2. is kind of annoying, but thats mostly the angst, not the 'mask' that I have the problem with.

3. in particular makes me angry. First Try was pretty enjoyable, then the author derailed the whole story trying to go through canon again with a different Naruto. Happens fucking everywhere.

You can rationalize it with Kakashi wanting to teach Minato's son and having to teach the Sharingan, but its pretty weak and most of the time makes no sense. And of course, even with those reasons, the third member is always Sakura.

Goddamn that is annoying.

 

True. There's a large amount of canon backing for claiming that aspects of Naruto's early-series behavior was mostly just attention whoring rather than being the real him, and the whole Dark Naruto thing made it pretty clear that he has some buried anger and resentment towards Konoha.

However, there's a big difference between the canon mask of "put on a happy face and try not to dwell on the negative" and the fanfic-cliche of him hiding an entirely different personality under his mask and constantly wangsting about how nobody understand him.

 

This one isn't so bad, though. Work with the basics and create your own world and their developments. Much better than just putting together your favorite characters in one team (Naruto, Lee & Kiba).

Then read mine. :awesome

 

Oh, this one pisses me right the fuck off, the CRA [Clan Restoration Act] Whoever made that should have their skin flayed from their body and burned to death.

 

Absolutely! I mean his father was a Namikaze, meaning he is basicly, a nobody. No bloodline, no history,etc.
While his mother was an Uzumaki. Who were known for their longevity,closeness with senju, who had a village of their own, and as if it was not enough all the leaf ninja wears the Uzumaki symbol. But the moment they learn he is a Namikaze; Oh you gotta marry atleast six woman and have meaningless sex with them,(even though I like that part. it just ruins the story's flow when its meaningless) sometimes orderly sometimes not so orderly. It won't matter if she is some village's kage, or a daimyo, or someone who has absolutely no meaning to plot, as the only thing that matters is the GREAT NAMİKAZE CLAN must survive!!!

 

I agree on what you said but definatly not how you said it. His father was the first person to ever get a flee on sight warning and I have seen a few where it is for the Uzumaki to survive. The Kage/Daimyo thing I do agree on with what you said, but why would the council care who it was that had his child, so long as the child had the chance of becoming as powerful as his grandfather. And, I can definatly see Hiashi trying to force the matter so that he can have the Namikaze genes in the Hyuga clan.

But yes I agree about Namikaze clan (of which ther is no evidance in canon, so I suppose that could be a clichè. And I despise it when their attitude towards him literally changes at the knowledge of him being son of Minato.

I am surprised nobody posted this clichè: Nagato and Kushina either being siblings, cousins or Aunt + Nephew.

 

Well Nagato is a Uzumaki so him being Kushina's cousin is possible. Calling Sasuke's hair a duck ass, and him having a stick up his ass is always an annoying cliche, people are pretty hard on him nowadays.

 

Still, the flee on sight thing was because of the Hiraishin, and that was the man's personal accoplishment, intellectually. Meaning, sure the man had his affinity with seals but he didn't get it from his clan.

 

Word, Kushina stated she taught him some sealing, don't remember which chapter it was though.

 

And there was the thing about the seal minato used to seal kyuubi, it was Uzumaki style or something( if I remember it right or all those fanon stuff really fucked up with my canon knowledge)

 

Cliche: Sasuke bashing. Just because he's a dick in canon doesn't mean he has to be in fanfiction. He was a decent guy between the start of the Chuunin Exams and his defection. If you don't like him, then don't write him.

 

In all honesty, Sasuke wasn't that bad before the curse seal. He did protect Naruto from Haku's attack during that fight. But there's just so much Sakura/Sasuke bashing nowadays. In fact, its like besides Shino, Hinata, and Naruto, the rest of the rookie 9 are just complete retards and stupid. Kiba is the mutt, Sasuke is the duck butt, Ino and Sakura are the screeching banshees, Chouji gets no screen time, and Shikamaru is either sneezing because somebody said "How troublesome", or he gets his own usual one liner.

Of course, there are exceptions, but the bad ones far outweigh the good ones as usual.

 

To be completely and totally fair, Sasuke was actually an interesting, if not necessarily likeable, character all throughout part 1. Up through the last big fight at the valley, I actually liked him as a character. He made a very nice contrast to Naruto, and worked quite well as a plot device.

The problem is that (apparently) most people think they must like all the good guys, and so he was relegated to a "generic jackass" role.

Then part 2 came out and he's become absurdly powerful for no discernible reason and he's lost any and all semblance of rationality. This just served to even further devolve his role in the fandom and generally fucked him over.

