Voldemort made enough Inferi to fill a small lake. There's nothing in canon that says it's hard to make them, either. All we know is that it's (presumably) illegal to do so.

 

Whenever two or more people gather in my name, I shall be there.

For the record, I made a post for the spell creation thread. It just so happened that Minion closed it just as I was posting.

...he then re-opened it once the coast was clear. Fffffff-

ANYWAY.

Good posts by Sesc and wordhammer. Three things are worth emphasising:

1. Compared to Muggle warfare, wizarding warfare doesn't care much about location or territory. Wizards have minimal infrastructure or industry, and the infrastructure they do have (Ministry bureaucracy) exists in the form of labour and so can be easily recreated in another location, so long as the people survive. Given the relative importance of labour compared to land or industry, wizards will be much more willing and able to abandon locations rather than entering into a battle. Add to this the mobility magic creates and there's really no logical reason to enter into a pitched battle rather than run, unless you think that your side has a significant chance of victory. If you don't think you have the advantage, there's relatively little cost to simply relocating and trying again another day. The bigger cost is to enter that battle and lose your labour resources.

2. The breadth of wizarding talent. It's not entirely clear exactly how many average wizards someone like Dumbledore could take in a fight before he was overwhelmed by numbers, but it appears to be pretty high. His dispatch of 4 wizards in OotP was completely effortless, for starters. And in DH, the only thing stopping Voldemort from completely destroying McGonagall, Shacklebolt and Slughorn was the protection spell created by Harry's faux sacrifice (the book mentions Voldemort landing multiple hits on each of them, so apparently he's capable of dispatching them pretty rapidly). So talk of armies and formations etc. should keep in mind that wizards are essentially lone (were)wolves with unique ability sets.

3. From what we can see, destruction is easier than creation when it comes to magic. There is no counter for the Killing Curse, for example. Fiendfyre can pull apart magical objects that took years to make in seconds. Someone like Goyle can cast such a powerful destructive spell, but only the most talented wizards can perform impressive creative feats with magic (e.g. casting of the Fidelius charm, creation of enchanted objects, to a lesser extent the Patronus charm). This imbalance between defense and offense further establishes the idea that fortified locations are not the way wizarding warfare should go. No matter what protections you raise, Goyle might come along and drop his wand next to them. It also stresses the need for stealth and mobility: if you can't be sure of protecting a location, the best defense is secrecy and the ability to abandon that location if discovered.

 

I'd like to note that even though anti-Portkey wards aren't mentioned in canon, it's safe to assume they exist. See book 4.

While wizards do have incredible ease of mobility, countermeasures are certainly possible. Then again, this only emphasizes Taure's point: secrecy and stealth are more important than powerful fortifications.

 

It does seem that there is no such thing as a defenders advantage when it comes to magical warfare, but I have to ask. Other the it's symbolic nature and the fact it was packed full of kids/hostages, it Hogwarts of any value. I honestly can't remember what, if anything, is said about it's wards from canon, and fanon has them being everything from impenetrable shields to swiss cheese city. We know the castle's walls aren't impenetrable (Fred's death), and it looks to be designed more as a livable castle (with windows cut into otherwise solid walls) then it does fortress.

 

I think Ollivander's kidnapping from canon is a good example of wizarding warfare. Taking him was the equivalent of taking an strategically important position in non-magical warfare. There are other positions (and other wandmakers) but the loss is a major blow to Voldemort's opposition.

 

Some interesting points all around. Just wanted to point out one thing that struck me as interesting if you're looking to write a story about war within the wizarding world:

If a Muggle army is overcome and the opposition conquers the city/location, the civilians left alive are powerless and at the mercy of the invading army. If a "wizard army" takes a key location, everyone within that building or town will be carrying a gun, even children as young as 11.

 

This made me think of Igor Karkaroff and the castle of Durmstrang for some reason. So Igor turned in some of his fellows to get out of Azkaban and somehow ends up as the Headmaster of the more Dark Arts oriented magical school. Let's say Igor figured that was his trump card when Voldemort returned and instead of running, went with Snape to Voldemort two hours later. Karkaroff could have effectively saved himself from the potential death warrant on his head by handing Riddle, Durmstrang on a silver platter. Granted it isn't Hogwarts with his horcrux hidden inside but it might have been a start. And perhaps Voldemort could have found something belonging to Grindelwald inside somewhere. Anyway, my point is having Durmstrang under his rule at his return would've had strategic value.

