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Points of Divergence

Discussion in 'Fanfic Discussion' started by Skeletaure, May 10, 2013.

  1. mknote

    mknote 1/3 of the Note Bros. DLP Supporter

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    A terrible fanfic already did this. It was called Harry Potter and the Deathly Hallows.

    This has been done before as well. Now, as to how well it's been done, that's a different matter [FONT=&quot]–[/FONT] it's on my favorite stories list on ff.net, so I must have liked it enough, but its been years since I've read it, and perusing it to make sure it was the story I thought it was left me... underwhelmed.

    Achievement get, Post Whore!

    One thing I'd like to see done more (I've only really seen it done twice) is a good Peter Pettigrew. I don't really understand why, I just do. The divergence in the second linked story seems good enough, barring the last line (which is ugh).
     
  2. Anarchy

    Anarchy Half-Blood Prince DLP Supporter

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    Haven't read all the posts, but I'll list some of the ones I've used, and some others that I can think of off the top of my head.

    Year 1 Sorting: Perhaps the most obvious one. The only downside is that it's year one, and there are very few year one fics that are interesting, and actually make it through all the years. It's a very ambitious undertaking, one that I have attempted myself but never got very far.

    Year 1 Stone chamber. I've seen a few different ones, whether it's Harry going alone or taking different people, or it really was Snape stealing the stone, or that dumbledore is manipulative and that the stone is a fake, and he set Harry up.

    Year 2. I'm not a fan of any divergences that start here. If you're going to start this year, you might as well just start year one and do a complete story. I've seen a few where Harry really is the Heir of Slytherin, but that always seems to end up as slash. Of course, there's the old cliche of Harry finding a library of hidden knowledge in the chamber and that changes his life and makes the story unreadable

    year 3. I'm not a huge fan of divergences here either. That includes Sirius being guilty of the crimes he's commited, and Harry actually killing Sirius, or allowing them to kill Wormtail. Wormtail being killed isn't that bad of a divergence, since it forced the entirety of Year 4 to be different, at least it should be to be a compelling story.

    Year 4 is probably my favorite divergence spot, because it's when Harry finally starts to do shit. I like it when there actually is only 3 champions and Harry got picked over Cedric. Other things that tend to happen is figuring out Moody put his name in earlier, or that it's actually the real Moody that turned traitor. I've also seen a few divergences that start with Harry in the graveyard not being able to escape due to weird portkey rules, and either Cedric lives and they fight off wormtongue and escape, or Harry takes the cup for himself, or harry and someone else take the cup.

    5th year is uhg. Most of the divergences for this actually start during the summer after 5th year after Sirius dies, though there are divergences where Sirius lives, or Harry starts 'training' once Voldemort rises, and there's about a billion fics where slytherin girl of choice tries to escape her families dark past and runs to Harry, then buttsecks.

    Year 6. The most common divergence is to just skip canon altogether and write something interesting, whether it's hunting horcruxes earlier (or ignoring the idea of a horcrux altogether) or looking into the hallows a year early and discovering Dumbledores past. There's also fluffy divergences, such as this is the best year to pair up Harry and Luna, wether or not their friendships grows more after the DoM, or they start to date for real after the Slug Club party. I don't mind this, as long as it's an interesting read, since there's severe lack of good HP/LL

    Year 7 has the most potential, of course. Replace the camping months with pretty much anything. Or, have Harry go at it alone, be more proactive and fight rather than hide, assassinate some Death Eaters, bang Daphne Greengrass, etc. Hell, you can just write Harry going to Hogwarts for the year and it would be a whole new story
     
  3. Sesc

    Sesc Slytherin at Heart Moderator

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    Harry kills Snape at the end of HBP.

    VotN used this as a premise, but I haven't seen a full story with it.
     
  4. yak

    yak Moderator DLP Supporter Retired Staff

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    Ariana's death sets Albus and Gellert Grindelwald on their very different paths through life. So, what if it had never happened? If Aberforth hadn't confront Albus then there'd never have been a fight and Ariana would'nt have died.

    Albus was convinced that wizards should rule muggles for their own good - for the greater good - and with he and Gellert working together, they could've achieved great and terrible things.

