doesn't look good is part of playing the game?

And you admitted just now that I wasn't "making you look bad", you said your playstyle looks bad to everyone who hasn't seen you play, which kinda admits it isn't intentional on my part, and you know it!
--- Post automerged ---

Bascially, you are describing a "lone hunter" playstyle,. someone who plays their cards close to their chest and doesn't let anyone see their thought processes, and your style actually obscures them.

The thing is that in this setup, this is precisely what each scum team must do when hunting the other team!
Be hunting, but not share all of their thoughts or results with the rest of the players.
Your style makes you indistinguishable from scum.

 

Okay so the people I don’t want to lynch today include:

Cerber, empoof, Mendel, tom, maybe keldeo and sloth need to think a bit more about these last two.

This isn’t ordered and these aren’t real town reads. I was stressing myself up way too much trying to nail down town reads and in this type of game my self-doubt is too hard to rein in. These are people I think have a decent chance of being town/will be good for town if town.

Unfortunately that’s mostly the active ones which is a problem but that can be a tomorrow problem. I’d like to think cobalt as scum would do something, and I know that it’s not totally unlike him to lurk most of a day away as town, but eh do something dude.

 

Lol cobalt as scum never does anything.

 

Oh. Hmm.

Since you’re reading along can you answer the questions I asked earlier?

What’s your read on Tom?
Can you talk a little more about your town reads in you pr response to Jari?
Also what do your u make of jari’s Push on you?

I think those were the two.

 

there is no commentary in these, and you can probably skip them, but if you're investigating sloth it might be useful
it's a text file I have

Spoiler: Sloth-related posts

#31 CerberAsta
As for what attracted me-- [Sloth] convinced me to get this account just to play lol.

#61 Sloth 1st post
VOTE: TERRAINE

#62 fluffy
Bussing this early? That's bad form.

#66
Fluff's brief
Tammy's moist and worth observing further
Ter's talking for Asta a fair amount
Empoof's too legitimately friendly and that makes me suspicious
Keldeo's tepid and testing waters
Asta's a wide-eyed doe
Mendel's caught on the I'm-new-to-the-site train so nothing off of him on that
tom reminds me of ika when ika was sober (so the most likeable version of ika)
cobalt...hey, I know you. Have we played together?
Jarizok's either really eager or anxious, and also a shlubbie (what's a shlubbie?)
---
Heh. I like Empoof for town.

#67 Empoof
Good, good

#68 TerRaine
Once is a fair amount?
Have I played with Ika? I don't recall.
What precisely about [Tammy's] moisture makes you want to observe further?

#70 Sloth
[shade on tom]

#71 Tammy
Oh yeah, ika used to play here too? Haven't seen him anywhere in a few years, but I'd not liken him to tom.
#72 Sloth -> TerRaine
["for Asta" controversy]Hm.
[Ika]Oh yeah. Wouldn't stop CAPsing at you for pages.
[evades Raine's Tammy question]
I noticed you stopped pressing her though. Change of mind?

#72 Sloth -> Tammy
Did I misunderstand or did you say you reached out to Mendel on Discord in #64? I thought that was against the rules?

#74 TerRaine
[re Asta] One of those post is talking for him the other is to him. There is a distinct difference.
[re Tammy] Nope...super defensive reaction to light pressure.

#75 tom
[re: Ika] How insulted should i be?

#78 Sloth
[to Tammy] Do you have any particularly strong leads so far?
[to TerRaine] It doesn't as far as looking for buddying. Btw, why did you answer for him? It's not like it was particularly relevant or pressing - and you weren't asked.
You're saying [Tammy]'s scummy but you don't want to focus. Who else pings then?
[to tom] I'm actually of the opinion that ika was a very competent and enjoyable player when he wasn't being purposefully antagonistic
What makes your vote on Mendel not OMGUS?
@his fluffiness: What at your thoughts on my bussing? [which was a joke]
[re Tammy] Hm. Irritation tracks as genuine, for now.

#80 Tammy
Sloth - nope, no strong or weak leads as of yet. Still in observation mode. I want to say empoof town,

#81 TerRaine
Because I was the person he was saying you are correct to. I'd rather keep the focus on the game then getting bogged down in confusion as to what a shit post meant...also Cerber is one of the only people I somewhat know here in this game sooooo its less buddying and more "Hey someone I can talk to and not be completely off putting/awkward/abrasive to as the game gets going"
[who else pings then] Not feeling good on Tom...never a fan of saying "I think this person is town/scum but won't explain why that we see in

#84 mendel
[I'm-new-to-the-site train so nothing off of him on that]
Come on, that's all you got?

#90 CerberAsta
Sloth is proving a little difficult rn. 50/50

#91 Sloth
[to Tammy] To clarify: Have you and @Empoof played together before? Even outside of DLP.
[to TerRaine] Interesting [case on tom]. Yet you haven't pressed [tom]?
@tom she raises a good point though - see my question in my earlier post.
[to mendel]"Expect the game to be slower that it already is" - what is your impression on this game so far then?
[Like, he's giving me a "low-hanging fruit" vibe,] Can you walk me through this thought?
@Jarizok hey, you were in the tournament in April right? How'd that go.
@CerberAsta In a game like this, what would you consider the biggest threat to town?
Still waiting on replies from fluff and tom.

#92 TerRaine
[Interesting. Yet you haven't pressed him?] GIF: That's bait.

#93 mendel
I don't really have a good feeling yet of what to expect of most players.
Based on how rarely mafia got played here recently, I definitely expected a lower level of play than I am seeing.
I'm still uncertain if/how we're going to get 6 players behind the same vote.
[Can you walk me through this thought?]
"Like, he's giving me a "low-hanging fruit" vibe, his responses kinda low-confidence, and I feel that he'd make a good scum push (which, in this game, doesn't even rule out him actually being the other kind of scum)."
Ok, I don't think there is much to walk through? He feels like a person who metaphorically avoids eye contact as they're engaging with you (no offense intended!), like you could push him to get lynched regardless of whether he's town or scum; that makes him LHF. If that impression is true (and you guys know him better than I do), then mafia would usually want to push him to achieve a town mislynch, and in a normal game, seeing this happen would be a strong indication that he's town. In this game, however, he could still be on the one mafia team while the other is pushing him, so I dunno.
The evidence in favor of this being a LHF push is also that I don't really see anyone pushing Jarizok with conviction, it's just something that people do. As an outsider, it's kinda weirding me out, because to me it looks like you guys are seeing something that escapes me, that I'm not privy to; and as a result, I am distrustful of the motivations here.
Am I making sense?

#94 fluffiness
[bussing] What do you mean?

#95 CerberAsta
[at TerRaine] Kinda missed the buddying accusation, but with that in mind I think I'll re-evaluated Sloth as way more leaning into the Scum side of things, since it's p clear he's stirring things.
@his fluffiness, Sloth is asking you what you think about him just immediately Voting TerRaine.

