To quote you, Rubicon,

Pretty much sums up my thoughts. And martyr target meaning that if you NK Moridin, his choices for scum are obvious lynch targets, while if you kill sesc, less so. By 'we're on the right track' I mean that who Moridin/Sesc thought were scum yesterday are still probably who is scum.

 

Stoji has been online recently and he could have posted here, but I can't really complain about it since hell I did the same thing.

I want to know a few things. Stoji, was it someone else that sent it to you? Did you get forced to post that? Do you understand it more than, hurr durr scum are bad and will die?

Like, how the hell can one even confirm who posted that and they are town? The message is too god damn dramatic.

Menace, it could be scum or town, no way to know as roles are hidden till death.

 

Is it that hard to understand guys? Message uses an in reference so Stojil know who's who. Most likely a role giving some kind of +town gift or power to Stojil. And really doesn't make sense as a scum ploy as it won't be hard to figure out late game.

 

Honestly Schro seems to want to kill or defame every single person who seems strong or town or both. The only reason I can think of for him not being scum is I've never seen someone so belligerent except for a third party warlock type who has lynch immunity.

That aside, he's just railing hard against people who seem really town.


Oh and hey Rubicon? how about you go fuck yourself. I don't see any reason to try to lynch me hardcore right at the end of things.

Vote Lynch: Schrodinger

 

Kalas:

See, I'm feeling pretty conflicted about my scum reads right now. On the one hand, I could easily see Wetnurse and/or Smile offing Sesc in the event of Fenraellis being killed by a town/SK role, though I think it'd be odd for Schrodinger to kill Sesc given he basically gave him a town read, derp or not.

On the other hand, I feel like that's forcing a square block into a circular hole. I'm getting the feeling that Schrodinger isn't scum, just awful derp town. Mostly because, as Sesc said, nobody tried to reverse the lynch on him except for a now confirmed town player.

And then there's this mess with Rubicon at the end of the day, which has firmly knocked him off my list of town reads.

So... I'm not sure. I'll give the thread another read through and see how things shake out with the info we just got.

Smile:

Pretty much what Kalas said. It would be stupid for Stojil to try and pull this off if he was scum, so we should at least look into it further before slamming the lynch button. You'll notice that I never said to go along with it, though. Just that immediately killing him is a stupid idea.

Rents:

Yes, please, insult him as a person instead of questioning him on why he did what he did. Thank god we have you. :facepalm

And since it looks like nobody else is going to do it, I will.

Rubicon:

What the motherfuck was that implosion yesterday? I want to know what was going through your head, now. And don't you dare point to Bill Door's status as town as your proof, unless you have a damn good claim to back it up.

Lynch Vote: Rubicon

 

Last game scum won due to an amazing call. Just because it is balzy does not mean it is true.

 

Ah man, you're right, why did I think it was a good idea to blindly go along with his-

Oh yeah.

Actually, that reminds me. You still have very few posts that are worthy anything Smile. Hit me with your top three town and scum reads and why given these recent events. A lynch vote would be nice as well.

 

Okay, I want everyone's top three scum right now. I have a reason for this, but I'm not telling you what it is until everyone has posted their scum lists.

 

@ Schro - I don't think he's scummy for it though, I'm just registering my confusion. The message contains unusual amounts of cray* but Uncle Stojil posting it's completely null.

*It's provocative. It gets the people going.

You think it doesn't make sense as a scum ploy by Uncle Stojil or by the person sending it?

Schro is probably town though.

Um, it's completely obvious what was going through my head? I explained my reasoning at the time, and even if you guys stubbornly refused to go along with it, it was a damn good idea and we should have done it. Bill was not a good wagon and if Sesc hadn't died and flipped town I'd be on him about it for today. Maybe it shouldn't have been Rents, but we could have coordinated something. You can't tell me we couldn't have with the number of people who were online - it was absolutely possible.

Today I'm definitely going to be looking at the people on that wagon, particularly the ones who've played with Bill before.

I do apologize for casting doubt on Rents' IRL excuse - that was def. bad manners - and truthfully he was selected more or less randomly from my pile of nulls because he seemed like he had a better chance of being scum than Bill.

--

@ bob99 and Caesar: Hello and please make a case & vote for someone ASAP.

@ Wetnurse: Please respond to my question about Schrodinger in 119. You ignored it for some reason.

 

No, this is nonsense. The only thing you said was that you felt Bill was playing differently in past games you played with him, so instead you wanted everyone to build an entirely new lynchwagon from scratch in 15 minutes on some guy you picked randomly from your list of null reads.

That is literally what you said.

But yeah, since I get the feeling you don't have much else to say I'm going to leave my vote where it is. I'll have my new reads up in a while.

 

Why would Fen being an idiot qualify him for lynch?

Uhh...

1) Two of my top six scum contenders have now been townfirmed (). Those two were also part of my main scum team.

