I'm getting slightly conflicting information on when it was created, both in terms of what year and in what order relative to Pervell's Ring. Most say it was created in sixth year though I found a source saying fifth year, and none of them had direct quotations to either the book or an interview.

Similarly, I get the idea that Pervell's ring was made during the summer break between fifth and sixth years, but how did he get away with underage magic use - plot hole or something?

 

Tom was two years older than Hagrid. Hagrid got expelled in his third year, so Tom was in his fifth year when he made the journal Horcrux from Myrtle (worth noting that he made the Horcrux without killing Myrtle himself, the basilisk did it.*)

Now it's known that Tom wore the Gaunt ring around the school and during his conversation with Slughorn about making a 7 part soul. He took the ring off after it was a Horcrux. This can be extrapolated to mean that he already had one Horcrux (the diary) and was curious if he could make a second (the ring).

*It's been said that JKR is going to tell us the process of creating a Horcrux and the spell involved when she releases her 'long planned' encyclopedia (pottermore?)

 

Thank you very much, Sesc, that's enormously helpful, but unfortunately turns out to be rather inconvenient in all possible ways. For my story, I'd need for him to have created the Diary first, and preferably in his sixth year. As it is, it seems unlikely that he obtained the ring during the summer between his sixth and seventh year, simply because he'd have been 17 by then.

Does the following seem internally consistent?

I can explain it away through him obtaining the ring between his fifth and sixth years, murdering his relatives in the process, him creating the Diary horcrux during his sixth year, then asking Slughorn about the question of seven during his seventh year - this way, he already knows about horcruxes (having created one) and this provides a great reason for the ring to disappear. The only problem is I'm not sure if canon contradicts him being a seventh-year during that conversation.

If there aren't any glaring inconsistencies there, I'll probably end up going with it and explaining the rest away as a creative interpretation of canon history. Hehehe.

I just realized that the whole thing runs smack-dab into the "horcrux as a weapon", indicating that the diary wasn't the first one, bit but since that was never conclusive, I'm going to ignore it.

 

Yeah... so I suppose my timeline is:

Obtains ring summer between fifth and sixth years
Makes Diary horcrux early in his sixth year, possibly wearing the ring to Slug Club meetings (high density of attacks/petrifications early on? conversation with Dippet..)
Makes ring horcrux later in sixth year, with some death other than Myrtle (maybe).

 

Actually, that works even better. Myrtle is completely irrelevant to my plot. That's probably what I'll go with if I ever have to end up explaining it in-story, thanks.

 

I like that you guys are trying to definitively tie down these events, and it shows to me that there are even more of the subtle inconsistencies in canon than I had recognized. Still, when it comes to writing a fanfic and using these events, you don't need to pull your hair out trying to find exact sequences of events when (1) the author admits she blows dicks at math, has had irreconcilable plot holes throughout the series, and has ret-conned the fuck out of things since DH came out, (b) anything we might know about which murders were used to create any of the Horcruxes is (admittedly, strong) deduction and guessing on the part of Dumbledore, and (c) it's a /fanfic/, for fuck's sake, so take any and all liberties you can either sort-of justify or even outright dismiss with a hand-wave and a cry of "author fiat!"

How's that for the longest sentence you're likely to read today?

To contribute and not just take the piss:

I'm positive Tom already knew plenty about Horcruxes when he sought out Slughorn to ask about the significance of their number. As we know, Tom was always a devious boy, and he would have made certain he had found as much info as he could before seeking another person's input, so of course he would ask Slughorn about them in as innocent and roundabout a way as possible, to keep Slughorn's suspicions at bay. He presents it as simple intellectual curiosity about something unknown, as if he'd just stumbled across this piece of soul magic while researching how best to help the poor or heal the sick.

And as far as /when/ a Horcrux must be made, I would argue that there's no time limit at all. Think about it - the only requirement for making one which we know for certain is that it requires a cold-blooded murder, an act which tears the soul. We also know that the soul can be reassembled, for lack of a better word, by feeling true remorse, according to Secrets of the Darkest Art. Since even at the end Voldemort scoffs at Harry's suggestion to "try for some remorse," I doubt old Tom ever felt enough to undo any soul tears, and so I'd imagine he could make a Horcrux at any time from just about any of his murders.

This is sort of contradicted by how Dumbledore and/or Harry surmise Voldemort's use of Frank Bryce's murder to make Nagini a Horcrux, implying that he needed a "fresh" murder to do so. Well, that's never explicitly stated anyway, and it's not as if Voldemort was actively seeking someone to kill; he killed Bryce because the man stumbled upon them in the house. And if LV *did* need a fresh murder, you could always say that this was because all his others were committed before being disembodied by a rebounding Killing Curse at Harry.

And there's no good reason why Myrtle's death couldn't be used, even though young Tom Riddle didn't kill her himself. He unleashed the Basilisk, which *did* kill her, so of course he's "responsible" for her death. It's not a crime of passion or an accident, and the Basilisk is merely the instrument Tom uses to kill her.