#97 Jarizok
[tournament] Went great. We got a total of 0 scums. I was supes close to blocking the kill the last night though.

#98 fluffiness
[at CerberAsta]I have no opinion on it tbh. I don't see how his vote was any different from a normal RVS vote.

#100 Empoof
Yeah Tammy and I have played together on MTGS during the team game thing. Was pretty fun. Also very quickly read her town there.
I don't remember if she was in the other game on DLP that I played but I don't think so.

#102 Keldeo
I'm at tammy/cerberasta/sloth/mendel for town.

#108 fluffiness
[at TerRaine] The bussing post was based on Sloth calling you scum, and cause I always see you and Sloth as a pair due to Endgames mafia.

#113 TerRaine
Fluff and Sloth are the only 2 here who've ever played with me

#119 Tammy
Sloth - Empoof answered your question. Oh and no I was not in that other dlp game that he played in here. I think I might have observed it though? Though I do have a question for you. Earlier in the game Empoof talked about my meta or what he knew of how I feel about playing scum. Why didn't you ask him how he knew of me as a player then?
#125 Tammy
Sloth - This is the post I was referring to, should have included that at first.

#124 sloth
[at CerberAsta #90] Nice to see you're getting into the spirit of things!
With Jarizok as your vote, do you see any active partners for him?
Please see my question in #91.
[at TerRaine GIF "That's bait"]In what way is asking you why you aren't pressing on your scumlean bait?
[at TerRain "buddying" Asta]Hah. This is patently untrue, actually. See #66, #72 and #78.
I said you are buddying Asta, not that he was buddying you. Asta's a new player and his interactions with your are indicative of that. I can see you as scum attempting that on a new player, specially when rusty.
I also thought it was very clear in my wording that I meant you, so either you misunderstood (which seems unlikely) or you misinterpreted and goaded Asta in this post.
(Why am I always in the smack middle of your reads?)
[at mendel]Yeah, I can follow this, I just didn't understand the term "scum push" and wasn't sure what this mean in terms of ruling someone out.
What's LHF? Also not familiar with this term.
This is actually my first game with Jari (and 90% of the people here) so don't take any of my interactions with him as "seeing something" that escapes you.
Essentially, though, gun to your head, Jari: Scum or Town?
[at fluffiness]I mean, what? You called it "bad form" and now it's just an RVS? Weird backtrack.
[at flufiness]So Ter's partner is me?
[at Empoof]Oh, do not like this. Em, don't do this to me.
Is your town-lean on [Tammy] based solely on this experience?
@Keldeo prod
@tom I asked you something on #78

#126 TerRaine
["buddying" Asta]Ass. Can't you just link things and make my life easier?
Gonna fully admit I forgot what the term meant. Thought buddying was like...a joint scum action.
Cause you seem town for your focus on me but I don't freaking trust you at all
[tom voting jari]@Sloth what's your take on this.

#130 tom
@Sloth
It wasnt NOT omgus, but i did vote [mendel] for the specific reasoning, not "pushing tom"
Also im not currently scumreading him he apparently believes "not responding to pressure" is meaningful so that reason kinda makes sense now

#133 Sloth
[Tammy: Why didn't you ask him how he knew of me]Well the simple answer was that the question was for you, not him. I wanted your take on it and didn't expect Em to answer.
Talk to me about tom's...sparkle. Is there anything tangible jumping out at you? Lots of players play a blunt game like his.

#136 Tammy
Yeah, the point of my question is why wasn't it a question for him. The question for me was meaningless. Have we played together. The answer was kinda obvious too; I talked about him specifically as liking him as a player. So, it's a simple yes, no answer. Doesn't really get to anything about me or my alignment except in the case of interacting with me.
However, asking him about that particular post has you interacting with him in an actual meaningful way because it's discussing reads and motivations, and I guess I'm kind of getting a sense of that being what is lacking in your posts and questions.
The sparkle is completely intangible. It's a visual image I get of people who I'm familiar with sometimes and the way they post.
Why did you add "Lots of players play a blunt game like his."? It feels like you're trying to defend him without even knowing what could be bugging me. And it reads wrong.

#140 Sloth
The game has devolved into the Post Your Pets thread and I am here for it.
[TerRaine: buddying is joint scum action]A LIKELY STORY. Actuallywaitshititislikelykindof... Hm. Reassessing.
Nothing jumps out, seems to match the profile I'm slowly building in my head for tom. Wanna see more of Jari too. Tend to your goats.
[atr Cobalt]You. Give me something to work off - what are your reads?
[at Tom]The specific reason was pressure?
Vote's still on him, I see. Are you scumreading anyone?
[at Tammy]I guess that's up to individual perception. Do you mean just in this line of questioning, or in general in the game? Because I would say that motivation is clear in several of my interactions.
My method of playing is throwing a wide net of questions in general until I see something that sticks out to me and pursue it, hence the move from target to target.
[at Tammy on T9om]I mean exactly that: I've played with several people that have adopted a blunt affect. The point IS to force you to explain yourself and put you on the spot.

#147 Tammy
sloth - I’ll respond to you when I’m not in a bar on my phone
#150 mendel
[What's LHF?]I used it a few sentences before, it stands for Low Hanging Fruit. Easy lynches, or rather, easily lynchable players. Many understand them as low posters, but I also include low-confidence players, those who seem defenseless.
[Essentially, though, gun to your head, Jari: Scum or Town?]
I'd not be surprised if he flipped either way.
See, my problem with LHF is that they're hard to read.
He was going for me in that weird "don't look me in the eye" way, like when he asked if anyone else had played with me, and I don't understand the intent behind that yet.
I think my gut feeling is townish, but a lot of that is also caused by the votes on him that I didnt understand.
I just logged on to catch up and answer questions, this answer may change once I re-read him.
And I resent you for making me answer a "gun to head" at this stage of the game. It sucks, because it feels you're trying to nail me down to something that clearly isnt nailed down in my mind, shouldnt be nailed down in my mind, and would take effort to properly answer that I have no time to invest right now. Why are you pushing me? I see you inoffensively slither through the thread, why did you choose to offend me?
I hate this. I hate Sloth's posting style where he plays his cards close to his chest, explains nothing, and tries to control everyone else with questions. You severely ping my antiauthoritarian streak, and I wonder why you are trying to assert thread control. Do you think that's healthy for town?

