My merge agreed with you saying my post was poorly worded and that there was no RVS wall. Read it again.

---------- Post automerged at 10:45 PM ---------- Previous post was at 10:44 PM ----------

This one is me apologizing for that error.

 

So what about your townread on Waco, Titus?

 

There was a push against you on, I think D4(?), that you eventually fought off with everyone basically agreeing that if the person they eventually settled on was town, they'd snap you off the next day, which is what happened.

A lot of your defense seemed like it was centered on "mafia!Banks would always do X here and I did Y" or "mafia!Banks never does A here, and I did A."

It was really weird to read, because it seemed both incredibly sincere and incredibly (from my newbie perspective) implausible. Like, if your mafia game really is that different from your town game, how are you ever able to wolf successfully?

Obviously the people you were playing with thought it was persuasive enough to move the lynch, and in the end you actually were town, but it was one of the things that stood out to me that game as a move or a play I didn't grasp. Care to share?

 

If my town read changed on him because he misunderstood my post, I would never have a townread on anyone.

Newcombe, posts like that last one are why you are not conftown. Asking people advice on how to play wolf is not helpful. Ask about reads, push your scumreads, even if it is me. I relish the chance to show you I am town.

---------- Post automerged at 11:28 PM ---------- Previous post was at 11:17 PM ----------

The e...it keeps attaching to your name. Sorry.

 

https://forums.darklordpotter.net/showpost.php?p=788028&postcount=5181

There is an example from a prior game (Batmafia)

On the surface it doesn't seem like much but that I was frustrated. Those who knew me however could pick up the tone and realize that I was BG. There are also lots of points where we talk about what to do which didn't really help narrow scum. From my PoV for most of the game I had scum pegged so it got even more useless.

The more one posts about roles the more chance there is of tone catching them or using I instead of he/she/they or if the thread agrees on a position that Cop should check X but the cop has already checked X it becomes a very horrible situation quickly.

That being said there are times where mass claim/setup spec helps but this is not one of them.

By answering your question I risk others finding out about my role so I hope this is helpful because I probably for the sake of everyone else will have a harder time going into detail.

---------- Post automerged at 23:31 ---------- Previous post was at 23:29 ----------

Read stealer except for Zenzao. #TitusIsClearlyScum

 

Nope. Still asking why you're townreading him, since by your own admission, the reasoning you gave doesn't exist in the thread. Unless I'm missing something from you.

 

Hahahahaha If my read changed.....If

Are you seriously saying you don't know what your own reads were?

---------- Post automerged at 23:35 ---------- Previous post was at 23:34 ----------

Oh and Newcomb Waco's point 3 is beautiful. Hug it like a Christmas present.

---------- Post automerged at 23:36 ---------- Previous post was at 23:35 ----------

Banks Jan and P

Reads please

 

Fucking hell, I just lost another big post. I have to get back to a computer, my phone isn't cutting it. I'll make the promised post in the morning, sorry guys.

 

No. I am saying the syngery that we had on RVS plus his later wall is why I am town reading him. It was in artfully plead cuz tired insomniac.

MathBlade, Stretch Armstrong called, he wants his stretchy material back.

That was akin to "If I had a dollar for every error I made, I would be a billionaire."

---------- Post automerged at 11:41 PM ---------- Previous post was at 11:40 PM ----------
MathBlade, But seriously, I have a wall full of town reads and you choose to comment on an idiom?

 

That's not what I was doing. You're reading a lot into my post that isn't there. I read that game and saw something I didn't understand, and I want to understand it.

Look, the whole "focus on reads and pushes and talking about reads and pushes to the exclusion of all else" mindset is only effective if you know what you're doing. I can limit my non-gamesolving questions/comments by some amount, but if I tried to do 100% reads and read analysis I'm nearly certain I'd just be hilariously wrong.

MathBlade, point well taken, I think. The kind of talk I was imagining wasn't going to be specifically based on how roles should act, it was going to be a kind of general, "what if we all mass claimed as part of a set of 3 town roles to avoid the poisoner" kind of theorycrafting, but you and Waco and Atum to a lesser extent have convinced me to give it up.

 

Because the reads aren't yours and it is obvious. Furthermore you don't counter the validity of the obvious point and instead attack the attacker. Typical scum Titus.

