I want to hit you for the 2nd part, because I am fairly certain that you were really hoping to roll pr the last time we played, which would make that part a likely lie you just happened to tell for reasons unknown.

Will look at last game. Give me a few minutes.

---------- Post automerged at 17:23 ---------- Previous post was at 17:20 ----------

Cobalt last game :

What changed in the last month that you are hyped about rolling vt again?

Vote Cobalt

Let's see where this leads us.

 

Jari has a history of awkward, forced posts.

Nothing prompts the Neighbourizer discussion, Jari just suddenly brings it up. This buddying with Typhon rubbed me the wrong way when I saw it. It’d like the scum team decided it’s be too obvious if they don’t interact with each other, so they’re forcing an interaction.

Filler-ish. Of all the things to talk about, you want to discuss you’re excitement at the people who haven’t posted yet posting? Weird shit.

Kalas just got into the thread. He hasn’t even mentioned he’s running for election, so this question comes out of nowhere. This could be just normal buddying between two friends and Kalas’s joke response was expected, but I don’t know.

 

You pop in to read the thread.

lynch: cobalt

Hum a tune.

 

Been better, in the last couple months of my program and everything major is due.

I've done my first catch up. Nothing major's caught my eye. Leaning more nulltown then nullscum on the Vira stuff. More talk on Elections maybe though it's kind of a poor Mayor substitute. And Jarizok whenever he responds.

 

What should I be responding to right now? Accusations of awkwardness? Aw shucks.

 

Reading is hard.

 

Pretty sure the best person to elect is someone that is almost always town that you can reason with, but is smart enough to sniff out a trap.

For the most part Typhon made a similar point early on, I think.

Not sure who said person is right now.

There is an upside to that person being a strong player, because scum might be more inclined to kill the marketplace owner and getting rid of someone that you will get paranoid on later is not bad.
But the downside is that you don't feel like you can trust said player as much as you can others that are more obvious in their play.

---------- Post automerged at 17:39 ---------- Previous post was at 17:35 ----------

I will let you know that my quotes are not to be thrown around lightly.

They are heavy stuff. And big, very big. Huuge some might say.
Not your average run-of-the-mill one-liner.
Lesser men have crumbled under the pressure of them.

I do appreciate you repeating it, because I had basically forgotten about it the moment I saw Cobalts reaction to my vt question.
Just be careful you don't hurt yourself.

 

Fluff and Miner are the people I feel I have the best handle on out of the DLP regular playerbase. Miner is doing weird stuff, so I want to feel Fluff out. Throwing my support behind got plenty of discussion going there.

---------- Post automerged at 17:43 ---------- Previous post was at 17:41 ----------

Most of the discussion about myself rather than Fluff, but if I can make myself clear and townie that's also good. I just like doing stuff early.

 

Really?

How can I not jump on stuff like this?

Miner is one of the people you have the best handle on?
And you give him a townread because fonti said so, while you are not able to read him at the moment because of his change in playstyle?

And you feel good about that?

What are your own thoughts about miner outside of "weird". Do you think the things he is talking about are good? Don't look at the way he is wrapping his posts, the content is still in there.
How did you read miner before? Was it solely depended on his style and not related to content?


Did you have a townread on fluff in the last tinyhunt game (before he claimed his role on d3)?
Can you give me examples on the games where you had a good read on fluff? (Maybe you did, but I just don't remember)
Just give me the games where you read him right, I can look your iso up myself afterwards.

 

All of it on you rather then fluff. I don't think there's been anything on fluff honestly.

FLUFF. Get in here. You comfortable with how this is going?

---------- Post automerged at 02:38 PM ---------- Previous post was at 02:37 PM ----------
his fluffiness

---------- Post automerged at 02:38 PM ---------- Previous post was at 02:38 PM ----------

Oh cool. HF has enough characters that you don't need to 10 char.

 

I was scum with Miner in my first game, turned on him when he pushed Typhon in WH (after he fooled me at first), townread him during the wereeolf game. I gave up on last game I was in a bit after the suicide debacle, but at least I didn't wrongly tunnel him but Font. This is the reason I'm fine leaving Miner as is for now, I'm confident I'll figure him out down the line.

Fluff's been in I think all the games I've been in as well, (except he modded one?) but my track record of reading him correctly is admittedly a lot less impressive. Doesn't change the fact that I at least FEEl more confident in reading him than I do most others *cough*Koalas*cough*. I think having him as auction owner will aid me in my endeavor to read him and I liked his post, even if it's just common sense.