#155 Sloth
[doubling down on the "bait" question to terraine]
[at Tome]Hm... Have yet to meet a ferret that wasn't Town...
I tried to read your game - 36 players? Holy Christ. I think I'll just shoot at the dark and learn your style as I go.
[at mendel]Your train of thought is always difficult for me to follow - are you...explaining why you could be scum with Asta here?
Huh. "Inoffensively slither" - I like that choice word btw, makes me sound very sinister and gives a much-needed insight into your thoughts.
Still, I don't think of my style as that, and given what you later say neither do you: I've been running around pushing and clashing with literally everyone, testing for chinks in their armors. It just happened to be your turn.
The reason I do this is exactly what you said you do earlier: It's a basic opener, and you never know what you might get.
Right. Okay, this feels genuine, not AtE, so: Truly, I'm sorry if I upset you or if it seems to you I'm trying to control or something. That's not my intention, I'm just playing the game. Again, I really am sorry if you're legitimately upset.
That said, I'm honestly not trying to control anyone with questions. I'm trying to ask questions, get them answer, and hopefully paint a picture in my head so I know who's scum. I have very vague thoughts and leanings, but nothing worth sharing because nothing solid - my vote is where it is and I'm comfortable with it there for now. Why? Look at my interactions and questions of Ter.
Is this healthy for town? Yeah of course. I'm trying to figure out the game and until I have something worth sharing, I'm not going to confuse the picture with ill-formed musings.
[at fluffiness "was that sarcastic?"@Cobalt]Whether it is or isn't, what would you do with that information, seriously?

#156 tom
Sloth do you think mendel's annoyance with you makes him town?
Also why arent you trying to control anyone?

#158 terRaine
Baiting me to get defensive when the whole post bringing Tom's scummy acts is in itself pressing him. Struck me as a lazy scum hunt against me.

#159 Sloth
Annoyance is genuine, NAI (did I use that right?)
I think Mendel's town for unrelated reasons.
Ugh, all my friends say that if I start controlling people I'd be a very dangerous cult leader and I do NOT want to go down that road again...oh, wait, you probably mean in game.
I mean, you tell me - why would I need to control anyone? Find scum, present case, vote scum. Not really much need for control here.
For you: As town, why would there be a need to control anyone?
[at TerRaine]You didn't ask nor press - and this tells me something else: Based on recent developments, has your read changed at all?
@Empoof your vote hasn't changed from #4, and you did list fluff as scum-lean on #102. Do you have a basis for this? Any leanings on partners?

#160 tom
I mean...
Convincing people to vote your scumreads is controlling them.
Making people not want to lynch you is controlling them.
Why would you forego strategy just because you dont have inside information?

#161 Sloth
Lol I think this more falls into a disagreement on the definition of "control" vs. "convince" rather than any actual disagreement on game structure.
As for foregoing strategy...not sure where I said that. Explain?
Sleep time for me. Will check in the morning!

#162 TerRaine
It's gotten stronger on Tom. Yes its early in D1 but when there are 4 scums floating around its very VERY anti town to leave a lynch vote on someone you don't think is scum for almost an hour.
This is at 3:25. He posts 137, 139, 141 and is even reminded he still has a vote on someone he doesn't scum read and doesn't bother to take it off til 4:23.

#163 Tom
I dont think this falls under "disagreement" in any way and i feel like i have a better basis on you now.

#166 mendel
[scum with Asta]If you read what I write, my thoughts are somewhat easier to follow?
"Pocketing" means "making a player like you", and one obvious way to do it is to agree with them.
If CerberAsta was scum with me, they would have no need to pocket me.
Do you ever do townhunting?
By asking questions, you control what the thread talks about.
At the same time, you avoid sharing your "thoughts and leanings", so your questions are a one-way-street: for me as an observer, they don't flow naturally from your observations and thoughts because you don't share those; and at the same time, whatever cryptic reactions you do show are so far removed from my own thoughts that I don't get where you're coming from. I should question you on almost anything you write, but I'm not sure it'd be helpful?
Maybe I'll select some questions soon.
The point is, you can appear active and avoid taking stances by asking questions. I recognize you do post things that aren't questions, but making sense of them is going to be a job.
And the weird thing is that you are asking me questions that just look like busywork. Like, asking what LHF means when I used Low Hanging Fruit with the capitalization a few lines prior reeks of "what townie looking question can I come up with " rather than an actial question you want answered, and the same goes for the "scum with Asta" question when I clearly explained they could be pocketing (and especially explained what pocketing means).
So, given that you were actually originally intending to host this, I'd kinda expect you to ask better questions than these. They seem super surface-level, and I'm starting to scumread you for that: town asks questions because they want to solve, scum asks questions because they want to appear towny, so if you're looking at the thread with a mindset of "what questions could I ask" with no actual thought process, it shows.
And you didn't tell anyone where my townread is coming from for you. That is no way to build a town core.
[at Tom "why not reading Sloth as wolf?"]Because I haven't decided that yet?
Early on in my mafia career, I used to scumread players when they were wrong, pushing bad logic or bad strategies, and I found that quite a few players do that naturally as town.
I have also since seen players with a style such as sloth's be town. I'm going to need to build a bigger picture in my head of what's going on in the game in order to see alignments. Right now, I am poking at behaviours I don't understand, which is preliminary to that.
Though I am actually starting to lean scum on sloth now. I still want to do the work on them, though, because I still don't have a good understanding of what they're doing.

#171 CerberAsta
Most of Sloth's posts line up with Just Who He Generally Is As A Person, so it's kind of hard to pull a solid read on him.
@Sloth As for your question that I almost forgot about regarding Jarizok's partner-- hard telling. Maybe I'm just not reading/rereading enough to pore over notes but it's hard to tell through the current map of interactions.

#176 Keldeo
For a couple reasons I read through this really wanting to see if I could gotcha Sloth, so maybe I'm predisposed to scumread him (sorry). It felt like a lot of his early posts were shade-driven / empty questions, but I think his later stuff is indicative of a deeper thought process. Like, I didn't really get his turnaround within post #66 on Empoof based on just one post, or why he posted a super confident opener on Terrain and then just gave her a one-liner. But then he talked about seeing her as pocketing/buddying Cerber later on, which I think I could see the gears turning in his head about. I'm not a huge fan of him not seeming to have solid stances or responding to a lot of his questions' answers with a hmm kind of thing.
And I have a guess at a possible process on the Empoof thing, but @Sloth - welcome to the game, could you explain what about P#65 made you think Empoof was townier, what in your early reads list do you think is representative of how you feel about the game? I'd also like to ask what specifically you've gotten out of your questions - you've cast your net, has it caught you fish?