    That's the problem I suppose - it breaks canon so much that not many fanfic authors would be able to fill in that unknown void [from 1899 you'd have a different history within the Wizarding and muggle worlds] with content. And if Harry appears, who's his dark lord and antagonist? Albus, Gellert, Voldemort? ...Aberforth and Ariana?

    There are other changes you could make to Ariana's death, such as her killer being known [if it was Gellert, would Aberforth have risen up to kill him instead?], or her surviving the fight in one state or another.
     
    Last edited: May 12, 2013
  5. Joe's Nemesis

    Joe's Nemesis High Score: 2,058 ~ Prestige ~

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    I have a plot-bunny running around in my head that takes this exact PoD. The result is that Harry spends the summer with Sirius. They take Ron and go explore Europe, all the while Sirius is teaching Harry and Ron about witches, confidence, and general smartassery and mayhem.

    He is then the Professor for Defense instead of the fake Mooney, who is brought in, in the role of security for the tournament instead.

    It's a different Harry that walks into the room after his name is called from the Goblet of Fire, and Sirius is right there with him in that meeting, which ends very differently. There's no issues between Ron and Harry. Instead, it becomes those two against the world, with Sirius and Hermione backing them.

    I've started chapter one a few times, but just can't get the opening down right. Frustrating, but it'll come.
     
  6. Nerdman3000

    Nerdman3000 Seventh Year

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    I think there was a fanfic from a few years ago called "A Moth to the Flame" which detailed a world in which Ariana never encountered the muggles that broke her magic, and thus never died and how it affected the Wizarding World a hundred years later. Sadly it got deleted by the author.

    I think an interesting idea might be that if Ariana never lost her magic by those muggles, she might have been the one to be twisted by Gellerts "Greater Good". What if Gellert was the one to die in the duel? I wonder what the HP universe would look like if Ariana, not Gellert, was the dark lord of World War II?
     
    Last edited: May 12, 2013
  7. AlbusPHolmes

    AlbusPHolmes The Alchemist

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    Ariana never lost her magic by Voldemort.
     
    yak
  8. Lindsey

    Lindsey Chief Warlock DLP Supporter

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    I have been re-reading the Harry Potter series in the last couple of days and noticed a possible divergence at the end of "The Sorting" Chapter in SS/PS.

    It mentions that Harry Potter has a dream about Quirrel and Voldemort. He does not remember it when he awakes though.

    This could lead to two interesting scenarios: Harry is a seer. You would need a good writer to make this into an amazing story. Have his visions mess things up/not very easy to understand... Don't make it into a cheat.

    Or you can have it that Voldemort was invading Harry's dreams to try to figure out why he didn't die that night- learn about him. You could have an interesting story where Voldemort/Quirrel is influencing Harry through nightmares and dreams into someone else completely.

    There are so many possible divergences. They do not have to be a major dramatic points.
     
  9. Peace

    Peace High Inquisitor

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    I've always thought that there is a lot of potential for a PoD in the 5th Year Christmas chapters.

    Harry's terrified that Voldemort's controlling him and tries to run away, the Order knows that something strange is going on with Harry and you've got them all stuck in a house together.

    Maybe a couple of Order members go rogue and try to remove the 'threat' or exploit Harry's connection to Voldemort. Or maybe Harry decides to run away despite Dumbledore telling him to stay and then gets in way over his head as he tries to hide from DEs and the Order.

    Personally I like the idea of Sirius catching Harry as he runs away and deciding to go with him, except as they spend more time together Harry realises that Sirius isn't the person he thought he was, both because of his time in Azkaban and a violent nature. It could set up some great character interactions.

    I also like the idea of Dumbledore taking Harry with him when he flees Hogwarts later in the story. It's not a PoD that I can remember seeing being used but has a lot of potential for interaction between Harry and Dumbledore.
     
  10. DrSarcasm

    DrSarcasm Headmaster

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    To address a thought earlier in the thread: I don't think it's possible for Harry to join Voldemort. Not due to reasons from Harry's side, but from Voldemort's.