However this shakes out, the discussion generated makes it all worth it regardless.

 

What did you get out of it?

 

Okay, I think I can explain where I'm at in a way that makes sense now. Hopefully.

The last time I played with Vira, she was a player who was often a candidate for a mislynch - that may not be the case anymore, because iirc it's been a while, but that is how I remember it. As that's the case, I felt like I had to consider the possibility that this was scum!Rubicon acting with a little confirmation bias - mechanical mistakes can come from both sides, and he knows that. It's easy enough when you know someone is town to say "yeah, they would never do this as scum, they'd definitely play it safe, everyone will have seen that", but if you don't it seems bold to make that call.

The reason why I asked him about it instead of making a QT note or voting him or whatever is because Rubicon actually picked a post that makes me think Vira is probably >EV town, he just picked a bit of it that I don't think makes sense under any justification besides "too scummy to be scum", which I don't think is likely to come from town!Rubicon. If I had misunderstood him and he liked it for the same reason as me, he was probably my top town read - if it boiled down to "too scummy to be scum", he was probably my top scum read.

I think his argument ultimately does boil down to "too scummy to be scummy". I absolutely agree that there is a difference between risky and scummy, and that's the cornerstone of my Vira read, but I don't think there is in the context he's using them.

For me, Vira is more likely town because, to use Rubicon's own language from a long time ago, I don't think Vira would "make eye-contact" with fontisian by way of arguing against her tier list as scum. That's a sort of pointless thing to quibble over, and while it's less true now, at the time fontisian was projecting a take-charge, leaderish persona - that is not the sort of fontisian that you poke as a scum player that isn't super confident. At best, you introduce the mildest of doubt into the tier list. At worst, you get rolled by fontisian because she takes an interest in you.

And that's close to what he said. But it's not what he said, because he doesn't bring fontisian - who is the risk factor for a scum player that isn't a risk for a town player - into it at all. He calls it the difference between risky and scummy, but when he clarifies on risky he describes something scummy - that is, he defines risky behavior as anti-town behavior, as best as I can tell. I agree with his point that anti-town behavior doesn't necessitate that the player is scum, but I think you've absolutely fallen back into a "too scummy to be scum" argument here when you try and say that a town player is more likely to be anti-town than a scum player.

And I think the difference in argument, subtle as it might be, is probably the most alignment indicative thing in the game so far. So:

Lynch: Rubicon
Unelect, Elect: Vira

Feel free to hipcheck me here - I think I've seen something, but I'm not doing the SVM thing. Especially interested in fontisian's thoughts, since she tentatively supported Rubicon before.

 

Okay, I'm going out for a few hours, but before I go:

Typhon why are you electing me, exactly? I don't have an election platform and I haven't even put my name on the table.

 

You feel more N1 kill Jan from last game than scum Jan from SVM, Koalas feels like he always does. I suspect him every time but I think he was actually town inevery game I've played with him so town!lean for him as well.

Vira on the other hand has been opportunistically shading me with u guys which I don't like. Cobalt hopped on there as well. Nothing of significance gained on the other players, but more info outed on how everyone feels the market owner should be chosen and played.

Sure as hell beats sitting wuietly in my book.

 

You read typhon's post and then you try to summarize it:

Fonti is too scary for scum so town can talk about her and argue with her but scum are too scared to. Vira drew her attention, rubicon did not. Ergo rubicon is scum.

You ask Typhon if this is correct.

 

Typhon


It sounds like you agree with me. You just think I should have narrowed the argument to "it's risky to disagree with fontisian" rather than "it's risky to suggest something that might be anti-town."

I disagree!

---------- Post automerged at 11:05 AM ---------- Previous post was at 11:01 AM ----------

The problem with Newcomb's proposal is it fails if anyone else has bid $500 on the item earlier in the day.

---------- Post automerged at 11:10 AM ---------- Previous post was at 11:05 AM ----------

Hi Waco. So far you're playing more like how I expect you to play as town than you did in Mountainous Mafia. Wonder what that means.

What are your non-me reads?

 

If maf did that than that's a win regardless. There's 0 we can do about if 1 maf decided to bid 500 or 501 on it immediately, but then at least we made them paybfor it.

 

I have a slight scumread on fontisian this morning.

---------- Post automerged at 11:12 AM ---------- Previous post was at 11:11 AM ----------

It fails with town too. Not the end of the world, but makes his plan less useful.