---------- Post automerged at 23:46 ---------- Previous post was at 23:44 ----------

Newcomb it is okay to be wrong. I am coming around to Fonti's point that you are probably town. It is more important to post views and let people see them so they get a feel for you in this stage more so than being right. Go give it a shot

---------- Post automerged at 23:47 ---------- Previous post was at 23:46 ----------

Oh and if being right was a reads requirement dear Lord I would have died so much in my first few games. It was hilariously bad. Hell look at Citrus's joke I am town reading him and if he is actually town I will be very happy end of game.

 

Good, I'm coming around on you as well. My instinct was to tunnel you to oblivion for calling me "obviously coached or lying about never having played before," because that seems like something you couldn't possibly actually believe, like those were the only two options in the world.

I did give some reads in response to Titus's a couple posts up. You can check those out if you'd like.

---------- Post automerged at 11:51 PM ---------- Previous post was at 11:50 PM ----------

Post #229 if you'd rather just click a link.

 

Math stop buddying the kid and just tossing out that I never responded.

 

I didn't say you didn't respond. I said your response had no decent content Titus. Secondly I am not buddying the kid I am answering questions and doing what I believe is protown. Word smithing on me won't work Titus.

Newcomb yes I should be more clear sorry. I meant about the players not mentioned in Titus's list. Do any stick out and why? I feel that there is an attempt at a shift in conversation from Titus and I am trying to figure out why so I am looking to see if someone else sees what I do.

 

Saying that I "didn't counter" something implies I left something unanswered. You don't get to move the goal posts. Second, my posts do have content. You are trying to dodge the fact your posts are buddying.

Rarely buddying is alignment neutral but admitting you were wrong as a newbie in such a dramatic fashion only serves to try and get him to like you.

I find it amazing how fast you 180 on him after you cannot lynch him.

Each and every push you have made is utter garbage.

---------- Post automerged at 12:20 AM ---------- Previous post was at 12:14 AM ----------

Newcomb why is your post all about the past games etc. I cannot even divine your current question to him? All I see is how do you win?

 

1) I did not move the goalposts. More attack the attacker.
2) Answering questions and admitting mistakes is not buddying. Buddying = worshipping the ground they walk on.
3) I stated numerous times I would not lynch a newbie on their first day. So your third paragraph is utter nonsense.
4) and yet not a single reason why it is garbage. (Hint: it's not) I made a simple comment of you should know where your reads were and you do this. I am trying to not have this thread devolve into you v Me but you are making it very hard for me to not tunnel you into oblivion. I want to get others to understand my points but your posts make me want to try to be a loud megaphone continuously.

---------- Post automerged at 00:23 ---------- Previous post was at 00:22 ----------

Again I did not say they had no content. They had no decent content. Lack of reading by Titus established.

---------- Post automerged at 00:38 ---------- Previous post was at 00:23 ----------

Namely this post. I cannot find where Titus calls TMNT scum yet votes for TMNT but screams I am scum but moved her vote off of me onto TMNT without taking a concrete stance that TMNT is scum or why. All there is is a weak "bus" argument that I have already mentioned would be pointless and stupid.

Titus/Zenzao/Xanidel team for the win. (Yes I know it needs one more and a 3P but I think those three are aligned)

Yet at the beginning of the game she harps on me incessantly for not voting Newcomb. Hypocrite much?

---------- Post automerged at 00:40 ---------- Previous post was at 00:38 ----------

Then she doesn't include a single scumread in her reads. Hello?? Huge wtf. her reads are all my reads minus Zenzao polished and shiny and gives no useful information while pretending to be townie.

We should be lynching Titus right now.

 

Thanks Math, I'd forgotten about this.

I agree on Atum, Zenzao, Newcomb and TWK as town, although my reads are weaker than yours. I think Atum's highest there, followed by Waco (because the one post I mentioned earlier is the one that I remember), Zenzao (for a solid stage earlier) and lastly some gut on Newcomb. I need to reread/watch more stuff come out before judging there, though with the content rate, I expect to.

Citrus for me is totally null. He's said some stuff, sure, but it's made no impression either way.

Titus is probably leaning town/null, closer to the null. A bunch of mixed reads coming at me haphazardly, there, and I'm not sure what to make of it - reminds me of Batmafia, but of course I have no town baseline.

Fontisian is probably a good weak-town read, based on vague impressions. Tend that toward null.

So?

