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Abandoned Harry Potter and the Boy Who Lived by The Santi - M

Discussion in 'General Fics' started by ulkser, Sep 11, 2009.

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  1. J22

    J22 Seventh Year

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    I honestly can't understand why people seem to like this so much. It's definitely readable and it was quite interesting pre-Durmstrang but now nothing's really happening.
     
  2. oephyx

    oephyx Headmaster DLP Supporter

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    Good scene. I agree with Sesc, I like how you're fleshing out the school description. The grading system isn't anything I seen before, and seems plausible.

    Calypso seems to be getting a lot of attention, plot-wise. You're doing her quite well, so I'll reserve judgement and see where this is going, but I wouldn't mind some variation.
     
  3. The Lord of Chaos

    The Lord of Chaos Slug Club Member

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    I liked it, just one quick correction.

     
  4. The Santi

    The Santi Professor

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    Fardeki: Yeah, I agree, the Calypso debate went on forever.

    Silens: Glad you liked it. This time of the year sucks for me, so I don't know how much more writing I'll be able to get in before the new year.

    Secs: The line about not letting people who fail borrow a book is partially inspired from a real experience in my high school. I was working on a research paper with a friend when he asked the librarian for a book. The librarian got up, went to where a group of freshmen were studying, took the book away from a student, and gave it to my friend. She explained to the freshman afterward why she took it away, but the 'WTF just happened' expression on the freshman's face was awesome and always stayed with me.

    J22: These first few chapters at Durmstrang are mostly for explaining the school and introducing new characters. The story will start picking up after first year.

    Oephyx: I'm trying to limit OCs in the story, which will result in more interaction between Harry, Viktor, Calypso, and Kira. The next chapter will hopefully be the last chapter for Year 1, and I'll be able to expand the plot a little more now that the explaining of Durmstrang and the introduction of OC is mostly out of the way. Still, get use to Calypso. She's a major character along with Viktor and, to a lesser extent, Kira.
     
  5. ZeroTheDestroyer

    ZeroTheDestroyer Auror

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    Not a bad chapter, I am just hoping the pace of this story doesn't turn out to be like that fic Dark Lord Potter. It felt like 2nd year would never come!
     
  6. MonCappy

    MonCappy Fifth Year

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    I for one hope they aren't malicious. I think making them like that would be somewhat predictable. I think her motives should be exactly what she laid out here. She needs an ally to survive at Durmstrang it seems, why not ally herself with one of the most talented students in her year group?
     
  7. Luda

    Luda Seventh Year

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    Good work as usual Santi. It'll be interesting to see Calypso's father's reaction when he finds out his daughter befriended a Potter.
     
  8. vlad

    vlad Banned ~ Prestige ~

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    And I'm just as curious as to what the Potter's response is going to be...

    Good scene, Santi. Others have hit the strong points, but I agree that going ahead and bringing the closure was the best move. Nice scene, realistically done. Detail of Durmstrang is tasteful and descriptive without being boring.
     
  9. Jigokuno

    Jigokuno Seventh Year

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    I still think this was all ridiculously over done and dramatic and it seems the dramatics were for nothing. You dragged this suspense about her last name for ages and then abruptly it is all over and it seems pointless.

    Why didn't she just say "Hi my name is Calypso Rosier I am nothing like my family and you should realize that because you are nothing like your family" then go on to point out their similarities at school

    That's what she ended up doing anyways so it is totally pointless to drag it out like you did across the entire chapter. Especially considering how shallow and ridiculous Krum's excuse for not telling Harry is.

    Seriously you created a dramatic annoyance in the story where their was absolutely no need.

    Once again though I seem to be the only one who found it absurd that they went through all that trouble to cover up her last name for no reason. She didn't have to wait forever to tell Harry that she was nothing like her family since Harry obviously would know something about being nothing like his family. I mean everyone expected him to act a certain way because of who his family is and she rightfully pointed that out. So why in the hell did you drag it out for the entirety of the chapter when she could have been honest and got the exact same results from her introduction.

    Maybe it is just my preference but ridiculous absurd over the top dramatics like this seem pointless to me. Especially considering how abrupt and undramatic it ended. It felt like the entire conflict was totally and utterly pointless and was not needed in the story. You could have spent this chapter further detailing Durmstrang and introducing the conflicts of the story and further showing Harry's interactions with his family but instead we spent the entire chapter waiting to hear this girls last name and now that we know it and see the ending the entire build up seems utterly pointless.