#194 Sloth
[at Terraine]Interesting, I feel like tom keeps proving why the opposite is true...
Your argument is really weak for tom, specially in light of his recent posts. But if you do feel him scum, why aren't you voting for him? Or anyone.
Asta is your other highest scumread, do you see him as his partner? Is your case on Asta based on your perception of him aligning himself to you only, or is there more?
[at mendel]If I'm asking, assume I read it thrice and was still uncertain - save us all a lot of time. Thanks for clarifying.
I'm not going to go over this point-by-point since there's no point to that, but if you do end up having questions, I'm around.
For townhunting...no? I mean I can assume what that is by context, but not sure why I would need to do that in any game.
My vote hasn't moved. My stance has been clear since my first post.
I'm sorry that a game about making sense of people's actions requires you to make sense of me, but I'm not changing how I play to suit your standards, if anything, an expectation like that is what's controlling. Figure me out - or don't.
Then you'd be wrong to. Before today the last game I played was in 2014. I don't know/remember most of the terms and I'm re-learning as I go along. I created the set up cause I wanted to entice more life into the forum.
You felt me asking what LHF is is a bad question because it was obvious - I feel it's honestly annoying and "in bad faith" to tell me I'm being deliberately dumb for not picking up on that or being able to read your mind.
[at CerberAsta "sloth as a person"]...I beg your pardon? XD
Hm. I noticed you're not asking any questions of anyone though - nothing is springing up?
[at Keldeo]Here's the important thing that you (and maybe others) misunderstood about that: I said I LIKE Empoof for Town, not that I thought he was town.
I wasn't townreading him, I was just saying I would like him to be. This was based on his likeability (#65 made me laugh) and his transparency in rebuking tom's comments - neither of these, you'll notice, are alignment indicative.
I'm curious: What was your guess?
As for what I found or my actual thoughts, see below.
Not necessarily: 1 Scum per team is enough to guarantee that.

There's a lot of speculation for scum movements in multiball, my thought is that they'd be doing the usual: Trying to be as conf!town as possible. The other scum team is not as likely to shoot the towniest player N1 because that'd just be halted by the BP, and instead they'd shoot for medium-to-scummy players that won't be bussed easily.
What better way to appear town than to legitimately scumhunt when there's another faction to conveniently seek out?

Anyway, it's past the halfway point on D1 so I can share some basic thoughts:

{CerberAsta, Mendel, tom} < Town

This is Asta's first game and he's kind of flopping around aimlessly. This is fine, he's finding his footing. He's trying to engage and discuss, not asking any strong questions or doing particular investigations. If he was mafia, he'd have a partner that would probably be coaching him to engage more and ask questions. And then in #178 he low-key suggested a NL...which is a hilariously scummy thing to do in my opinion, and there's NO WAY a scumpartner would have allowed him to do so. I'm comfortable with him as Town.
Mendel is a type A personality that appears to be legitimately flustered when the thoughts of those around him don't match his expectations. I don't know how he'd look as scum, but based on this, it seems like he'd have more overt anxiety. Add to that that he legitimately seems to be putting thought into the strategy of the game - moreso than any other player, and how to circumvent things best, as well as his initial help of Asta, he was my strongest town-read before Asta suggested NL. Devil's advocate: He's not voting me, he's not really even asking me direct questions, just throwing general shade, plus his idea of control = questions seems kind of weird in a mafia game - might be bussing, might just be legitimate frustration. We'll see.
tom. I just think tom's fun lol. He answers direct questions and his train of logic is easy to follow when he does - meaning the's not making it up on the spot, he already had the answers ready. Bonus: His interactions with Ter give me life. Devil's advocate: his voting pattern is relevant for reasons I won't go into yet.


{his fluffiness, Keldeo, Cobalt, Tammy, Empoof} < Null
If you're on the left, you're null closer to Town, if you're in the right, you're null closer to scum - but really, that's just kind of a cosmetic claim, it's all Null, all the time.

his fluffiness: he let the pressing Ter and I did on his reaction to my first post wash off of him, where he might have fixated on it more as scum. Takes firm stances, seems set on avoiding giving scum info...but that can also be scummy. Not posting a lot, and sometimes is useless fluff, which is fine but...yep. @his fluffiness btw, gimme a read on Ter - humor me.
Keldeo: Nothing jumps out at me as he's just recently started posting again. His long post in #176 didn't have a lot of substance, I like what Ter already noted of his original post towards her. No reaction to being voted on but that means nothing.
Cobalt: A lot of the reason most of these are here is because I just don't have a lot of information to go on, and Cobalt's a prime example of that. Don't have much to say about him at all - cept #157 where he seems pre-emptively self-conscious around this fact and wonder if it's scum being nervous about being seen as a lurker.
Tammy: I agree with what others have said, if she's scum, it's probably not with fluff, ter, or mendel. Aside from that, I don't have much to say about her at all. Emotional responses seem genuine, if unnecessary.
Empoof: See, I have been told that I'm not contributing and that my questions seem pointless or something along those lines and I feel that that more accurately describes Empoof. He's FUNNY, but his play is not particularly progressing things from what I've seen. Post #165 makes me wonder why he's voting for fluff at all. I will say post #100 sent ALL the alarm bells in my head. When a player feels comfortable skating by being townread, it's a massive red flag for me, but that might just be observational bias on my part.


{TerRaine, Jarizok} < Scum

Ter I've explained - general questions and attitude, lackadaisical delivery, changing topics constantly as a distractor, not following up on people she reads as scum like tom and Asta (Asta???) and dismissing the idea that she should.
Mentioned buddying, she claimed to not remember what it was, which is possible.
See my earlier posts and interactions with her for more details.
This gave me pause:
TerRaine said: ?

Nope...super defensive reaction to light pressure. I stand by my point that her alleged joking of fluff was different than the other posts. Too early in the day to just fixate on one person. That's bitten me in the ass before.

Wasn't sure if this was a town or scum move for her, and was reassessing. She repeats it here:
TerRaine said: ?

In all seriousness? I know where I am weak as Town and it is my stubbornness and tendency to get fixated on a read and refuse to let it go. Like I said to sloth it has bitten me and other townies in the ass in the long ago past. I get a different perspective to explore...see if there's any shifty behavior in the answers or if I'm not seeing the forest for the trees.

Ter gets a lot of confirmation bias and tunnel-vision, which she cops to here and admits she's working on.
That second post actually makes me more comfortable on the vote on further analysis. Seems like overcorrection to make sure it's seen as reasonable town, when what I would expect from ter as town was to sink her teeth and go for broke.

As for Jarizok...he's being a whimsical Tom Bombadil thus far, riding on the "It's D1" train pretty hard. Haven't really seen him do much. That's fine and would make him Null.
Cept I like him as Ter's partner: Post #116 lists him as her second strongest town read for no reason I can discern.
Post #109 also has her do a low-key very light defense of Jari based on Empoof's comments - i.e. the event where Jari is to be lynched and flips scum. That's another instance where Ter's stepped up for someone, but unlike Asta, buddying is not immediately apparent so the why seems to be alliance. Neat.

So yeah that's where we are.

#195 TerRaine
...holy fucking text wall batman I am not getting to this before my office party. I'll try to get to it tonight with an updated rainbow (now with more support) My perfunctory skim....
....so part of the reason I'm scummy for is recognizing my shittier habits from 5 years ago and correcting them? Pft...You know my scum play is better than that.

#196 Sloth
[re Terrain'es read of fluff]Huh. How about that.