2) As far as Moridin/Sesc thinking people are scum:

#136 Sesc does mention both Riley and Menace. A single line about Menace, and then he ends with the conclusion that Riley always feels weird.

#125 He mentions Rubicon, but specifically in conjunction with Bill Door due to their back and forth, and concludes that "it is perfectly unlikely I should get so lucky figuring things out. That does not, however, put Bill Door out of the race". Not sure how much relevance remains given the flip.

#92 Also pressure on Rubicon.

#64 A fairly random vote on Rubicon.

In short, the only thing that connects Sesc and I (and also Fen) is Rubicon (Riley and Menace weren't exactly pressured by him, but you might be able to include them). As such, you vote for... Uncle Stojil? What.

I am really confused as far as Schrodinger goes, honestly.

On the one hand, his D1 was horrible. Random nonsense posts make up the majority of his contributions, which #87 claims to be sufficient checking in. This I found particularly scummy. Consider that he wasn’t simply popping in on occasion – he was there, making fairly regular posts “I've got more posts than anyone except Rubicon and Smile” and even responding to mentions. To be following the thread to that extent and still not post any content is bad. To then claim that your noncontent should qualify for participation is far, far worse. Then he has #89, which is bad for reasons I've already given. The rest of his posts are also suspicious. His readwall... it feels fake, for lack of a better term. It doesn't read like something put together on the fly by someone reading the thread for the first time - rather, it feels like something written based on existing notions.

On the other hand, I can't understand how someone could play like that if they had a scumteam. Surely his teammates would have pressured him to post some content to alleviate suspicions, and even helped him generate content for the same, well before it became such a huge issue. Also, the lack of defense thing.

On the third hand, there's his posting today. The vote for Stojil is completely stupid, and simply looks like him jumping on a chance to reignite his attempt from yesterday. Also the whole 'Sesc/Moridin were right' thing, especially given it doesn't fit with his vote.

One thing I didn't consider with respect to Schrodinger would be afk. It's possible his teammates simply weren't around when he was falling under the wagon. Consider that the second through the fifth votes were consecutive (#106-#109) and the sixth (Rubicon #119) came shortly after. In between, we have Riley voting for Wetnurse, Kalas voting for Wetnurse, Fontisian voting for Menace. Between Rubicon's vote and Smile's (#133) there isn't really an attempt to push for an alternate bandwagon, but that is, again, only 14 posts.

Now Riley is responding directly to a post from Wetnurse, and Fontisian I think would probably vote for Wetnurse to distract from Schrodinger rather than start a new, somewhat obscure bandwagon (unless of course Wetnurse is in the scumteam too). Kalas' post could be a possible contender, though.

Jwlk, LochNess and Rents don't show up in this period. Smile and Typhon both promise posts later - Smile goes on to vote Schrodinger (and put him at 7/10, possibly a desperation move to bus the teammate? Smile's own unstable position could make a defense tricky) and Typhon goes on to pressure Rubicon and post a readwall in which Schrodinger is not mentioned.

Bleh. I keep thinking that Schrodinger couldn't possibly be scum, but then he goes and posts something that makes me wonder all over again.

Some things that stand out yesterday from a Bill Door posts perspective.

Some things that seem bad given Bill's flip are Typhon's initial push on him for odd reasons, Smile's comment on his (nonexistent) aggressiveness, Riley's townread of him and Fontisian's late jitters.

Also interesting is

Could be worth looking into, especially the Typhon/Aekiel angle. Schrodinger also mentioned the possibility of Menace/Aekiel, incidentally.

Aekiel: Right now, I'd say Smile, Rubicon (those two still have enough links to each other to be suspicious even in light of Bill Door's flip), Typhon. Schrodinger doesn't seem to fit with my other suspects, which is pretty much the story of how my suspicions against him have run through this game ;_;

---------- Post automerged at 12:27 PM ---------- Previous post was at 12:22 PM ----------

Nightkill*

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No, it wouldn't have been. We'd run a very good chance of having a no lynch. Keep in mind that this was minutes before the deadline, and several people were viewing on their phone (myself and Typhon, at least). You made no case for switching to Rents whatsoever. And the idea that the cases for Schrodinger and Bill were weak is just false. The case against Schrodinger was never lurking - on the contrary, he posted often and plenty. The problem was lack of content, and one readwall does not alleviate that. The case against Bill was similarly about his unwillingness to pressure anyone, and outside of a couple of posts he didn't really say much to make anyone think otherwise.

Post 165. Less than 6 hours left in the day, with Bill and Schrodinger shaping up to be the main contenders for lynch. Your only mention of the current main lynch targets is a single question to Typhon asking what his reasoning is for voting for Bill. You make no argument to switch to someone else until literally minutes before the deadline. We tried that once, in the previous game, after your doctor claim - once again, you were the catalyst. It didn't end well.

 

All correct, except we had about 30 minutes and more than enough people online to pull it off.