    Don't you think the fact that their was a whole conspiracy going on over keeping her last name from Harry was a bit silly? I mean I would be more suspicious of someone trying to keep their last name from me then I would someone simply being honest with me. She goes around threatening his friend to not tell him her name last(which is also absurd that he actually didn't tell Harry but we won't get into that) and then it all ends with her telling him and giving him a good argument for why she isn't evil only problem is she could have given that exact same argument without any of the drama when she first met Harry and the chapter could have focused on Harry's development as a wizard.

    ~Jigokuno ends his ranting realizing no one seems to agree with him but still can't seem to find it in him to see this chapter as anything but pointless~
     
    Last edited: Nov 25, 2009
  10. Duke

    Duke DA Member

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    Overall not a bad chapter. There were a couple of things that bugged me:

    In a previous segment Calypso comes off wrong. ChuckDaTruck pointed it out before, but she really doesn't sound like any kind of 11 year old girl. I think the closing scene with her is a significant improvement - a lot more personable and I do like how Harry is sidetracked by the sight of her room.

    Though that moment is a little awkward. I mean Calypso has (apparently) been pretty careful NOT to mention the name Rosier around Harry, and then she suddenly lets it drop like it's no big deal?
    She has no way of knowing that Harry found this out, so why drop the name in? She could just as easily have said "...not acceptable for me/for someone of my lineage/whatever."

    And Harry's transition from betrayed confusion to "Oooh, shiny spellwork!" was too abrupt. I like the idea that he is so into magic that just the sight of an impressive bit of spellwork would stop him in his tracks, but there is nothing to really show his change of emotions - one moment he is storming into her room and the next he is commenting on her wallpaper.

    Harry's emotions are shown a bit superficially - they are there, but you only scratch the surface of them. When he walks out on Victor - what is he feeling? Betrayed? Shocked? Angry? Sad? Furious? We can't really tell because all we have to go on is that he was little short with Victor and that he walked out - and then whatever those emotions are they are gone as soon as he barges into Calypso's room. He proceeds to have a discussion about room enlargement and then a nice chat with her about her family. WHERE ARE THE FEELINGS?! Why is Calypso so calm? Is she feeling anything? Does it bother her that Potter just brushed past her into her room? What about the time when Victor did the same? Doesn't that make her feel a little violated? Vulnerable? This is her private quarters.

    Going back to the previous scene:
    Her last name? It's not a huge mystery - oh it is to the reader, but it's not like the students don't know it, the professors. It's not really a secret it's just something that it never occured to Harry to find out. If he'd wanted to, it wouldn't have been hard - ask Victor. Ask the teachers or the librarian. Hell ask her. In fact your "average Durmstrang student" would have found out about her pretty damn quickly given the focus on families that seems to permeate the entire place. Harry is probably the only one in the damn place who doesn't really care what your last name is. You are building up a mystery where there isn't one. I think this will just annoy the reader rather than add believable tension to the story.
    Edit: Let me rephrase this a little - I don't have a problem with the whole mystery, but it shouldn't be centered around the last name. The name isn't important - just what it represents. It's very much in character for an 11 year old girl who is desperate for help and maybe a friend, to try to hide something that she can't really hide. But don't emphasize that what she is hiding is the last name and don't call Harry smart for figuring out that it's Rosier. Emphasize her feelings. Show some of that desperation. Show her indignation and helplessness at Victor. Use Victor to build the tension and imply that there is more to her befriending Harry than it seems. And once again - please show me that she is actually feeling something of her story.

    The grading system. It bothers me - not the system itself but the abbreviations. I mean Blood Traitor? What does that have to do with failing a class? Albus Dumbledore is a blood traitor, and he is the pre-eminent wizard of the day.
    It just seems like a heavy handed way to reinforce the idea that the whole school is based on prejudice. It's too obvious for me - it's like smacking the reader with: "You know, this school is so prejudiced, they won't even admit niggers! And if you fail a class we'll make your skin black! YEAH! AND THEN WE'LL LAUGH - HAHAHAHAHAHA! Nigger!"

    So the biggest issues with this story - which is original and well executed, and I like quite a bit - is the difficulty you have conveying feelings and that you tend to dumb down descriptions to get your point accross.

