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Christianity and Deathly Hallows

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by Skeletaure, Oct 23, 2007.

  1. Skeletaure

    Skeletaure Magical Core Enthusiast ~ Prestige ~ DLP Supporter

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    JKR always tried to write a moral tale into the HP books, mostly through Dumbledore. Sayings like "It does not do to dwell on dreams and forget to live" and the stress on the power of love were examples of this.

    Yet in DH the moral moved from a general, secular, moral to a more Christian one. There were two quotations from the Bible in there, from Jesus and St. Paul.

    "Where your treasure is, there will your heart be also" (Matthew 6:21).

    "The last enemy that shall be destroyed is death" (1 Corinthians 15:26).

    As well as this, there was more Christian imagery. Harry put a cross on Dobby's grave, and with Mad-Eye's eye, Bill and Fleur's wedding was very similar to a Christian service (she could have done so much with the wedding, but she made it pretty boring in the end), and we visit a church graveyard.

    And then of course there is Harry's very Christ-like death and resurrection.

    So, did JKR end up writing a Christian tale, like Narnia? Or were these just coincidences of culture?
     
  2. Methene

    Methene Auror

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    I think Christianity is just ingrained in her to the point that it seemed natural to portray those events as such. Not much has been spoken about Wizarding Religion, but it would seem unnatural for them to follow Christianity-not too long ago their kind was burned at the stake.

    In an interview, I think one in Edinburgh, she even described Harry's christening.

    To sum up, I think it's just her culture that made it look so, more than a desire to put forth Christian imagery.
     
  3. Marie M

    Marie M Raptured to Hell

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    Lolz, and to think that all priests restricted Harry potter books in Georgia... No one who goes to church reads it and if they find out that you are, they think you are follower of devil or some such shit.

    More to the point, I agree with Methene
     
  4. Methene

    Methene Auror

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    Now how would the books have come out if JKR belonged to another religion?
     
  5. Lyndon Eye

    Lyndon Eye Minister of Magic DLP Supporter

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    I agree that there are religious references in the Harry Potter series.

    I agree that the story is very moralistic and idealistic.

    However, its level of offense cannot compare to C. S. Lewis' Narnia series.


    I read the series in its entirety over a duration of two days last summer. I remembered enjoying them when I was younger, so I decided to give it another go.

    Sure, the books were still entertaining as hell. But the deep Christian/anti-Islam undertone ruined the series for me. That and the blatant racism (i.e. Aryan supremacy).


    In comparison, I think Rowling did a superb job in not letting her personal religious beliefs overwhelm the essence of the story. While it is still overly-idealistic in its message, at least Deathly Hallows wasn't a cliched symbolic representation of Bible stories, as the Last Battle was.

    The Harry Potter series can be interpreted as religious, but at least it's subtle enough not to interfere with the general flow of the story.
     
  6. Rainstorm

    Rainstorm Fourth Year

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    I haven't read the Narnia series in years but can still clearly remember that Susan wasn't allowed back in because she had become interested in boys an make-up.

    That said, Narnia was very much a product of its time and the Harry Potter series is very much a product of modern culture. The links to religion in the book are far more subtle and most are almost subconscious rather than overt.

    The books are written for children so it's not surprising that there is a morality tale woven into the story. The books can be read with as much of a religious view as you put on there. On one level it's a story about a boy beating up evil things and saving the day, on the other hand you could look at CoS and if you squint enough it can be claimed that it's a recruitment poster for Christianity. Character tempting the protagonist and an evil serpent with an urge to destroy fought back by a phoenix and a child, both seen as images of purity.

    It's true that Deathly Hallows is a little more overtly Christian than the other books but a lot of it is what you are looking for while you read them.
     
  7. Rin

    Rin Oberstgruppenführer DLP Supporter

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    If you want a very thorough discussion of the Christian symbolism in Harry Potter, read a book called Looking for God in Harry Potter by John Granger. While it only covers, iirc, the first five books, it goes indepth into the symbolism, structure and whatnot of those books. After reading that book quite a while back, I came to the conclusion that Harry was going to actually die in the end, but come back. I wasn't really surprised by the end of DH.
     
  8. Mechanicalchrist

    Mechanicalchrist Groundskeeper

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    Throughout the first six books Harry's character displays numerous messianic properties(Harry repeatedly falls in and out of favor with the people, only to ultimately be labeled as a 'Chosen One' who will lead them to salvation). It was pretty much inevitable that there would be a good deal more religious imagery in Deathly Hallows than there was in any of the previous books.
    Although I don't think many expected it to be so blatant...
     
  9. Demonic Chair Stealer

    Demonic Chair Stealer Second Year

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    So in conclusion

    Harry=JESUS!!!
     
  10. 100thlurker

    100thlurker Squib

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    The same could be said for thousands of other characters.

    I think this is merely another case of looking to deep into something. Even if Rowling was from another religon, if she kept most of the plot points the same, what's the difference?
     
  11. Helius

    Helius Third Year

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    Which raises the question, why does the Church hate Harry Potter?

    If JKR was out to write a Christian tale, she wouldn't have written a story with witchcraft and all the other stuff which is against the Bible. So it would seem that it is more of a coincidence of culture more than anything else.
     
  12. Skeletaure

    Skeletaure Magical Core Enthusiast ~ Prestige ~ DLP Supporter

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    JKRs recent interview with a Dutch newspaper (which I linked in a different thread) reveals that she deliberately made Harry represent Jesus. So the debate on this is settled I guess.
     
  13. sincostan

    sincostan High Inquisitor

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    I don't believe that it is literally because she is interested in boys and makeup. I do not think C.S. Lewis had anything against makeup and dating. It's more that those behaviors are representative of her loss of innocence/faith and how you can communicate that in a story geared towards children.

    Now I do think the series warrants criticism for bemoaning that. It's definitely antiquated and doesn't sit well with our postmodern sensibilities. Also you could say that even using lipstick and boys as a negative symbol is currently in bad taste.

    It's like when your grandparents say something they shouldn't and you inwardly groan.
     
    Last edited: Mar 1, 2009
  14. Psychotic Cat

    Psychotic Cat Chief Warlock

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    Necro, much?


    That said, to be on topic I'm certain I remember reading somewhere about JKR saying that she felt anyone who knew of her Christian beliefs would see the Jesus!Harry ending coming a mile away.
     
  15. Knox

    Knox The Last Remnant DLP Supporter

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    Little late much?
     
  16. Psychotic Cat

    Psychotic Cat Chief Warlock

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    Would you believe me if I blamed it on really bad lag?
     
  17. Ryuugi Shi

    Ryuugi Shi Hierarch

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    No, not really.
     
  18. Xiph0

    Xiph0 Yoda Admin

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    It'd be original though.
     
  19. Nuhuh

    Nuhuh Dastardly Shadow Admin Retired Staff

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    Since, I only now saw this, and it's sorta alive again...

    Wtf!

    I am trying to resist it, but this is as bad as finding out Butcher based furies on pokemon. I never read an Alera book after that.

    God-Damn-it!

    Gay Dumbledore and Jesus! Harry...

    I don't think I can read/write fanfic anymore.
     
  20. Perspicacity

    Perspicacity Destroyer of Worlds ~ Prestige ~ DLP Supporter

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    Sure you can. Just write Satan!Harry. Or pornstar!Harry. How is JKR relevant to anything?
     
    Last edited: Mar 14, 2009
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