I don't know why you got that impression. Feel free to ask me anything you like until you're satisfied. If you're voting me for wanting to save someone I thought was town, though, you should probably either rethink that or explain in better detail why you think it's a good idea to willingly go along with mislynching townies.

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Moridin, I didn't do a very good job communicating it, but it was still a damn good idea and I don't regret trying it. No-lynch isn't really a concern when there's 12 people viewing the thread and Eidolonic has this soft-lynch mechanic.

Lack of content is what I meant.

 

If you don't do a good job communicating it, it isn't a damn good idea, since none of those twelve people is going to switch without appropriate reason, which you did not provide.

Lack of content is a perfectly valid reason to lynch, especially given the nature of Schrodinger's posts.

My point is, this

is not good reasoning. You know what is going through your head. We don't. Yes, Bill flipped town. But we could not have known he would. Honestly, even with the flip, I would have been far, far more suspicious of anyone who did switch.

Please point out the posts where you put forth your reasons why we shouldn't do this. Like I said, your #165 didn't even mention any reasoning along these lines, and your last few posts contained no arguments against Rents whatsoever, while dismissing valid concerns against Bill.

Actually, I agree with this. Going by the numbers, it would certainly have been possible to switch. That doesn't address the issue that most of us had no reason to.

This is the real issue with all this. I've played with Bill before, and I honestly think I made the right call in pushing for his lynch. If you don't, that's fine - but insinuating that the lynch on him was baseless is just wrong. There was plenty of reason to suspect him. This feels like you want to retroactively paint Bill's actions as town in order to doubtcast the people who pushed for his lynch.

This is your reasoning for Rents? Yeah, I can see why you didn't post it then. It wouldn't have been much help to your case at all.

 

Rubicon and Smile. Since you're here. Scum teams, please.

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Stojil too.

 

I'm going to bed but I agree with the Rubicon being scum.

 

@ Aekiel: Was thinking Kalas, Sesc and probably Riley before the night. Will be reevaluating. Please tell me you have some kind of night result to share.

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*during the night

---------- Post automerged at 12:47 AM ---------- Previous post was at 12:37 AM ----------

Kalas - too soon.

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Moridin, I guess the important question is do you think I'm scum for it or do you just think I was being derp or whatever?

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Why? Please be as specific as possible.

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Also to be clear and so no one thinks I'm being unfair, I am looking at the Bill Door wagon, but not because I think people are scummy for not switching. I'm just skeptical of the people on it in the first place.

 

Goddammit. What the fuck is wrong with DLP these days? I lost my post again!

Sigh. It went something like this:

/me taps the foot impatiently and waits just a little bit more for it

That was a message I wrote for a player. All you need to know is in there and I won't say anything more... for now (hurry up, you!).

Vote: Rubicon

No, it wasn't a good idea at all. There were 15 minutes remaining in the day. You provided no reasons to unvote Bill, not to vote Rents (although they were pretty obvious and definitely weak). The last time someone tried something somewhat similar, it was you, it was last game and you were scum.

You (and fontisian to a lesser extent) looked like you already knew what Bill was and were trying to gain some leverage/towncred for day 2. For what concerns me, you gained none and you lost a fuckload.

@Aekiel: why 3 when the scumteam has likely more? Anyway, Rubicon, fontisian and Wetnurse.

Does anyone familiar with Ender's Game know if the Special Announcement in post #229 is something flavor-related? Is it from Obs or something?

Gonna reread now, although I wanted to do that after it (grrrrr).

 

Nah, I'm about as good as I'll get in regards to you. I asked you what your reasoning was for your attempt at changing the wagon last minute yesterday, and you let me know that it went no further than you having a gut feeling on Bill Door and picking any old player to kill instead of him. Or no lynching instead of him.

Because no matter how many people were monitoring the thread at the time, they weren't going to change their votes unless you gave them a really good reason not to. And even you have to realize that you provided no such thing.

I dunno. Maybe you have a reason for all this. But with you and Schrodinger I'm starting to lean towards derp instead of game mechanic.

There. Better detail. You're not a mislynchable townie unless you start acting like one. Give me something that isn't useless or my vote is staying where it is.

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Also yeah, Stojil, Demosthenes and Locke are the pseudonyms that Ender's sister and brother go by respectively in their attempts to take over the world. Locke's message was also something I could see Locke saying in the book (though only in private, I guess?) so I'm not sure if those are Eido's doing or if they're people roleplaying.

It's pretty confusing.

 

I'll take it.

Stojil, Locke's message is a quote from the books. Not sure about the other one.

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the anticipation is killing me

 

You can kill the time by answering a question for me.

Why did you have Kalas, Sesc and Riley down as a scum team when your voting record doesn't even touch on Sesc or Riley? You were more than happy to throw your vote around yesterday, changing more often than anyone else, in fact.

Hell, you didn't even mentioned Riley.