What can I say about the first part? Other than 'ok, we clearly have very different valuations here'.

The above also applies to your post in general.

 

Kai: What are your other reads?

 

What I said.

Alternate possibilities: Both scum, in which case a needlessly risky gambit. Both town in which case you're scum (but not something I consider in the realm of possibility). If fonti is scum and both are town teammates could be Kai (unlikely pre 216, slightly more possible post 216) or blab, where I really don't see the connection.

Now would you pretty, pretty please give 218/219 a nice hard look?

 

Ok explain to me the scum-motivation behind 219

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@Kai: hmm, 236 makes no sense to me. Why would you discard scum!Bill + scum!font on the grounds that Bill didn't vote for his scummate? especially at 2 vs. 3 with one Lutris having disappeared.
Now let's say you're correct to discard the font+Bill team but still think Bill is scum... who (from your POV) is Bill's scum mate then? Vira, who he challenged? Kalas, who is pushing for his lynch? Me?
What do you think about the lynches? From your perspective you're town, Lutris was town, Stojil was town. If you discard Bill+font both lynches had scum on them.

@font: Why do you think Bill was looking for towncred? In a duel town-town world can't he simply not have wanted to be on the wagon that lynched town? What has he to loose by prolonging the duel?

@Kalas: why can Kai be a scummate of Bill but not one of Vira?

@Vira: Why was LuckyLee killed?

 

?

I don't think Bill was looking for towncred. That's my point.

 

@blab: Headed to bed, Short answer: duel related posts. I can pull up the specific quotes next time I'm on if you want.

@fonti: Same question:

 

You think I haven't?

 

Your reasoning sounded (in an exaggerated nutshell) like this:

KaiDASH's Premise: Bill was scum and his behavior made scum-sense

Bill stuck too long to his opinions or whatever to be scum looking for town-cred

=>Bill wasn't scum.

The point that I was trying to make was that if Bill was scum and you town then he could have reasonable scum-motivations to act like he did other than looking for towncred. Namely not wanting to hammer town or be on a town-lynching wagon at all and furthermore he had no incentive at all to vote.

 

Avoiding lynching and hammering town as scum is a way of getting towncred and avoiding suspicion. Those are the methods, and towncred is the goal. I don't think Bill Door would consider refusing to vote (when he thought we could no lynch in the duel) a good way to avoid suspicion and get towncred because it ... isn't.

 

...I'm not sure if you have understood me, and if you did, I'm not sure if that's you disagreeing or agreeing.

 

blab: The only goals of scum is to survive, and ensure that their scummates survive. They do this by obtaining towncred and being less lynchable than other players.

You are saying that Bill may have had motives other than getting towncred in refusing to vote. I'm saying that there are no other reasons.

Bill Door had an incentive to vote as town to get a flip, and as scum because conviction looks good and avoiding making a commitment leads to the accusations that Kai is making now. He had an incentive to try to no lynch (if he thought that was possible) as town if he had town reads on both Stojil and myself. He did not have an incentive to do so as scum, unless it was an extremely shortsighted move to avoid suspicion. If he is scum and believed that we could no lynch in a duel, then his refusal to vote was actively playing against his win condition. I think the town scenario is more likely than the scum one.

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Vote Vira

Vira should have had more than enough time to respond to Bill Door by now.

Where the fuck are the rest of you?

 

Sorry, I was asleep.

KaiDASH comes into the game (on Day Two) really aggressively, going straight for Bill Door due to backtracking and indecisive scumreads (218 ). Says Font’s case against Stojil looked weak but doesn’t provide evidence. I like his argument on Bill Door, but he hasn’t provided any other reads other than him and Font.

Bill Door doesn’t seem certain that I’m scum (231), but challenged me to a duel anyways. The arguments for Bill on whether scum would act the way he did on the Stojil/Font duel have merit, but I’m on the side of the argument that he could have stalled the whole day out with his not voting thing. He also needs to say what his reads are. I know he wants me dead and likes Font, but what about everyone else?

Kalas's posts are okay, he keeps his arguments and scumreads in line with his previous reads, but I agree with Font that I want to hear his reasoning against Stojil. Otherwise, he’s middle of the road pure null vote, which makes him better than Kai and Bill Door, at least.

I have no idea. Luckylee was a weak choice. There were way better players to target.

What I want from people:

KaiDASH: Reads on everyone besides Font and Bill Door.
Bill Door: Reads on everyone besides me and Font.
Kalas: I dunno, give me your opinion of the game thus far.

 

blab: slightly town side of null, I haven't looked at him too hard but I like the way he has been posting.

Kalas: I don't like his voting yesterday and I think his reasons for voting me are just bad.

Kai: He seemed scummy yesterday and his posts today have had weird logic and just don't really make sense to me.

I'm not certain that you are scum, but I'm as certain as i can be. I think that the other scum is either Kalas or Kai, I can see both of them as being your teammate.

 

Alright, where is everyone? This is getting ridiculous.

What about Blab's posts do you particularly like? What makes him seem town to you?

What about Kai's posts don't make sense to you?

Why do you think Kalas or Kai are more likely to be my scummate if I were scum?

 

Kai? Kalas? ... anyone here?

 

This game is stalling.

blab: Are you going to vote for Vira or Bill Door?

 

He's been logical and actually thought stuff through well.

He's made some really weird jumps in logic that I just don't follow. Post #239 for example.

Because they are the people I don't have town reads and they both make sense based on yesterday's votes.

 

I'm not exactly convinced by the case on Vira, Bill's "case" on her is about stuff where I had a townread on her. On the other hand, I was left alive while Lucky was killed, and I would say we were declared/read town with similar certainty. Maybe I was left alive by scum!Vira because of that read. Also Kai is advocating a Bill lynch, and he is currently my strongest scum-read.

Now if I look at scum!Bill, I see you as the most reasonable scum!mate. However in that world town!Kai reasons scum!Bill => town!font ..., so if I trust town!Kai I am left with Bill-Kalas, Bill-Vira, Bill-Kai, which all seem more counterintuitive than Vira-font or Vira-Kai.

 

Oh excellent. Please post that reasoning.

@blab: This game has no power roles and no protects. Therefore hitting anyone is simply a consideration of what info the kill gives town. With that in mind what scenarios exist that LL is hit over you?