    Don't rely too much on cliches - Durmstrang may be run by a former Death Eater, but it's also one of the oldest schools of magic out there, it also educates children of at least part of the elite. Parent's are going to be mighty upset if they are children are routinely attacked in the halls and the faculty doesn't object. They'll also object to their Pureblood sons being called filthy things like muggles, and worse they will challenge the Headmaster/Teacher to a duel for implying that their blood is impure.

    Durmstrang as pictured in the movie (because the books don't really give any information on it beyond "it's a dark school") seems to be run more like a military academy with a headmaster who plays favorites rather than as a madhouse where the students can do as they please. I mean I would expect more in the way of harsh discipline and maybe hazing rather than students being singled out by the classmates to be attacked. Ostracized sure, but not routinely attacked.
     
    Last edited: Nov 25, 2009
  11. CosmosGravitation

    CosmosGravitation Professor

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    This was already brought up. It was rightly pointed out that Harry would have had to known her last name to find her room. A simple logical deduction would tell Calypso he already knew her last name.
     
  12. Duke

    Duke DA Member

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    Shrugs. Sorry I didn't see it being mentioned - but just because it's logical doesn't mean it makes sense. This is supposed to be an emotional confrontation - there isn't much room for cold calculating logic there, especially not when she is put on the spot like that.

    Humm.

    I can see it - thank you for pointing it out to me, I had completely missed it before - I just think that we need to see more feelings. Have Harry have to wait impatiently while Calypso hesitates in opening the door. Show Calypso trying to remain calm, calculating and logical - but struggling with feelings underneath that. The biggest thing for me is that right now she seems like a cardboard cut out - just an automaton reading lines - there aren't any feeling behind them. I don't know what she is feeling - maybe she is feeding Harry bull to get him to play along, maybe she is being honest - but either way she should be showing some emotion.
     
  13. Catman

    Catman DA Member

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    The reason nobody will agree with you is because your problems with the story are fucking absurd. Calypso was introduced in the first scene of this chapter, she tells Krum to shutup when he's about to reveal her last name, and then we learn it in the last scene. There was no suspense, the chapter was not full of Harry trying to secretly figure out her last name. He clearly didn't care, and in all honesty the reader should not be overly concerned with it. It will be something you are wondering about throughout the chapter because there is clearly some significance, and then what do you know Kira lets it slip at the end.

    And about there not being a need for the supposed mystery, I agree with Duke that this is an oppurtunity for character growth by showing the emotional motivation of hiding the last name and worrying about how Harry will react to it. There is a lot of potential there to show her as a 11 year old girl hoping to avoid potential devastating conflict with her new and maybe only friend.
     
  14. Jigokuno

    Jigokuno Seventh Year

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    The problem with this that excuse is they would be around each other for years to come so hiding your last name for that entire time is practically impossible. Her reasoning behind hiding it and her way of bringing Harry to accept her 99% of that could have been said within the first meeting. The only part of that convo at the end of the chapter that was needed to wait the entire chapter to find out was now that Harry has gotten to know her he can see she is not evil. Problem with that is the fact that to hide her last name for that time she has to practically lie to him and also threaten his only friend. So her showing him she is trustworthy by hiding her last name seems like a absurd way of going about things. Was she trying to prove her honesty and trustworthiness by practically lying to his face and threatening his friend about her last name? Think about it that part was the only part of the ending that needed to wait until the end of the chapter and that part was also the most illogical part of her entire reasoning behind hiding her last name and all the rest of her excuse was logical but could have been said immediately instead of waiting the entire chapter.
     
  15. Chaoticblues

    Chaoticblues Professor

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    Well to be fair, you are not thinking through the mind of an eleven year old who has been bullied and excluded by her fellow classmates. Add to that the sudden possibility of friendship that had never existed before, and I think any child would be self conscious enough to try and hide any flaws from a potentially new friend especially if Krum is any indication of the sort of prejudice she faces day to day. Anyhow, which eleven year old do you know that regularly thinks about the consequences of today's actions in years to come? I don't think many people that age are capable of that king of long-term planning and if she were, it would be more unrealistic than her hiding her last name imo.

    I don't really think of this whole situation as unnecessary or far-fetched at all.
     
  16. wolf550e

    wolf550e High Inquisitor DLP Supporter

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    "what you're parents would say" - your

    “So your brother is Evan Rosier?” - It would be better to change this to "So Evan Rosier was your brother?".