 

I think you're making a few bad assumptions here. 1) Just because Voldemort hid something at Hogwarts doesn't mean that Grindelwald hid something at Durmstrang. 2) Having Durmstrang under his rule would have had strategic value - for the other side. Taking Durmstrang would have brought him into conflict with the Ministry/Ministries who have students there, opening up a multi-front war. I think Hitler showed how well that tends to work out. Also, remember Durmstrang expelled Grindelwald so it stands to reason that the school (and the Ministries) draw the line somewhere despite being pro-Dark Arts. 3) What's to stop Voldemort from killing Karkaroff once he has Durmstrang?

 

Nobody ever said Voldemort was a rational agent, but killing your followers for handing you hundreds of hostages on a silver platter strikes me as something beyond his canon insanity.

 

I was more thinking that he'd kill Karkaroff to show that betrayal is never forgiven.

 

Sort of like saying Candyman three times in a mirror?

Anywho, interesting stuff. I'll see if I can provide some rebuttal.

It would seem that while the labour force is easily moved, not all of the creations of the labor force can simply be transported at a moment's notice. Hogwarts, the Department of Mysteries, and the Floo Network are some examples. That said- I agree that there wouldn't be many pitched battles, if any. The closest thing I could see would be delaying actions to preserve information or allow others to escape. I suspect that the doctrines any self-styled 'War Wizards' would follow have some similarities to modern urban combat tactics, as Bill Door suggested.

Sure, Dumbledore and Voldemort are both titans among ants, but even they cannot be everywhere at once. From what we can see, they're literally one in a million geniuses. For the purposes of this argument, pointing at Voldemort and Dumbledore is rather like saying all other bombs are obsolete because nuclear weapons exist.

On the unique skill sets, this speaks mostly to how they were trained, I suspect. The kids from Harry's little class did seem to use a lot of the same spells. Also, aside from a handful of spells, most lethal hexes and curses work closely enough that the difference between them is almost entirely academic.

This is where I disagree with you a bit. Enchanted objects are easy enough to make that school-age children can make them: The Marauder's Map, Fred and George's shield hats, and Hermione's super tough glass jar are all good examples. To me, this suggests that most people can do it, but simply do not want to learn how.

It seems to me that if Fiendfyre was such an easy answer, then people would be using it a bit more. I seem to recall that Fiendfyre is fairly risky to use, and requires continuous, focussed control. This means the caster is a sitting duck while they're using it.

Also, Secrecy is a questionable defense at best in a world where Legilimency, Veritaeserum, and the Imperius exist.

 

All I was saying is that there was thee possibility of Grindelwald leaving something there; afterall Gellert is Tom's predecessor there may have been a likeness there. With Durmstrang under his rule I don't mean him actually there as Headmaster. He didn't do that with the Ministry or Hogwarts, why change then. I meant Karkaroff or some other pardoned Death Eater there provided Voldemort killed Igor. Never said he wouldn't kill him but there's a possibility of not being killed... Tom can be merciful sometimes though you'd probably be tortured instead. And he already had Regulus Black as the 'no betraying me', my Death Eaters.

 

One thing that occurs to me on the subject of magical warfare: considering what people have said about the low wizarding population and the fact that in many ways people are the most valuable resource in the wizarding world, it's likely that traditional magical warfare is fairly low-casualty. After all, magic has plenty of options for non-lethal subdual, and the wizarding just can't afford to lose very many people in conflict. Considering the common figure for total number of wizards in Britain is around 3000 wizards total, every death hurts.

Presumably, that would mean magical conflicts are focused on capturing people and forcing submission, rather than outright killing. Captured hostages provide leverage over their families, or could be used to force a change of sides or extract other concessions.

This would also explain why Voldemort's followers became so feared; because they would use lethal force at the drop of a hat. If you opposed a standard Dark Lord like Grindelwald, the worst that's likely to happen is having a family kidnapped and held hostage until you agree to stop opposing him. Speak out against Voldemort, and he'll kill you and your entire family. Voldemort and his followers did the Wizarding equivalent of throwing the Geneva Convention out the window.

 

I like that idea for why Voldemort and his followers were particularly feared. Leads to some quite interest world building possibilities.

 

For a more accurate analogy, replace "nuclear weapons" with "MOAB".

One of the reasons nuclear weapons haven't made other weapons (of war) obsolete is because no one really wants to use them. If they didn't poison the earth and air, and horribly burn and mutate the flesh of anyone unlucky enough to survive the main blast, then maybe we'd have seen a few more of them used...