No, seriously, so what? Everyone is wrong a lot. I'm wrong a lot, and probably more than most people here. So long as you are humble about your reads (and don't do a Lyrium, as it were - hyperaggressiveness to people who share different POV) and willing to allow them to develop and respond to arguments and changes in the thread, they'll be of use in formulating the consensus, as well as helping people get a feeling for you.

I'm not saying you should give up analysis entirely - or that reads need to be to the exclusion of all else. But I don't see the issue in focusing on reads just because you feel you'll screw up, or someone else might do it better.



I agree with Titus that that little exchange raised flags for buddying.


@Kalas

Is apparently playing?



Also I started something on my phone, so that might jump up out of order in a few hours.

---------- Post automerged at 03:14 AM ---------- Previous post was at 03:13 AM ----------

What makes you say that, Math?

 

Of the players not mentioned on that list, I'm mostly null. Typhoon, Banks, Pozzai, and Jan I feel basically okay about, or at least nothing's triggered an alarm bell, but none of them have posted that much and it's thin.

---------- Post automerged at 01:27 AM ---------- Previous post was at 01:25 AM ----------

----- huh DLP ate the last part of that post. Trying again...

Xanidel, I'm murky on. I liked his post #198 about Titus, but the whole "I'm bad at reads, this isn't anything I can analyze" thing seems like it would be a pretty easy way for a wolf to just slank along to D3 or 4. Then again, the way he stated his lack of enthusiasm for reads, I've felt myself like 50 times this game, so... I dunno. If I had to pick one word to describe how I felt about him, it would be "conflicted."

TMNT wasn't mentioned, and I'm still reading him scum but it's kind of in a holding pattern right now until he posts something again.

That leaves you, and for me there are three things I need to look at: your push against me at the beginning, your push against Zenzao earlier today, and your push against Titus now. I do find myself nodding my head at some of the things you're saying about Titus, but I also find myself noticing that this whole series of events also kind of looks like you bouncing around from person to person hoping to gain some traction, somewhere, on a townie lynch.

My honest feeling about you right now is "I don't know." Gun to my head, I'd rather see TMNT or Titus go before you, but I think you'd be in the next group.

---------- Post automerged at 01:31 AM ---------- Previous post was at 01:27 AM ----------

That's not... look, my worry isn't that I'll be wrong per se, it's that I'll be a) wrong and b) not know it and c) not be able to correct for it over time because I didn't spend enough time building a good analytical foundation about how the game of Mafia, and this game specifically, is played.

 

Q -- my reads post: https://forums.darklordpotter.net/showpost.php?p=828006&postcount=93

Look at her "reasons" and compare to that post. Find 3 unique thoughts. If you can't it is read stealing. Furthermore she doesn't list any scumreads or why. It is like she doesn't want to be linked to anything.

The bouncing point admittedly does have some merit but in D1 you are supposed to push people to figure out their alignment. I pushed you,didn't like it, but my read changed as we interacted. The same cannot be said of the other two who are posting no scum reads but just attacking me constantly without any points of merit. In contrast I point out why I believe what I do and how and stand by that belief and if I am ever wrong I will say so. And my reads of people don't matter if they scumread me or not. It matters how they pursue it and the questions they ask.

For example Q is asking questions and investigating and I have a town read on them.

---------- Post automerged at 01:37 ---------- Previous post was at 01:35 ----------

Third and fourth paragraphs are to Newcomb.

Don't worry about your survival Newcomb. Worry about finding scum and leaving an impression that can be followed if you die or are lynched. That is more important. If I die people know where I stand. If some people die without a single scum read well...We don't know where they stand and it is ultimately more harmful.

---------- Post automerged at 01:41 ---------- Previous post was at 01:37 ----------

Furthermore stating where you stand can give associatives. For example it is thought (incorrectly) that I am buddying. Later on if I can be proven town then those making the argument have a different light. It is about putting info out for the community to hunt scum. I will be transparent (where it is good for town) and I have no problem dying to prove such. It is about assuming you won't be here and every word matters and setting up the rest of town to win.

 

Ah, that makes more sense, Newcomb. I'd contend that analyzing how roles interact and are considered is actually largely tangential to how discovering scumreads in the main thread is practised, though.

Always nice to be thought of as a collective

I don't have time to compare reads-posts right now, but I'll come back to it.