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Questions that don't deserve their own thread.

Discussion in 'Fanfic Discussion' started by Quick Ben, Feb 1, 2012.

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  1. Another Empty Frame

    Another Empty Frame Fake Flamingo DLP Supporter

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    If I know all the words or it's melodic enough lyrical music is still helpful. otherwise it has to be jazz or classical. I can't listen to electronica at all while writing even if there are no words due to the nature of the genre.
     
  2. Evon

    Evon Seventh Year

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    I usually find a single song that matches the tone and mood of the chapter I'm writing and then play it on repeat while I write. I've found it becomes a background tempo to my writing and not at all distracting.
     
  3. SmileOfTheKill

    SmileOfTheKill Magical Amber

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    This is bit of a lazy question, but what would be the best short and simple post to why Magical Cores are horrible ideas in every manner?
     
  4. Photon

    Photon Order Member

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    This cliche is a lazy copy of RPG mechanisms (mana score) that usually is completely uninteresting, lame etc.

    The main problem is that preferred handling of everything is to introduce something interesting/funny/terrifying/etc or handle it without expanding on it. Pointless describing of food/classes/sex/how magic works in lame way is a waste of time. Magical cores are almost always falling into second category, to the point that for many people the phrase "magical core" is enough to stop reading the story.

    But it can be done right, I found in-progress story with some promising themes and ideas (Harry Potter and the Witch Queen by TimeLoopedPowerGamer). Author published some of his plans, including proof that "magical core" concept may be well used.

    http://www.fanfiction.net/topic/127...test-chapter-Harry-Potter-and-the-Witch-Queen - search for "Ah, it's long rant time." (sorry, stupid ff.net is not allowing direct links to posts).
     
  5. Skeletaure

    Skeletaure Magical Core Enthusiast ~ Prestige ~ DLP Supporter

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    A few good reasons to think magical cores are shitty ideas:

    1. They're never mentioned in canon and you can account for all canon situations without them.

    2. They simplify magic incredibly. Magical cores are generally speaking glowing balls of energy that you can access by concentrating and "taking hold" of some magic via sheer willpower, then use for whatever purpose just by wishing it/visualising it.

    The real world is immensely complex - think about how complex it is to understand how a computer or a rocket works, or even to understand how a bridge stays up. Magic, as a technology analogue complete with an educational system, academic journals, research etc. should be equally complex. When it comes to magical systems (and world building in general) complex is preferable to simple, because the real world is always complex.*

    3. Magical cores make magic too much like physical energy. Magic is a very weird and wonderful thing in Harry Potter, and is extremely distinct from anything in the natural world. The ability to treat things like job positions, words, feelings and intentions as real existing things; the way in which a spell designed to affect a person's thoughts can also be used to change the workings of an inanimate object... these are very strange and unscientific things. Magic should not be quasi-scientific (most commonly by making it follow some analogue of the laws of thermodynamics). Magic should be unquantifiable and unmeasurable by physical apparatus. Wizards aren't people with a battery inside them; they're wizards.

    3.5 Wizards should not be able to run out of magic any more than a Muggle can run out of Muggle.

    4. Magical cores make magical power - and thus the influence of a character - rest far too much on a single stipulated value, generally one assigned at birth.

    5. Magical cores distract from that which make stories great: character. When characters come into conflict what is interesting is exactly that: the clash between their characters. Bringing arbitrary set values into the mix adds nothing, and distracts from the truly interesting parts of the story.

    6. Magical cores make combat dull. Having one character beat another because he has a higher number associated with his body, or because one person runs into exhaustion is very boring. I don't want to see Jason Bourne lose a car chase because he runs out of gas, nor do I want to see him win because by luck he got into a faster car. I want to see him win or lose based on his worked-for skill, for his courage and guts and determination.

    7. While not necessary, magical cores are often combined with all sorts of terrible tropes like wandless magic, inheritances, visualisation magic, magical auras, etc.

    8. If you have a magical core system but not one in which cores are fixed - i.e. your core size depends on how much you use magic, not on any natural predisposition - then there doesn't seem to be any reason to use them over other work-based magical systems (such as the skill-only system). Especially as these fics will often have Harry be the first person to realise that using more magic will make him more powerful - extremely unrealistic. On top of that, even with a variable magical core system you're still vulnerable to the criticisms of "physicalised" depletable magic above.

    9. Similarly, while core systems do not necessarily have to have depleteable magic (though they usually do), if you get rid of depletability (such as a system by which everyone has a fixed strength, not amount of magic) it's not clear how this system does anything the skill-only doesn't do; it also continues to suffer the problems of fixed value magic.

    10. If you combine 8 and 9 to create a system by which you have a magic system in which people have a value of strength of magic, but not amount of magic, and moreover that value is not fixed but rather can be increased through practicing/studying magic... you've basically arrived at the skill-only system. The only extra step to arrive completely at the skill-only system is to say that the value of strength varies from spell to spell, depending on your ability with that spell.