#197 Tom
[on Sloth's Empoof read]Hi i hate this read.
The "no u" element plus the red flag makes this feel like it should be a scumread rather than a null but he doesnt want to admit <silly thing he got called out for> is scummy?
I do really like the cerber read in there, which i guess it's slightly sheeped from me but he added his own bit. Also the jari scumread its similar to my process that hes actively staying in the middle

#198 Sloth
[at TerRaine] It's not so much the willingness to change, but as I clearly stated: "overcorrection to make sure it's seen as reasonable town."
Twice. Once had me doubting, twice is more like "let's say it again to make sure everyone heard it."
Same for #196 - a lot of it feels very preemptively hyper-defensive.
[at Tom about Empoof]Doesn't a "no u" element require me to be responding to empoof accusing me of something and me throwing it back at him? We haven't really spoken much.
Also, I think you misunderstood. To clarify: The red flag was for post #100, as stated. This was not something that I got called out for because as far as I know I'm not being widely townread.
I think a player being comfortable in being "safe" (which is the indication I got out of #100) is not good, but it's also not a scumtell really, I just don't like it. I even called out to it on #124.

#199 tom
I guess its more "no him" than "no u"
Either way i think defending yourself and shading someone else in one sentence is >randwolf, and that whole paragraph feels like it should be a tier lower

#202 Tammy
I’m going to answer the first part of this question with my perception of you so far, and it may be me talking out of my ass and when I read the thread tonight if I find I’m wrong I’ll message culpa. My impression is that it’s in general. I don’t mind questions. In fact I’m good with people asking all the questions they need and want to. But let’s face it, scum do ask questions to look busy, and when the majority of the questions feel more busy work, and you’re passing up opportunities to ask questions that do get at alignment, then my ears are going to perk up because that might mean something. So, fine the question to me came from a conversation we were having, and that particular question isnt going to tell much about my alignment, but fine it’s part of the conversation. But you started the conversation, I’m gathering p, to try to get a read on me, so when empoof mentions his meta understanding of me, and you ignore that potential question which could help you gain an better understanding of me and him, I wonder why especially when you’re the wide net casting type.
If you’re scum you have exactlyone other person you’re informed about, scum aren’t really more informed than town this game, which means these little idiosyncrasies in how you question and treat people is important.
I’m sorry I don’t understand what you think you’re forcing me to explain myself and put me on the spot with. Are you thinking that with the sparkle thing? Cuz you didn’t do that. You even gave me an out in your question by asking if it was intangible, which is fine, you’re u couldn’t trip me up on sparkle quality when it’s a specifically me thing and how I read people. And I’m still stuck on the blunt thing. Why did you throw that in there? Are you telling me that my problem with Tom is that he’s blunt and then defending him to me? Did you think you were putting me on the spot concerning the blunt thing and I have to prove myself with you putting words in my mouth. I really really don’t get it. It feels wrong because I never said I had a problem with him being blunt, so you were defending him to me before you even knew what my thought was. I don’t have a problem with people who are blunt; the only problem I have a real problem with is the toxic insulting style.
Okay gotta head out, and if I’m wrong on your approach after I sit down with the thread tonight, I’ll own up to that.

#204 Mendel
Ok, that explains some.
My complaint wasn't about reading my mind, it was about reading the post; and I didn't mean to imply that you are dumb, and I'm sorry if I created that impression.
I have a feeling we're bound to misunderstand each other a lot, and that's going to make you a challenge for me.

#209 Sloth
[at Tom saying Empoof should be lower]Hm.
Ok, so take away the "no him/u" you feel is there: Do you still see it as something that should be "a tier lower"?
If so, what about the read makes it significantly different than Cobalt's or Fluff's?

[at Tammy]Alright - see #194 and my exchanges with Mendel and tom, a lot of what you're touching on gets addressed in a more tangible way there.
If you still have more questions after you're done skimming, repeat them.
Based on your earlier post, I'm interested in seeing what your town-reads are as well.

[at fluffiness]Huh. I am VERY interested on seeing your case on Asta, please.
Did you mean to leave Jarizok blank?

[at mendel]Agreed, sorry as well. I never gave out my resume when I switched in, unlike most other players.
Thoughts on the rest of #194?

I'm interested in more feed back by everyone actually. Day's a-burning.
@Jarizok bump.

#211 Sloth
[at Tom un-reading fluff]This shakes the very root of the game to its core.

#213 Sloth
[at fluffiness]Ah. On that note: DO you have a read on the ones not in that list?

#216 Sloth
...This is going to be a trainwreck.
#219 Tammy
Sloth - can you point out what part of your #194 answers my problems? Because I didn’t see anything that explains the issues that I raised in my previous post which no I’m not going to repeat them; it’s not too far back so respond to it? Also, kindly please Stop with the repeated referring to my posting or emotions as unnecessary. This is just literally me as a person, and it’s very off-putting and condescending. And you’ll probably just talk down to me again with the thick-skin advice, save that too.
#224 Tom
Im going back and cobalt read sounds super null (as it should). Fluff theres like a back and forth.
Empoof read is all negative and earlier in the post you even specifically distance from empoof town ("i like him for town" doesnt mean im townreading him" or whatever).
So yeah i dont understand why hed be in the null tier what kept him out of scumreads?

#227 Tammy
Sloth - if you say “ I like x for town” everyone in the history of everywhere is going to read that as you’re town reading x. If you meant you’re later explanation, ay that. If you actually meant what you said you meant, I’d kinda expect a different reaction or interaction to me pretty much saying the same thing about empoof.

I’m still very squicked by sloths comment yo me about people taking a blunt style. It just feels so wrong and I’m not sure if there’s anything to it concerning Tom. It just really really bothers me. There are some townish notes in sloth though which make me think this might not be a concern, such as his interaction with Mendel and scoffing at an Asta scumread, but eh I don’t know. Probably not partnery, but still just really weird, and I’m probably going to be stuck on this until I make sense of that, and I detest the way he talks to me so bleh.

#228 Tom
But im with you where i mostly think [Sloth's] posts are good but theres a few things that dont quite add up.

#233 Empoof
Bro you wolfing?
Like
I don't understand why you would feel the need to fake reads in a game with multiple scum teams
But here we are.

I'm remembering feeling minorly pinged about Sloth (now that I'm in squinty OMGUS mode) giving town reads for genuineness as though genuineness would be something that's alignment indicative when it really shouldn't be.

#234 keldeo
I thought I saw Sloth kind of softly defending [Tom] (top of 194) and then he has a legit townread of him later on. The semi-spat he and Sloth had maybe counteracts that, idk. I don't really understand the issue he has with Sloth's Empoof read in that big post.
[at TerRaine]Sloth because you had them as a higher town read; the people I mentioned are ones I have different positions on from you so I was wondering if you could elaborate on them more.
I kind of skimmed Sloth's big post first couple times through, so I guess I should reread that more closely.
His walls are difficult for me to parse (I know, I'm a wallposter myself)
ehhh I'll do it later.

