I just saw the new episode.

Holy shit, Walker is a worthless scumbag.

Spoiler

I feel bad for his friend dying, Karli is clearly a terrorist in my eyes and should be brought to justice. But Walker is clearly a psychopath. The ending shot with the blooded shield and people recording him... just wow.

 

Spoiler

I don't get psychopath vibes. I get 'hardened killer who's been through the shit' vibes. Further, he's obsessed with living up to the Cap ideal, to do some good after doing lots of bad, but feels it's impossible to do without the Super Soldier serum.

And of course, the serum did to him what they've always been telling us it does since the first Cap movie. It exacerbates your strongest impulses, be they good or bad. Walker's strongest impulse is "catch the bad guy, no matter what. Do whatever it takes, no matter how brutal."

They're really playing up the contrast to Steve. Basically a what if scenario where instead of a 'weak man' getting the serum, 'a strong man' gets it instead. It's a callback to the whole bit from Cap 1 about strong men not being able to understand the true value of super strength and that the power has to be tempered by compassion.

 

Agreed, I like the tone and comparison.

The show is getting better, the first two episodes were weak but the last two ramped up.

 

Spoiler

Well, the fact that he decapitated someone (a terrorist, yes, I know) in front of many witnesses who were recording him with phones and no doubt uploading this to social media... something tells me Steve wouldn't do that.

Don't get me wrong, Steve DID kill people. Mostly in self-defense but not always.

However, the decapitated guy wasn't even the one who was responsible directly for BattleStar's death. That's on Karli. I'm all for arresting her. She's clearly misguided and lacking in morals if she thinks bombing a building full of people is a good thing.

 

Spoiler

This is post-serum. All this guy's worst impulses have been dialed up to 11. So again, not inherently a psychopath, just... now under the influence of a horrible version of himself?

 

Okay, so I've seen the first 3 episodes now. I actually was interested in seeing this show, unlike Wandavision.

Re: action sequences... tbh I'm not sure if I agree with complaints that Falcon is not badass enough. The opening action sequence was phenomenal and entirely on par with Falcon's power level in the mainline movies. He pretty much took on a whole squad of bad guys by himself (they had a helicopter too) and came out on top. The fight scene on top of the trucks was one trained super soldier and one non-super with robot wings up against what, half a dozen super-strong opponents? Like, they probably don't have Falcon's training, but does it matter how well you can punch if the other guy isn't even gonna flinch anyway? As I understand it, Walker and his buddy don't have the serum either, not at that point anyway.

Re: Flag Smashers not being an Avengers-level-threat... Yeah, remember Iron Man's first two bad guys? A globetrotting chase after serum'd terrorists, I think that's cool. Also I like Zemo.

I wanted this show to be Winter Soldier, perhaps on a smaller scale (because TV vs cinema) and that's what I'm getting.

 

Dang. FaWS started slow but they've really ramped it up the past two episodes. Zemo is a great villain and Walker is a great contrast to Steve.

I hate to say it, but Sam has actually been the weakest part of the past two episodes.

 

Am I supposed to be disturbed or upset by NewCap's actions? I was cheering him on through that whole section.

 

I think yes, you were supposed to be disturbed, I'm pretty sure.

 

You should see our convo in spoiler talk on discord. -.-

 

I assume no one was really disturbed, rather "not enough blood in the closeup shot"

 

I don't understand this show's attitude to killing at all. You have a bunch of people attacking each other with knives and clear intent to kill, and then the moment someone dies they all stand around in shock while dramatic music plays like they this was a completely unforeseeable outcome. Sam killed like a dozen people in the very first scene of the show.

 

Eh it was a meaningful named character death. Is it realistic? No. But it’s a narrative storytelling choice

 

I see the death as the first step to a slippery slope. He had had the syrum for what? 1-2 hours? Not a great start.

 

Spoiler

Agreed with this. I can understand Walker being shocked at Battlestar’s death but why did Bucky and Sam just decide to stand by as the Flagsmashers ran out? Sure, someone they barely know getting killed is going to phase a soldier who fought in Afghanistan and a literal WW2 veteran/assassin.

I also don’t understand what this show’s message is about superheroes killing. Maybe it falls flat for me because Battlestar was barely a character, but am I supposed to think Carly killing him was worse than any of the hundreds/thousands that Steve unceremoniously murdered through his movies? Ignoring the aliens and robots, some humans die in much worse ways (like drowning or being thrown into propellers) by OG Cap’s hand than what Carly or Walker did.

Sure a lot of those guys were Hydra but we’re not exactly shown that all the rank and file guys are deserving of deaths like that. Wanda was with Hydra for a while and she’s a sympathetic fan favourite now. Not to mention the random mercenaries he kicks off the side of a boat in Cap 2, unless we’re just supposed to assume all mercenaries are awful people.

Walker’s kill was especially egregious because it was execution style on an unarmed (barring the serum which complicates things) man lying down on his back/not continuing to fight. That does make it worse than anything Steve ever did, but I think the line gets blurry when you factor in the “supersoldier killing baseline human mercenaries before they even know he’s there or have a change to surrender as he infiltrates the boat they’ve been paid to hijack by Fury” aspect. Factor in Sam’s fight at the beginning and I have no idea if this show wants me to think killing is cool, awful or a necessary evil? It seems to depend on whether you’re an Avenger or not really.

I gotta say it’s kind of funny on a meta level they decided to do this Walker plot line. I know there’s been a lot of discussion online since Endgame about whether Sam/Mackie can fill Steve/Evan’s boots, because it’s a hard act to follow up. Why not instead have someone disposable come in and do the worst job possible so whoever you pick next looks incredible simply by comparison?

 

On that same note, are we supposed to sympathise with Karli?

Also, the way Steve took out mooks they would have died realistically.

 

I think we are supposed to sympathise with Karli. The actual villains of the story seem like they are going to be Zemo, Walker, and whoever the Powerbroker is.

 

You’re supposed to sympathize with all of them to an extent.

 

Agreed, this whole "They are the good guys and they are the bad guys" thing is juvenile. Karli has some good points, but has done some evil shit, she certainly isnt good, but her ideals are not wrong at a base level.

Even Zemo, while he did bad stuff, his base idea isn't wrong. He is my favourite part of the show so far.

 

Fun reminder. Peter 1 v2ed the titular characters of this show