 

The most irritating part of bashing is that these authors often use fanon stereotypes. Sasuke in canon didn't really whine at all, and the only times he flipped out was when Itachi was around or because of the curse seal. Fanon has him constantly whining like a bitch and being randomly crazy, but his character has so much more potential.

And Kakashi, I dont get the hate surrounding his character. So many fics make him out to be almost evil or grossly incompetent as a teacher. His team of rookies almost aced the chunin exams in canon, where does the stereotype come from?

Eh, I dont get a lot of things about the Naruto fandom, but bashing in particular makes no sense. What purpose does dumping bullshit on a fictional character serve, apart from ruining fics?

 

Word, Sasuke became gay after the Itachi fight imo.

 

I agree on the Sasuke bit, but some (nowhere near all, but some) of the hate on Kakashi is justifiable. I don't really agree with it, but the general argument about it is that you only see Kakashi actually train them once, and that's for the tree walking skill. Kakashi is portrayed in canon as regularly being upwards of half an hour late and being a rather laidback, or even lazy, individual. I actually think Kishimoto just didn't bother to show any training, but since it's only implied, some people miss it entirely.

Also, Ron the Death Eater may be able to help explain the latter. Mostly it's just people seeking cathartic release for whatever stupid reason.

 

TBH Berk the only thing we saw Kakashi teach before the Chuunin Exams is tree walking. He may be a bit lazy but I like Kakashi laid back but still badass. Sasuke was always just quiet, he wasn't loud about his angsting a lot of but I know why people hate him. The reason WHY they hate him is because he is a pawn, manipulated by everyone, Itachi, Orchimaru, and Madara. Although I like his character more than Naruto's he is irrational and easy to manipulate.

 

Have to say I bought into (as a reader) the Kakashi as terrible teacher/Sasuke-favourer bashing cliche back when it was at its height a few years ago, but it annoys me now. Like most bashing it's a bit of a story dead-end, wastes a good character (or two if the writer goes the way of Sasuke being Kakashi's favourite and bashing both of them at once) and yes, it makes more sense that he did train Team 7 a lot more than was shown in the manga/anime - he just didn't teach them any specific techniques other than tree walking.

Edit: and even if the canon-truth is that all the training we saw was all the training that happened, it's frankly more helpful/convenient for that not to be the case. In just about any canon, sometimes it's better to ignore certain things.

 

Highly agree with Tinder. Fandom really likes to see how many uber nin there are and assume that if you aren't A-rank anfter two weeks of training, you are somehow a terrible teacher.

May I remind you that in canon, no matter how ridiculous it is, there are upwards of 10,000 ninja in each major village. About 80% are Genin and Chunin, with only 20% ever making it to Jounin. Considering that, there at literally thousands of Jounin out there, but there have only been about a hundred or so truly legendary ninja in the last century. Naruto deals with that upper 20% and the legendary ninja pretty much exclusively, so its very easy for fandom to simplify the vast majority of shinobi life into 'academy graduate' and 'major badass'. Until at least a few years after graduation, ninja are supposed to be weak, inexperienced greenhorns.

Considering those stats, and that Team 7 were your basic academy graduates, in less than a year, Kakashi had these kids ready to take the Chunin exams, a test so hard that inevitably over 90% of the kids fail, and a large amount never pass. By this time the kids have improved by a shit ton since Kakashi took them, and over far less time than their improvement rate at the academy, so fuck self-improvement as well.

So in the manga he didn't fucking baby them through every step of their training on camera, this makes him a fucking shit teacher and a dick to boot? Yeah, even if the guy was an hour late to team training, how does this make him bad at it? Shit, thats the most arbitrary judge of teaching talent I've ever seen, in most cases if you want to evaluate a teacher you don't judge what time he gets there, but how good his students are, and they're pretty damn good.

I've just chosen Kakashi because I find it the most ridiculous, but most bashing, and reasons for bashing don't really have any canon basis, its just the internet hate machine letting people vent on fictional characters who don't argue back. (eg, most of the Sasuke bashing transplants his part 2 personality onto his part 1 self, and though this makes bashing him much easier, it by no means makes sense.)

 

I would say Kakashi is a BAD teacher but we don't know how people train their students in Naruto, we haven't seen any other teams training. He taught them tree walking and thats it, but who knows maybe other teams just do D-Ranks for a year than learn tree walking. There is no Canon for it so people bash, IMO they're just jealous that Kakashi can read porn in public and they cannot. So Hah