[at Sloth]I'm with Empoof here, like... if you just liked him personally, why not just say that, or you would like if he was town. I know it could just be a phrasing thing, but it was pretty easily misinterpretable.
My guess was that your read was based on Empoof being suspiciously friendly, but then #65 was a conscious effort to not cozy up to the thread, so your read didn't apply anymore or something.
I still dislike that a couple of the questions in Sloth's post still seem more like criticism disguised as pointed questions. I think the reasoning for his reads in that post are fair enough, though. I think his mind working about things like his analysis of Jari and Ter's interactions, which I hadn't noticed. I enjoy the fact that he included the "devil's advocate" section in his townreads.
I guess this moves Sloth a bit up for me, but then I have like no scumreads, just the pile of null people who haven't posted that much and fluff's case on Cerber didn't do much to move the needle.
The reasoning for a lot of his reads scans fine when I read through it, but I end up disagreeing on a lot of the conclusions. Sloth, can you talk to me more about why you think Cerber would be conferring with a potential scumbuddy on everything because I'm a lot more torn on him, why you don't have Tammy higher, and why tom having answers ready would have a strong bearing on his alignment, because I think it's also true that he'd try and figure things out instead of making stuff up as he went along, even as mafia, in this game? Also, I would think Empoof as a player would be comfortable chilling out being townread no matter his alignment... I don't really see that as a red flag.

Uhh, what? Is Sloth saying that mendel is bussing... Sloth? I'd think it isn't saying he was bussing someone else because no one else is mentioned here, but it's so weird to even mention bussing as a possibility related to oneself.
Is there some different meaning of bus here? This doesn't make any sense to me.
Like, yeah, it could be a slip that mendel is attempting to bus Sloth
but Sloth seems like a pretty considered person just based on his posting style and I don't really think the prickly interactions between them earlier were faked? So I doubt that's the case.
so... ?
oorgh I will think about it tomorrow

#237 CerberAsta
(I can see why Fluff might scumread me, based on Sloth mentioning that a NL is a hilariously scummy thing to do Day1
[#178 CerberAsta suggest NoLynch, #180 Fluffi responds saying it just pushes the day back, #194 is Sloth saying "And then in #178 he low-key suggested a NL...which is a hilariously scummy thing to do in my opinion, and there's NO WAY a scumpartner would have allowed him to do so."]

#239 Mendel
OK, I just spent an hour on Sloth and only got to post #100
still don't understand what he's doing, but he's definitely stirring things up in an antagonistic way
like what he did to terRaine and "talking for Asta" turniong into buddying
and misconstruing Keldeo asking him about his change in stance on Empoof being "slightly suspicious" to "like as town"
and I still don't like his thing re: me and the LHF (and his excuse to not know the terminology when he asks me later to "gun to head")
and other weird things, like the level of thought going into his questions
if that is a town strategy, I have super no clue how it is supposed to work
but I see it working as scum strategy
will continue later
gun2head on sloth right now is scum, tho
it's like, if Sloth's intent is not to bury the thread in useless trivia and petty fights, he's building psych profiles of us, and while that would seem NAI, the last people I've seen that do were scum (who then went on to win), and I don't quite see why you'd have to go to that length and effort as town

#241 CerberAsta
Guess I'm gonna kinda sheep (?) Mendel a little bit here, Sloth is definitely keeping his hand close to his chest and is pretty doggedly following some trails-- not sure how that'll work out. Some of his stuff is clearly agitating folks and that may color him as scum. A lot of the arguments boiling around him seem to be regarding his thoroughness with regards to examining other's statements while occasionally throwing out statements that require a bit more context to actually parse (ie "Like empoof for town" seeming to indicate an actual townread rather than "I think Empoof is fun and would like to be able to keep him around" which has become a pretty big hang-up and I don't know is entirely deserved, but Mafia IS a game that requires a lot of scrutiny so IDK).
Looking over the interactions, it's hard for me to tell if he is just being a little off the cuff because he's town and feeling a bit secure on that front or if he just slipped a few times. This rather large amount of attention on him seems counter-intuitive, as it feels like-- if he's scum, he's stayed in the spotlight and has been riling folks up in a way that might get him lynched (AND it might get him targeted by Mafia, esp if any of his guesses are close).
I'm curious how Sloth feels about the picking and if he's planning to be a little bit more deliberate with his following statements. Also curious how he's gonna answer Keldeo's questions about me.

#244 Mendel
While sloth was writing his big #66 wall, that listed Empoof as "too legitimately friendly and that makes me suspicious", Empoof posted this weird thing, and sloth added "Heh. I like Empoof for town." Then Keldeo goes,
Keldeo said: ?

could you explain what about P#65 made you think Empoof was townier

, aka wondering why sloth felt the need to tack this assessment on. And sloth's explanation doesn't really make that much sense in this context:
Sloth said: ?

I wasn't townreading him, I was just saying I would like him to be. This was based on his likeability (#65 made me laugh) and his transparency in rebuking tom's comments - neither of these, you'll notice, are alignment indicative.

Like, sloth has already read Empoof as "too friendly", I see no "transparency in rebuking tom's comments" in that post at all (it didn't make anything transparent to me, anyway), and it doesn't explain why this post makes sloth want to amend "legitimately suspicious" to "like Empoof for town", because that's not the same sentiment.
Sloth is evading the question with his aggressive reaction instead of explaining what he thought, which jibes badly with his "ask me questions" that he opened with, and makes me think he is actively looking for fights instead of cooperation.

tl;dr it doesn't actually matter what sloth meant by "llike Empoof for town", what matters is why he added that based on #65, and he explained that poorly and somewhat confrontationally.

vote sloth

might as well see who's onboard with this

#245 Tom
Real talk im not seeing this manipulative/serial killer vibe people seem to be getting from sloth.
But i still think shit dont add up.
Vote sloth

#252 Jarizok
What do you make of people's reads on you rn?

#256 CerberAsta
@Jarizok I meant that Sloth's clearly agitating folks and that agitation may color their perception of him as scum.

@Mendel Sloth is someone who thinks pretty heavily but can seem pretty off the wall-- making him appear something of a contradiction. (Love you, Sloth.)
If I had to try and pin 6 other folk for town.......... hm. No particular order. I might try to order it later.
Sloth
Keldeo
Tom
Tammy
Jarizok
Mendel
I'll try to explain later, but it largely boils down to who is doing the most work in terms of genuine scumhunting without trying tactics that seem weird to me.

#257 Sloth

 

Dog walking, so more detailed answers later, but currently townreading tom.
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I hadn't even realized Jari was pushing me (should tell you how effective he's been) and now that I read back, Jari's push is dumb.
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My two townreads in that response were Empoof and Mendel. They're both pretty active, which I like, Mendel is pushing people and asking for explanations and giving reasonings and shit like that, which I love. Empoof's is mostly just based on his activity tbh.