This is echoed when Diary!Tom orders the Basilisk to kill Harry in the Chamber, though granted, the spirit's incorporeal state doesn't allow for much in the way of another method. Diary!Tom knows that, as a baby, Harry defeated his older self, and obviously feels that killing Harry via Basilisk is the same as doing it with a wand, personally.

It's echoed again in DH, when LV kills Snape by proxy, this time using Nagini as the instrument. He believes that to gain control of the Elder Wand, he has to kill Snape, and if he thought ordering Nagini to do it wouldn't fit the criteria, he'd have destroyed Snape wand-to-wand without hesitation. This isn't like the "catspaws" favored by the White Court in The Dresden Files, since LV is directing his surrogate killers instead of trying to have them inadvertently, unknowingly or even reluctantly do his bidding.

It all comes down - again - to intent, see. Tom meant to kill someone and did it by Basilisk. Voldemort meant to kill Snape, and did through Nagini. Hell, he might even argue that he killed Dumbledore, because it was done on his direct orders. Draco - and ultimately Snape, or so LV believed - were his instruments, acting to carry out his will.

This isn't the case when it comes to killing Harry himself, but I could chalk that up to Voldemort's ego and the lingering humiliation of being brought low by baby Harry and his Mudblood mother.

Also, I agree that Tom was probably a Sixth Year when he asks about Horcruxes and is wearing the Gaunt ring, because of the things already mentioned. It also subtly shows Tom's charisma and drawing power, in that he is revered by the other boys despite not only being probably half-blood, but being younger than some as well.

So yeah, it's nice to hash out the time-line as best we can, but if you want to write it a certain way, then do it and just make your story as internally consistent as you can.

There's plenty of leeway when talking about Horcruxes anyhow, since what we know in detail is scarce. I doubt there's a potion involved, and I don't think there's an actual ritual either. The only "ritual" we see in canon is Voldemort's rebirthing one, and then only if you squint. Wormtail essentially cooks up an uber-potion that would best be described as "Disembodied? Amaze your friends and surprise your foes! Brew yourself a not-quite-good-as-new meat-sack in three easy steps! Requires two helpers - one willing, one not so much - and a parent. Patent pending." Wormtail recites some very specific lines in the course of this, so that's why I would classify it a quasi-ritual.

 

We'll be getting the "official" method of creating a horcrux when JKR's new website comes out, but I don't really care about contradicting that.

And, now that I think about it, having the ring made first solves some other problems though I guess it might be considered lazy. Speaking of which, does anybody want to beta for me? I'd like some help fixing my story up for whenever the DLP Romance contest roles around (and I do hope they get around to it eventually) in addition to working out some plot points. I'd be willing to help beta one (or more) of your stories in return.

 

I don't think this is a contradiction at all. Additionally to what you said (LV didn't exactly search Frank Bryce out to kill him), I remember reading that using Nagini to kill Frank Bryce only reminded LV that he could, in fact, make Nagini a Horcrux, to get his coveted number of seven Horcruxes. Sure, that was Dumbledore talking, but in such matters, I'm inclined to believe what Dumbledore says.

@T3t: I'd volunteer as beta, if you really needed it. Pretty sure there are people better suited for that job, though.

 

Rowling actually told who were killed for the horcruxes in an interview.

Diary - Myrtle
Ring - Riddle Sr.
Locket - Random prostitute
Cup - Smith
Diadem - Albanian farmer
Nagini - Bertha Jorkins

He probably created his first horcrux before killing his father, or he'd would've used one of his grandparents for the diary. This would mean his first horcrux was created before he talked with Slughorn, so the 16 year old Voldecrux wouldn't have known his future self created several more. It does seem to be the case, that the creation of the horcrux doesn't need to follow directly after the murder. Voldemort was able to wait untill after his conversation with Slughorn to turn the ring into one. His use of Jorkins however seems to indicate that the window of opportunity can pass with time, although it's possible he simply didn't have the chance to create his final horcrux before he killed her.

Fun Fact: You have to use a spell and a ritual to create a horcrux. This means Harry never was a true horcrux. Or a faulthy one in any case. I'd like to think this is why he got those headaches and was able to look into Voldemort's head. Normal living horcruxes (Nagini) were probably different, which is why Voldemort never realised Harry had a piece of his soul.

 

Argh, my brain. I think at this point I'm just going to go with what works best for the story and blame JKR for all the historical confusion. If it turns out to be slightly AU later, I don't really care.

 

I'm not doing it for no reason; using one of the given order of events would require a lot of wrangling of the story in other places and if I can avoid that with a few slight changes I will.

I could use one of those time-lines, but it would probably fuck up the flow of the story it I had to work around them.

But yeah, in general I agree with keeping things as close to canon as possible if there aren't good reasons to change it.