So there was never any chance of nuclear weapons rendering others obsolete... unless someone uses them to kill everyone on earth, which would in fact render other weapons obsolete. Then again, that would render clothing, chairs, hospitals, video games, animal husbandry, bookmarks, blankets, teapots, and chocolate oranges obsolete as well.

No one's afraid to field Dumbledore because he's going to poison the earth for a few centuries.

Admittedly, it's a nitpick, but I felt compelled to point it out.

 

FTR the first few posts in this thread summed it up exactly. I wrote this story and it doesn't work. I had to change canon to form even the slightest semblance of logic and it still didn't work.

 

You sound bitter, and slightly egotistical. "If I can't do it, no-one can!"

Look, I came into this trying to see what wizarding war could be. The sense I'm getting is that it would strongly resemble pieces of modern combined arms tactics, Vietnam-era guerilla tactics, and urban warfare. My question isn't whether or not war can happen with a community as small as Wizarding England, say 3000-6000 wizards. I was curious how wizarding magic, as represented in Canon, might be used in a purely magical war. (You say it can't happen, I snicker at you and move on.)

The first couple of posts jumped on the bandwagon that Sesc built, who did miss my point a little. Canon is nowhere near a war. It has several events that could correlate to battles, but what I'm really talking about is, as MystShadow put it, "how the conflict is shaped."

Canon is basically one magical sucker punch after another until it escalates to a rapid fire succession of political coups, and culminates in a banana peel joke. Voldemort and Dumbledore never tried to bring their conflict onto a level of real war; in fact, I'd argue that it was almost certainly a conscious decision on both their parts.

Voldemort was about living out his revenge fantasy, torturing everyone as much as he believed himself to be hurt. He installed a minister in office that allowed him to do whatever he wanted, and in turn allowed the Death Eaters to act as a secret police. Oddly enough, Voldemort wanted to own Magical Britain, so that he could do whatever he wanted to it, not rule it. Escalating the conflict would be a pointless exercise that could draw in more countries and make it impossible for him to win.

On the other hand, Dumbledore was looking for everyone to get along peacefully, and every action he planned was to contain the conflict and keep it at a Cold War level. My read on Dumbledore is that he wanted to keep Voldemort's return from death a bit of a secret; at the very least he wanted it compartmentalized to his people. That's where Harry bollixed all of Dumbledore's strategies in Canon by running his mouth every thirty seconds.

But frankly, that is neither here nor there.

---------
A Basic Treatise on Killing Shite with Wizards and Not Being a Wanker, as written by Bertrand B. Bellicuss​

---------​

-Never, ever field wizards alone. One wizard is an easy target and too fucking valuable to lose carelessly.

-Cast silently, you felchbag!

-Wizards work well in groups of three or more. One shields, one fires off offensive spells, and one keeps any fodder you've got alive. The rest double up, which is damn nice. Stick pretty close together too.

-Fodder is good as a distraction by itself, but it doesn't pack a lot of punch without support. Fiendfyre can wipe out hordes of Fodder, but leaves the caster vulnerable to any shite you throw at him. If you've got fodder, make sure you can get it fucking cheap because it will die fast. Goblins don't make great fodder, because there aren't that many of them, really. Garden Gnomes, on the other hand, are pretty fucking awesome when you make them bigger and give them some better teeth. Best way to get rid of the buggers I've found so far.

-Don't ride Imperio'd Dragons when your opponent is slinging Avada Kedavras around like cheap candy. Casting spells while falling is a pain in the ass.

-Apparation is fucking key. Never be afraid to run away- it ain't the coward's way out. Dying is the fucking coward's way out or the fool's way out, depending on how you die. That said, never apparate into somewhere blind. It's begging to kicked in the nadgers by a trap. Portkeys are pretty good too, but they can be stolen and then you've just given your enemy the keys to your shit. On a similar note, Anti-Theft charms are shit- either too expensive to do right or too weak. Don't bother with them. Too fucking easy to get around: Imperio.

-There are few places that are actually strategically important, and for the most part it's about maintaining a certain amount of wands. Wandwood groves are important, one-of-a-kind shit like Hogwarts is important, potions ingredient farms are important, magical animal preserves are pretty important, but otherwise magic can replace almost anything you'd care to lose. The major resource in Wizarding War is far and away the wizards themselves. It's all about the secrets you know, and the ones your enemies don't.

-Turning somebody's robes to lead is cute, but stupid. Turn them to acid and then kill the shite out of them as they're writhing on the ground in pain like a wanker. Stunners are fine- just remember to kill them right after.