    I get the impression that a lot of Voldemort's power comes not only from his personal skill, but from his reputation. Nobody could trust anyone with the Imperius curses flying around, magical creatures and turncoats. Voldemort's power came from the appearance of being an invulnerable leader. Harry was the light in the darkness that showed that he wasn't all-powerful (save for Dumbledore-fear). While there would be a benefit to LV's side if the very person who would have been the symbol for hope was seen fighting alongside the enemy he was supposed to defeat, the thought would always be in peoples' minds that he was defeated by a child. A child who he possibly feared he couldn't beat, so he recruited him. There would always be a 'chink' in LV's persona. Between that and the prophecy, Voldemort wouldn't be able to let Harry live.
     
  11. Lindsey

    Lindsey Chief Warlock DLP Supporter

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    Voldemort asked Harry to join him in his first year. However, we don't know what Voldemort would have done if Harry said yes. I don't think Voldemort blamed Harry for his downfall entirely, more Lily and James. It wasn't until Harry defined him consciously, did Voldemort make Harry his enemy.

    But, would Voldemort still have killed Harry if Voldemort found out Harry is a Horcrux? Or would be more beneficial to turn him and make the public lose hope? Interesting paradox there.

    As someone who is writing a Harry joining Voldemort story, I think it is possible for Harry to join Voldemort if you make Voldemort more logical and less about petty revenge. Thanks for letting me see this side though, I have an idea about one of my scenes now.
     
    Last edited: May 12, 2013
  12. AntHil

    AntHil First Year

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    I think jbern used this idea in his HP/Battlestar Galactica fic but I've never seen it anywhere else. It does have some interesting possibilities. I know someone who's working on a fic using this PoD that follows Harry and Dumbledore and the accompanying changes in the Potterverse.

    The Sorting is, as a previous post said, a natural PoD, especially if you re-read what the Hat says to Harry. Platform 9 3/4 is also a good PoD - it would be so simple to have Harry run into someone as he's getting on the train.

    There's also a lot of potential for PoD's in his interaction with the professors - how about a Harry who's been mentored by Quirrell? How would he be changed by that, especially after the truth is revealed? Or a Flitwick or McGonagall who takes an interest in the BWL?

    Something that I've thought about but will probably never write is McGonagall imposing conditions on Harry joining the Quidditch team in 1st Year, one of them being that he keeps his grades up (like a lot of normal schools do). This could lead to a Harry being more competent/studious due to being tutored and pushed to study by older Gryffindors at Wood's direction and his increased interaction with his house mates would also have changes. I like to think about how the first three books would end if Harry was both a better wizard and had closer connections with some older students.
     
  13. Nerdman3000

    Nerdman3000 Seventh Year

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    Oh! My mistake, I meant the muggle boys who attacked her. I'll fix that.
     
  14. Perspicacity

    Perspicacity Destroyer of Worlds ~ Prestige ~ DLP Supporter

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    A divergence that has not been used enough (in my opinion) is the one I used in Dagger and Rose: Dumbledore acts on the second prophecy at the end of PoA and decides that Harry needs to be prepared for what is to come, that "I wanted you to have a childhood" is wishful thinking at best. Enter proactive, mentoring Dumbledore or some other mentoring arrangement. (I'd personally love to see a Harry given over to Mad Eye Moody for fostering*.)

    Another divergence point is the one I mentioned in the Harry/Fleur thread: Lily and James have a falling out after they learn of the prophecy. Lily leaves him and Magical England, takes Harry, and goes elsewhere (France, the U.S., Australia, etc.) where they live undercover. Harry is never the BWL and events happen far differently from there. Perhaps Neville is the BWL, perhaps not and Harry is the one to whom the prophecy can refer.

    A third divergence point would enable a different upbringing for Harry: Dedalus Diggle (whom we know interacted with Harry in his childhood) realizes the less than ideal circumstances of Harry's upbringing and acts on it. We don't know a whole lot about him in canon, but he was a member of the Order and was sufficiently competent as to be part of several important tasks, including escorting Harry at the start of OOtP.

    * Yeah, I know something similar was done by Blot in a couple of one-shots, but I'd prefer something less crackish.

    Edit: Thought of another:

    When Harry asks Dumbledore what he sees in the Mirror of Erised and instead of his glib answer, Dumbledore says truthfully that he sees his sister. This sends Harry and company on a path of solving a different mystery and when they discover the truth, it changes their perception of Dumbledore and, by extension, the Magical world that so venerates him, in a profound way (and the plot spins off from there).
     