 

That's 7 including you, leaves 4 potential scum lynches for you: his fluffiness, Cobalt, Jarizok, TerRaine

the first 3 haven't been doing too much, I find them hard to read (gut feel on Cobalt is positive, but still, too little data)

I've been reading TerRaine indirectly, through digging sloth's stuff up, and her responses felt good to me. Given that I think TerRaine is a good lynch (in that she has had an active day, and many interactions), I'm probably going to have to look through her posts tomorrow, IF I have enough time, which I might not. (And look through the cases.)
Who is scumreading terRaine independently of Sloth?

I'd be happier voting Tom (is your vote still on him?) than TerRaine.
Your town case on tom was, in its entirety:

How confident are you? Would you like to amend this?
Has someone else's case on Tom looked good to you?

Sloth is probably the most important player to have clarity about, because he's just commanding so much of the discussion, and if we can't trust him, that is very dangerous. I see his #257 have super towny tone at the start, but he's come back fresh from a break, and to my sensitivity the tone starts flagging again midway through. If he was a less important player, I'd happily lynch him, but I feel he's an asset if town, even though he seems the "lone hunter" type. The problem is, if we can't trust him, and he can't build alliances, the only way he can prove himself is by finding scum. His one big scum read is TerRaine; if TerRaine flips town, then what? And if TerRaine flips scum, then what, given this setup??

Mendel, Tammy, Keldeo, Empoof are my town reads, CerberAsta is no lynch today,
his fluffiness, Cobalt, Jarizok are "not sure" for low volume (share your thoughts more, please!)
TerRaine is gut town (but needs to be re-read), Tom is scum lean, sloth is scum for me (convince me otherwise?)

@TerRaine Whom should we lynch?

 

I’m with family at the moment. I have a massive post forming in the notes on my work laptop. I’ll try to finish and post tonight when I get home.

Sorry didn’t plan on being this late

 

Hi I'm home

Going to settle down a little and get to reading, if there's any big questions people have for me feel free to lay them out.

I don't think I want to lynch Tom today. Lynching Sloth day 1 feels bad but also like... not unreasonable. But I think this game happened solely because he wanted one to run so :v

I'd like to label tom as an "ally" instead of town or mafia. Just makes the most sense in my head.

 

Mendel I'll try to respond tonight, but I just remember we have company coming into town tomorrow, and I was sick last week and haven't cleaned a thing. I will really try to respond tonight, but if I don't I fell asleep.

My vote is on fluffy, but that was more of an experiment than an actual desire to lynch. I'm not sure where I want my vote right this second. I'll be interested in Terraine's big post she's working on.

Oh yeah - Keldeo good luck on your exam!
--- Post automerged ---
Oh yeah fluffy - Can you talk about your Tom town read? I was looking back at the last game played here earlier and you seemed to have Tom's number pretty early. Do you feel good about your ability to read Tom then? What's different about him here?
--- Post automerged ---

Oh yeah fluffy - Can you talk about your Tom town read? I was looking back at the last game played here earlier and you seemed to have Tom's number pretty early. Do you feel good about your ability to read Tom then? What's different about him here?

 

My tom read is about 50% gut, 50% feeling that tom is less trolly then usual. As scum, I find him very flighty and unserious, and I'm not particularly seeing that here.

 

Sloth re: which reads did I say were town based off genuineness. I definitely remember the Mendel read. I guess I'll go quote that.

Nah I was solely talking about you saying that I "look good for town" and then warping it to some other statement. If you're being real that you meant it how you reclarified... that's just ridiculous and I don't see how you don't realize that.

You feel super lawyery in your responses. It feels like saying "see I'm not scum because your argument doesn't stand up" which will probably end up with you getting lynched. I don't even feel that comfortable in my read on you right now, it feels really flucuant. Like I read over some of your analysis and walk away feeling moderately okay but then also read some of your responses and feel like they're just really... weird. Like they just feel like lies made up after the fact. Extremely hard to shake.

But I don't feel that comfort I feel when I have a solid day 1 wolf read, the security with knowing that I'm probably right. Hm.
--- Post automerged ---
It's also like you're missing some really glaring contextual clues in the game that I feel like you should be able to pick up on even if you haven't been playing for such a long time. Like my opinion on fluff has been pretty in-your-face and it's fairly obvious that my initial vote on him was RVS. So pushing against me for not having reasons for my vote or whatever exactly you said about it felt really dumb. If you'd read my posts you'd know I had felt the most uneasy about Keldeo so far, and should probably be putting two and two together that I just hadn't shifted my vote.

It bothers me because I have that feeling about you but then realize that even as mafia you should be actively attempting to be looking in to things like that too, to be attentive and trying to figure out alignments.
--- Post automerged ---
I guess I'm just walking away feeling like you're trying to look good and it makes me incredibly uncomfortable.
--- Post automerged ---

I'm offended
--- Post automerged ---

I don't get where you think I'm projecting that my ISO isn't shallow. My reads and the reasoning for my reads are pretty unnuanced and flat. I've just been naturally townie enough that I was getting a lot of town reads. Apparently a lot of those are drifting or aren't there for some and that's fine. I think when I focus more it'll be as obvious as it was before and I'll get what I want
--- Post automerged ---

The degree of confidence of my read (reading this as "does he have TMI about your alignment") doesn't mean anything about my alignment in this game.

Hope you're around soon and we can dance
--- Post automerged ---
Tammy is town
Tom is an ally
I want to believe that Cerber is town
Sloth's not with Tom or Mendel or TerRaine
Cerber's not with Mendel
Tom's not with fluff
Cobalt's not with fluff
I think I'll make a google doc

 

TerRaine

If anyone cares i got the shards and glue off my fingers. I am also feeling like microwaved dog shit but I promised reads. Planned on more but I need to pass out

Mendel

sincere…seems to be trying to understand others’ gameplays without tunnel visioning. Asks for clarification. Very towny feel to me. Willing to listen to his town reads opinions and reevaluate his positions

Empoof

active; #233 on a whole I just like the reasoning and thought he’s putting into his reads….another one who’s not afraid to explore and explain his view of the game mechanic and getting into the scum teams heads

Tammy

The more of her I read the more her defensiveness is coming across and sincerely just her gameplay. Sloth and I are both kind of asshole type players….I can see why we grate people who aren’t. despite this she seems to be trying to understand where players are coming from.

I like that she’s trying to get into the head’s of the scum teams but while I don’t disagree it could draw a NK but I still maintain that they’re better off getting them out because of the low numbers per team. You’re basically adding more bullets to a game of russian roulette not scum hunting if your scum. The longer their opposite scum team is alive the more chances they have of getting shot

like this point

And he does know that. It’s what’s pinging me as off with him. I like mafia in general but I love when I’m on the scum team….not sure what that says about me but there ya go. I’m usually proud of my scum game…its when I’m town that I piss people off and grate them

Jarizok

I like his obs. in 187 on cerber’s Tammy read.

I like this observation for game play….personally I hate it cause I find my comfort zone when I’m on the scum team which isn’t probably a compliment for me

LyricSloth

Don’t like this. “Your point is bad” isn’t an argument. Sloth feels Tom is moving scum but can’t substantiate it beyond “No you’re wrong.” Instead he distracts from not having a substantial argument to lob more shade at me when I’ve already made clear I think caution is better early in the day.