-Strip a wizard of their wand, and they're just an occasionally lucky muggle. Don't get cocky because you can cast spells. You can die just as easy as the next man if you're not careful. Sure, you can channel your magic through any object, but a wand versus a stick is no contest at all.

-Just because your opponent can't see you, doesn't mean he can't kill you or doesn't know you're there. Just to be safe, stay invisible, silent, ready to apparate at a moment's notice, and behind cover whenever possible.

-Best thing about fire is that if the fire doesn't kill you, the smoke will. So if you get caught by muggles and they try to burn you, don't forget your Bubblehead Charm, you wanker.

-When fighting a bunch of wizards all in one big ball- run if you can. If you can't, stealth, speed, and surprise are your best tools. Next you want to split them up and confuse them so they don't know their arse from breakfast time. The Confundus Charm is pretty key here- it's actually better than the Imperius because it doesn't require as much concentration. Get them to fight themselves, and half of your work is done.

-Morale is a big part of Wizarding Warfare. Possibly the biggest. If your people believe they're invulnerable, unstoppable, and right- you're be shocked how often they actually win. Even if they're a bunch of wankers. If they think they're gonna lose, it will affect their spellcasting and they will lose. Anything you can do to keep your troops confidence at a reasonable level is your best strategy.

 

Y'know, maybe the question should be framed differently; if you want to conjecture what battlefield magic would like, give the magicals an enemy that requires it.

In other words, if an alien invasion prompted the ICW to revoke the Statutes of Secrecy in order ensure the survival of all, what would that look like? You could use enemies that are more swarm-like to prevent mind magics from having much effect on tactics. The bugs from the Starship Troopers film or one of the recent invader templates (from Battle:Los Angeles or Skyline) might provide a good example.

 

I probably should have framed it differently. I do have a habit of only writing a small portion of what I want to say. Third time's a charm, right?

How could wizarding magic, as portrayed in Canon, be used effectively on and off the battlefields of a magical war? How would this conflict be shaped and what are the strategically important goals?

I am not interested in why there cannot be a magical war, or why magic cannot be used in war, or why muggles would totally beat wizards in a war, or vice versa. For this purpose, assume that an alternate universe of wizards with magic that's suspiciously similar to Harry Potter Magic is invading.

 

A total magical war divorced from all context? Okay.

Idea one. Portkey large heavy things into orbit and let the fall down. Use Unbreakable and Flame-Freezing Charms to let it survive re-entry and gain maximum kinetic energy. Using Flying, Summoning and/or Banishing Charms to guide it down with pinpoint position. For extra points, use magic to mess about with your large heavy thing's mass. Congratulations, could can now use nuclear level kinetic kill weapons.

Random idea two. Self-replicating magical devices. In canon, the Gemino Curse duplicates an object when it's touched, seemingly including the Gemino Curse itself. Use a similar spell (or possibly just the Gemino Curse) and create magical von neumann machines. Each machine transfigures all nearby matter into copies of itself, which then do the same, which then do the same. The rate of the expansion is going to be fast when its gets going (not exponential, since the machines near the centre of the mass won't have things to transfigure, but that hardly matters). Depending on your machine, you could turn an enemy's country to sand or create an every expanding army of golem warriors.

Random idea three. AI attacks drones. The magical world can create artificial intelligences, from the Sorting Hat, to Wizarding Paintings to the Flying Ford Anglia. All have shown the ability to think and act from themselves, and all have shown the ability to interact physically with their environment. Take some Frisbees, cast the flying charm on them, stick a magical AI inside each and enchant the edges with Cutting Charms. You can now have intelligent armed forces independent of population. Wizards would take technical and supply roles while their creations battled each other.What something bigger than Cutting Charms? How about charming them to shoot of Blasting Curses or bolts of lightning. Hell, go full muggle can just use Banishers to move bits of metal really fast.

Idea four. Custom magical creatures. Breed some really deadly magical creatures and contagions. Transfiguration can be used to create entire magical species. The Quintaped, a five star wizard killer ranked alongside the likes of Basilisks and Dragons, were created by a nights of drunken casting; what could wizards achieve if they really set their minds to it? How about apparating AIDS?

What would full on magical warfare look like? I don't know, but five minutes later it could look like a post-apocalyptic wasteland, filled with self-replicating, hunter-killer Frisbees, each capable of calling in nuclear level kinetic kill strikes. All biological life would've been wiped out by a magical bioweapon capable of spreading, well, magically fast. Most of this probably wouldn't really work (for the same reason WW2 America can't create an Orion Drive spaceship just because they have atomic bombs and submarines) but what do I care? You want war and WMDs are warfare.