    *Note the difference between complexity and complicatedness. Complexity is a virtue, complicatedness is not. Making things complicated - i.e. confusing - is bad story telling; making things complex is not. It's possible, through good writing, to present complex ideas in a simple way. This also provides a nice world-building maxim. While complexity is good, redundancy is bad. Think about situation #10 above; this is a perfect case of the magical core being completely redundant in that story mechanics would be absolutely the same without it. If that's the case, why include it? It doesn't add to complexity, just to complication. It's a strange but wonderful thing that complexity and minimalism are bedmates in good storytelling.
     
    Last edited: Aug 26, 2013
  6. yak

    yak Moderator DLP Supporter Retired Staff

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    Actually, you can. Like this:
    [NOPARSE]http://www.fanfiction.net/topic/127267/80220856/2/#93262829
    http://www.fanfiction.net/topic/[subforum]/[thread]/[page]/#[post number][/NOPARSE]

    eg. http://www.fanfiction.net/topic/127267/80220856/2/#93262829
     
  7. SmileOfTheKill

    SmileOfTheKill Magical Amber

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    It is time for Taure and 'TimeLoopedPowerGamer' to fight in the battle of the logic and cannons.

    Yes, I mean cannonballs, not canon.
     
  8. chrnno

    chrnno High Inquisitor

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    I would say Taure has to learn to read but I think he just used the excuse to post another huge wall.
     
  9. MonkeyEpoxy

    MonkeyEpoxy The Cursed Child DLP Supporter

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    Have some real talk:

    .... wut?

    there was a general question asked, and he answered, in detail. i don't see what the problem is.
     
  10. chrnno

    chrnno High Inquisitor

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    Then I figure you have to learn to read then, really at least Taure has a reason for it... :facepalm

    Taure did literally the opposite, if it wasn't for the fact I know he likes to post like that I would have thought he was making a long-winded joke.
     
  11. Thyestean

    Thyestean Slug Club Member

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    You sound like a bitch. Oh no, he gave me too much information, whatever will I do with all this extra stuff. Well fuck, he spent too much time answering the question, what a douche. Looks like I will complain.

    Honestly though, he did give a short response, 10 of them.
     
  12. Rache

    Rache Headmaster

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    We know that feats of wandless magic are possible. However, elves's magical system is solely based on the concept. Henceforth, I don't think wandless magic at a slightly higher level is any unrealistic. Wizards can learn the art from elves.

    More wizards don't know the art since it involves taking magical classes from a dirty servant.

    Or the magic of an elf differs greatly from that of a wizard. So, plot bunny anyone?
     
  13. Aerylife

    Aerylife Not Equal

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    Taure muggles get tired from doing work ie using energy. Anything physical really, so why isn't using magic also tiring in some manner?
     
    Last edited: Aug 26, 2013
  14. Photon

    Photon Order Member

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    But it is not confirming separate energy for physical activity and magic.
     
  15. Joe's Nemesis

    Joe's Nemesis High Score: 2,058 ~ Prestige ~

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    Quick question . . .

    In British English, do you call a piece of carpet that is put on the floor, but not tacked down a throw rug, scatter rug, or an area rug? Something else, maybe?

    ---------- Post automerged at 01:31 AM ---------- Previous post was at 01:22 AM ----------

    I agree and disagree, because a core to a being is exactly how humans think, so there's really not a problem with the concept of a magical core. What do I mean by that?

    Psychologists/counselors use a number of techniques by which they will lead a person into the center of their body where they visualize some kind of core of emotions or some other thing, and then talk the person through whatever it is they must do to deal with the issue at hand.

    So, while I agree with you that the "literal" idea is far-fetched, the metaphorical concept and thus, the way a wizard would visualize/explain/reach into it is exactly accurate, based on that comparison. It's also how we deal with the will often times.

    So yeah, no literal core, but there is a metaphorical one that is written as if it was real because it's basic human nature to conceptualize it that way. Is it canon, no. Then again, the diaphragm pushing air in and out isn't exactly written into canon either, but the results (breathing) is. I think it's the same basic comparative concept.
     
  16. Knyght

    Knyght Alchemist

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    I've only ever called it a rug or a carpet.
     
  17. plastic.jonbenet.doll

    plastic.jonbenet.doll Temporarily Banhammered

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    Then why muggles can't see Leaky Cauldron?
     
  18. Andrela

    Andrela Plot Bunny DLP Supporter

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    Because magic isn't energy, it's magic.
     
  19. plastic.jonbenet.doll

    plastic.jonbenet.doll Temporarily Banhammered

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    True, but I believe that magic is ability to manipulate energy. So if you use magic you still get tired...
     
  20. TheWiseTomato

    TheWiseTomato Prestigious Tomato ~ Prestige ~ DLP Supporter

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    In something like The Dresden Files, yeah, that's how things work. In Harry Potter we have no indication that this is the case, especially as magic doesn't even pretend to obey the laws of the universe in the Potterverse.
     
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