    Last edited: May 12, 2013
  15. NoxedSalvation

    NoxedSalvation Temporarily Banhammered

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    This is actually a very interesting PoD- with Diggle as surrogate father we could have a competent Hufflepuff- or even "barmy" Ravenclaw- Harry.
     
  16. Shinysavage

    Shinysavage Madman With A Box ~ Prestige ~

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    You could always try the Sacrifice Arc, which has a good if somewhat unlikeable Peter. And while I hesitate to blow my own trumpet, I used the idea in my own series, although I'd be the first to admit that they're not great stories (hence their absence in my sig...)
     
  17. T3t

    T3t Purple Beast of DLP ~ Prestige ~ DLP Supporter

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    I dunno, I sorta like Peter in Sacrifices. He gets a bit stale as a character by book 7 but so do a lot of other characters, lol. Maybe I just like him because it was the first time I'd seen him done that way that didn't totally suck.

    As for various pots of duality... CoS is, frankly, filled with them. Harry responding differently to the voice in the wall, Ron/Hermione/anybody else not holding the idiot ball and realizing it's a snake after the Dueling Club incident, various Lockhart situations, Polyjuice (hard to figure out a way for it to go more wrong if Hermione comes along but I'm sure it could be done), etc.
     
    Last edited: May 13, 2013
  18. Averis

    Averis Don of Delivery ~ Prestige ~

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    I had a brilliant idea reading through this thread the other night, and it's taken a bit of time to formulate it in my own mind before I circled back around to the thread.

    Essentially, I wanted a PoD where Harry is wrongfully accused of a murder. There are many places it could be done - Quirrel, Diggory, etc. -- and it would completely change the shape of the story. Snape has been mentioned, but the one I'd like to see the most out of all of them is Harry taking the heat for Dumbledore's death.

    This can be convincingly done during HBP (there's a lot of potential there) but I'd really like to see it done during the DoM's. Imagine Harry is possessed by Voldemort and unable to stop him, and Harry surprises Dumbledore with a killing curse just about the time Fudge runs in and sees Voldemort, Voldemort-possessed!Harry and a dead Dumbledore.

    Sirius or Lupin (or someone from the Order) runs in and saves Harry before he can be arrested, but he can't go back to Hogwarts, Grimmauld Place is a no go, Privet Drive is compromised (though I suppose in canon, Dumbledore dies and the place is still safe to stay until he turns 17, but I'd imagine the Ministry can find him there).

    You could have a believable Harry mentored by Sirius (or even Lupin or Moody, or all three), Harry dedicated to learning Occlumency, and a battle-hardened Harry who has cast a Crucio on Bellatrix and an Avada Kedavra on Dumbledore.

    It sounds like a DLP fic.
     
  19. Perspicacity

    Perspicacity Destroyer of Worlds ~ Prestige ~ DLP Supporter

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    Nice idea, but you can't use Sirius unless you change canon a bit earlier--he had taken a dive through the Veil when Harry was possessed.
     
  20. Averis

    Averis Don of Delivery ~ Prestige ~

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    Point. I conveniently forgot about that. It would be a good Moody or Lupin-mentored fic then. Adding detail, I'd love to see a Moody-mentor that Harry hates right off of the bat. Remember the mentor in Kill Bill... making Uma Thurman punch the wood repeatedly? Moody makes Harry repetitively get his ass-kicked and will not allow him to use any spells that cure him. Harry hates him for it, which just makes Moody smile grimly and kick his ass again, until he learns to respect him and he gains control over himself.

    Fudge would say Harry's working with Voldemort... would this result in Fudge losing power to Rufus, or actually staying in power and combatting Voldemort? I could even see Voldemort being sadistic enough to Polyjuice someone into Harry (or the like) and have him kill people in Hogsmeade, Diagon Alley, etc. Hogwarts would be taken over a year early, Hermione and Ron wouldn't be able to come with Harry (though they might be taken out of school for their own safety) and Harry would be pretty much on his own for a while, actually learning something to contribute to defeating Voldemort.

    The problem presented is that no one knows about the horcruxes at that point. You could always have Snape, separate from the others, trying to take care of the horcruxes and Hogwarts at the same time, but would he have proven his worth to Voldemort if he didn't kill Dumbledore?

    The slate is wiped clean for an all new fic.
     
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