Actually don’t disagree with this. Town hunting seems pointless. Unless you’re in a multi scum team game as scum where the wincon is “You can kill only town and not the other scum team”

the “your augment sucks” post made me want to move sloth down in my rainbow but these two boosted him back up.

The gentler approach he’s taking with one of my scum reads Cerber I pretty much contribute to Cerber being new…I wanna say he was much the same with me when I played my first game and I THINK he was town. Opposing team Scum Sloth would possibly throw Cerb right on the bus and same team scum sloth would be much more neutral.

but there’s this…

Da fuq you talking bout Willis? He didn’t let it wash off him he turned around and voted me XD

Oh go fuck yourself I’m likable damn it

Cobalt

Yer gonna need to do something…


CerberAsta

See Jari’s throw obs in 187. Cerber’s POV is Tammy is doing Towny things and pushing the game forward but I’m ranked as a higher town read for supposedly joking around when I’d actually been abrasive to at least one person. She “came out strong” but she’s ranked the same as “proving a little difficult” and “kinda active but fairly brief.”

tom

Tammy’s said multiple times he lacks the town!Tom “sparkle” which Mendel agrees with. Confusion on this seems forced.

Lynching a wolf with a wolf IS fine….but it doesn’t make having strong town reads “less important.” Scummy move to encourage a careless sort of mind set that leads to cone bias. This is the path that leads to “Oh Tom helped me lynch this wolf so hes probs Town.”

his fluffiness

Ugh. Do not like. I don’t think its Towny to try and shut down discussions of understanding how the scum are going to play their hands. Either your shutting down the flow of information or assuming the scum team is stupid and doesn’t know this…neither are good.

Not sure why he’s refusing to answer anything I ask. If he thinks I’m really scum and he’s town he has nothing to lose and everything to gain from me hunting down other scum. Only reason to not answer is he thinks I'm scum and that any scum hunting would lead me to his partner

I mean…if I felt Tammy was defensive this is just in a different league entirely. I asked a single player their thoughts on two posts once without any indication of what my own thoughts on it were (something Sloth also did in #124 directly calling it a “weird backtrack”) and fluff acts like I jumped up on the table screaming “J’accuse!”

I kept pushing Tammy…I barely mentioned fluff by comparison.

Keldeo

Stone cold? It’s a common scum tactic. Calling people out as a “joke” is seen almost every game as a distancing tactic. I’m not sure this is the case anymore for that interaction with my changing reads of people but I don’t like that Kel acts like this type of play is out of the ordinary. Seems insincere.

His reads seem…weird to me. Take these two obs.

The first one being about me the later Sloth. I don’t see how he’s seeing shade from one and not the other. I mean Em kind put it best when talking to me.

He was 100% correct…I am prickly at best. Yet Kel and Cerber seem to have missed this

Also feel like many of his prods to peopler have been “what are you getting out of your game play” phrased in a slightly different way each time. Why ask it over and over and over? All it does is pad his posts and make them look long but lack content.

….then WHY? If its a town ploy to see other players’ reactions you don’t say it out loud cause it defeats the point…otherwise this seems pointless posting to be posting and “Active”

Between Fluff and Kel for a vote.

 

Okay I organized my thoughts a little more so I'll flesh out some not pairings.

Fluff: Not with Cobalt as Cobalt's first read was a town/genuine read on them. Not with TerRaine from their squinty eye interactions with eachother and that fluff post referencing Endgames. Lightly not with Tom from Tom's read then rescind on fluff isn't how I view how Tom wolfs.

Jarizok: Lightly not with Cerber from Cerber's early vote on them. I have a note that I felt Mendel could've been a potential partner from Mendel labelling them LHF and being slightly dismissive, but I'm getting bought from Jari's "X meant this" post that was fairly abrasive.

Sloth: Not with Mendel for Mendel's original push and vote onto Sloth. Lightly not with TerRaine for the "that's bait" post. Not with Tom for Tom saying "dream of Sloth being a wolf".

Cerber: Not with Mendel for having a read without a ratio on them in a sea of ratio reads. They would have felt self conscious about that. Lightly not with TerRaine for TerRaine's "Me thinks you're playing into this buddying idea to clear yourself" post.

Tom: Lightly not with Keldeo for how tom was inquisitive about "I think you're a wolf".

There's obviously some overlap, and I'll keep looking through for a bit tonight and probably all of tomorrow. Notably for Sloth the pairings I have left are CerberAsta/Cobalt/fluff/Jarizok/Keldeo so I'll try to tear into those interactions seeing as they're the competitive wagon I'm most interested in.

If you guys have things you want to add to this I'd appreciate it.
--- Post automerged ---
TerRaine thanks for the explanations.

Can you tell me why you feel more comfortable when you're scum?

 

Vote Count 1.4
His Fluffiness (2): Jarizok, Tammy
Jarizok (2): Cobalt, CerberAsta
Sloth (2): Mendel, Tom
CerberAsta (1): His Fluffiness
Keldeo (1): Empoof
TerRaine (1): Sloth
Tom (1): Keldeo

Not Voting (1): TerRaine

With 11 alive, it is 6 to soft lynch, 9 to hard lynch.

Moderator Notes:

If I've missed your vote, please restate it in your next post. Again, bold, brightly colored, and on a new line, please.

DAY END TIMER

 

Suggest hype songs so ill be awake enough to post after this 3 hour drive home

 

The one and only (Chesney Hawkes) on repeat for 3 hours should do it.

 

@Sloth , how tunnelly are you normally?
Do you catch yourself tunnelling?


@TerRaine
you're not supposed to "hunt and kill" town, you hunt the town and kill everyone else. If you've found enough town, this wins you the game.

I've just looked at his fluffiness, and I'm not seeing enough to make a confident read on.
Like, the "let's not discuss scum" post pinged me as well, but it's not a two paragraphs worth of scum read to me, I can easily see that coming from town.

And I feel your Keldeo case should be more substantial, given how much Keldeo has written already.

the posts you are "boosting him back up" for are mechanics discussion, generalities, not scum hunting. These are the easiest kind of posts for scum to fake.
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I just did a search on you with that magnifier under your avatar, and I feel you are a lot less prickly than Sloth. Your posts are 75% feelgood fluff that make the thread amusing to read (town motivation is important) and 25% pushes/defenses with bite that you tend to follow through on (being "stubborn" I guess), even if their origin seems a bit haphazard (word of the day, I know ;-P ). I'm not altogether happy with your reads list, but if your towngame is supposed to be "prickly Raine", I'm not convinced I'm seeing that here?
I mean, sure, if I compare you to Tammy, but compared to other players? Not so much.

 

Jari's a wolf tryna make me drive into a ditch in annoyance.

Went with this playlist of hip hop about being awesome