    "Most the school judged you" - most of the school

    "to hated me" - hate

    "dodging at get cursed" - and get cursed

    “It's not like either of our classmates will like us any less.” - the dining hall is public. Her father will hear about his daughter eatin with Potter within the hour.
     
  17. Jigokuno

    Jigokuno Seventh Year

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    Normally I would agree but two points make this hard to accept. One she is trying to hide her last name from a potential friend in a boarding school where everyone knows her name. Two the author made it obvious she planned this out ahead of time what with her scheming and her plans for Harry as well as her "chance" meeting with Harry in the library all put heavy emphasis on the fact that she had their meeting of each other planned so given these two things she MUST have known he would find out her name eventually so why not either tell him up front since she obviously planned the scheme out or if your going to try to hide your last name from someone at the very least come up with a good reason for it. Her reason in the end for hiding her last name was so that she had time to show Harry she was trustworthy....doesn't hiding her name from someone to show your trustworthy kinda destroy the purpose?

    If this had been a 11 year old chance encounter between them and she in haste hid her name because of the treatment she has had from other students I could understand it. However the author makes it very well known throughout the chapter that that is not the case. She had this well thought out and already had a ready answer when Harry confronted her about her last name. She made a well thought out argument that a 11 year old most likely couldn't have thought out without some advanced planning. Only problem is like I said the majority of the argument about her last name she could have told him upfront during their first meeting(since she obviously planned it out) and the one part about him getting to know her before finding out her last name is badly thought out because she seems to be trying to gain his trust by hiding her last name which like I said defeats the purpose.

    So I ask again what was the point of this chapter?
     
    Last edited: Nov 28, 2009
  18. Chaoticblues

    Chaoticblues Professor

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    Yeah I agree with that as well. I don't really think an 11 year old would be capable of that kind of planning, though maybe I was just a really stupid 11 year old lol.
     
  19. vlad

    vlad Banned ~ Prestige ~

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    Or maybe she's trying to just put it off for a while, to give herself a chance to make a first impression before Harry's view is skewed against her.

    Krum spilling the beans on their first true interaction could be disastrous - afterward, it becomes less of an issue. Sure, she probably had unrealistic expectations for how long she could hold out, but it wasn't for either of them the end of the world when it came to a head.

    And it's not like Santi made a great big cliffhanger out of it. She tried to hide it, she was marginally successful for a time, it didn't last, and they moved past it. All of this happened in one chapter. As has been said, it was long enough that when it first came out, it gave the reader a warning sign, but it wasn't some earthshattering mystery that was disappointingly anticlimactic.

    Keep in mind, while we've had to wait several days to come to the conclusion and had time to discuss it, reading it as it's meant to be read would give the reader all of five minutes until they got the answer - it's not a big deal. The biggest error Santi made is he probably should have held off and posted the two updates together to negate the whole point.

    But otherwise, it's fine. I like the OC's, I like the fact that there a tensions within the makeshift group, and I like the balance of describing the new school, the changes in Harry, the day-to-day life, and the pace of progression.

    Solid work.

    On another note, something else to consider. While at some point it's going to come out to Harry's parents that he's friends with a Rosier, the Dark Arts are also going to come out. I would be very surprised if with the leverage Dumbledore had over Karkaroff, he didn't require a little more detail into how Harry's progressing at the school. While Karkaroff could probably legitimately withhold most of the details, something as basic as 'what classes is Harry in' is most likely going to trickle back to Dumbledore/Potters before Harry would really like it to happen.

    In fact, given that Harry is going 'dark', I wouldn't be surprised if one of the rifts that turns future!Harry away from the boy who clearly loves his family is that not only does he lie to them about his involvement in something as serious as the dark arts, but they know through the back channels that he is lying.
     
  20. Ched

    Ched Da Trek Moderator DLP Supporter ⭐⭐

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    Great update.

    For the record I don't see anything as being overly dramatic or abrupt or anything else. To me the pacing is just fine.

    Also someone said that they felt things were getting old, or something along those lines, now that we had been at Durmstrang for a while. I have to wholeheartedly disagree there. My interest might have waned slightly from the original chapter or two, but only barely. The OCs are well written and interesting, and we still have connections (however tenuous) to Hogwarts and more familiar characters. Durmstrang itself continues to impress and hold interest because we are constantly getting more information about it, such as the neato grading system for final projects and whatnot.

    I look forward to more.
    Cheers
     
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