-Stares that the second chapter and the summoning of the outsider... Potter...-

-stares at Nuhuh's fics-

-thinks things had better deviate quickly, or he is calling foul.-

What say you, nuhuh?

 

Eh? Haven't things already deviated? Or actually, when have things even been similar? This Harry isn't insane, nor is he working with Dresden or thinking Murphy as his mother, and I don't ever remember nuhuh's Harry wielding Summer's power or dealing with Aurora. Besides, you all know how nuhuh brazenly stole the whole 'Harry picks up a coin' -thing from Shezza...


Hmm... And what the fuck is DFMP?

EDIT: I forgot for a moment that nuhuh's story is titled "Demon's Feign, Merlin's Pain."

Oh, and Jon. You are just jealous that nobody remembers your "Harry Potter: Evocation" ...or was it Conjuration or Divination... well, who cares?

 

I would have mentioned Abjucation were it relevant to the discussion. As it is not, I did not.

As it is, it was only Chapter two that I read, I don't know that it has deviated.

Also; On the Nuhuh stealing Shezza's idea

It had always been a part of the plot, Shezza merely reached it first.

As to the "When has it even been similar" comment. From the first part of the second chapter. Ther Harry = Outsider bit. The description of Brimstone while describing his "summoner" and many other parts of that section.

Nuhuh was pasting the exact parts to me he thought you'd "borrowed" before I read it, but I doesnt has logs. Or I'd point out exactly which ones and why HE felt that.I happen to concur.

 

Actually, there's a funny story about that. One day last year I was on the train coming home from uni and feeling quite bored. I was idly wondering what would happen if Dresden Files and Harry Potter were to cross over, then I came up with a fantastic idea. I rushed home, pumped out the first chapter, checked DLP...and some arsehole named nuhuh had beaten me too it.

So, yeah, he didn't steal anything from me. He started his story before me and he had created his plot far longer in advance than mine. Comments like that bug me, especially since nuhuh is a good friend of mine.

In other words, Shut the Fuck Up.

Oh, not cool, not cool. Hey, I remember it. Even so, Abjuration had a small but loyal fanbase, myself included, and Jon was writing it more for himself than anybody else. It's a sign of maturity from a writer, to move past the instictual greed for approval of the mases (i.e. mass reviews) and write something that they feel intrigued or passionate about.

Of course, not all stories with low reviews are pet projects by their writers. Some of them just suck. I haven't read your story for a while, but tell me, with an attitude that can't accept criticism and respond accordingly, which category will your story fit into?

 

Eh? Shezza, are you seriously saying that you didn't notice the abundant sarcasm?

Hey, and I like Abjuration. The whole comment was a jest. I'm going to assume you didn't read page two of this thread. Anyway, Jon said that I suck, and thus I felt obliged to say something back. Personally I think it was hilarious.


EDIT:

Considering that both scenes describe Harry being Summoned by DF wizard(s), there are bound to be many similarities. If the books say something, chances are it will appear in both fics. Of course, I cannot safely say that the similarities (whatever they are) are all coincidences for the simple reason that I did read nuhuh's fic before I wrote mine (as who can say he isn't affected by what he reads), but as I have definitely not intentionally copied anything, I don't see why the possible similarities would matter at all. They are bound to be very minor, if they exist at all.

 

For one look at the first chapter of my fic, if that wasn't a dead give away nothing is. Second look at when my story was posted, you will find that it was before Shezzas. But you know what, forget either of those things, look at Shezza's post, the very day we both posted in Work by Author we talked in irc about our plots to make sure we weren't writing the same story. I even have logs, but you know since Shezza vouched for me himself you can shut the fuck up, and get the fuck out.

Yeah I read the opening of chapter 2 and found someone summoning an Outsider who is Potter...hmmm, where have I seen that before. Later we find that her magic smelled of brimstone...okay more suspicious parallel but alright it wasn't blatant. I mentioned it to Vash as I was reading it, telling him that it was suspicious and that it better deviate from any other plot points.

So don't bitch, I did do Outsider = Potter first, so its not unreasonable to be careful of anyone using the same plot device I used to get him into Dresden verse.

Which makes you at best the first person into making my idea a cliche. Thank you. Maybe one day I will be hated on in the same way that guy with the magical trunks is.

Shezza was the third person to review my first chapter here: His pissed off review but also complimentary

^there he says pretty much what he's said in this thread, and we've been blood brothers since.

Thank you, Shezza. CHU <3

And as a future reference Shezza, Jon, Vash, and I always brainstorm our chapters and ideas together, one of us stealing from the other would be a fucking joke.

Quoted for truth.

And please just take a minute to look at the level of characterization Jon puts in his story and scene development. You can practically reach in and feel the motivations, insecurities, and personalities of the people he writes.

You'd be much smarter dogging a poor writer. And unable to keep the name of his story straight is not a failure on his part, it is a sign of stupidity on yours.

So in Shezza's words: STFU.

 

Read page 2? Why on earth would I need background information in a debate? I did what any self-respecting person would have done, I jumped the bandwagon with my pitchfork and screamed "It's roasting time!"

What...we're not meant to do that?

Besides, we should all hate nuhuh and his cliche-ridden stories! Damn him and damn his cliched Outsider!Potter theme!

Ah, yeah, that's true. When I write characterization, I do it so I can put some funny stuff in it. When Jon writes characterisation, he does properly it with the whole deal. That's one area that Jon surpasses almost everybody I know in writing, especially me. All the best characterization scenes, and most of the mediocre, are at Jon or nuhuh's urging.

Here, Jon, have a cookie

 

Jeez, put down the pitchforks, folks.

And just to make it clear, the comment about nuhuh stealing Shezza's stuff was just to illustrate the stupidity of Vash accusation.

I mean, there are only two ways of getting Harry into Dresdenverse. First is to pretend that it has always been there and try to mix them (like Shezza and Jon have done). The other is to get Harry transported there magically, which in Dresdenverse translates as being Summoned. And as Harry obviously doesn't come from Nevernever, he must be an Outsider. I chose the latter because I didn't want to give Harry an easy way back.

Really, the main reason why I gave Harry Summer powers was to further differ my fic from nuhuh's. Most people are going to think Harry as a Sidhe instead of an Outsider. Besides, if you read chapter three you will notice even more differences (other than the totally different plot), like Harry not being able to trigger soulgaze and his body being composed of Ectoplasm.

 

Only two? Bah. It may be a yes/no as to whether he's been there all along or he hasn't, but there are more ways to travel than by being summoned.

With all the time-traveling ripple effects, I'm sure you could make a case for Harry going to a distant JKR past and then coming back into a Dresden present/future. It may not seem like a reasonable or remotely logical case, but it could be made. I think DobbyElfLord has a fic where Harry and Hermione go through the veil, end up in the faerie realm, where the Voices That Be see a "wizard named Harry" and send him "back" to Chicago.

From my limited understanding an "Outsider" is nothing like a JKR wizard, so while summoning works, it's far from the only reasonable option. If Outsiders are dangerous deadly beings from beyond the reaches of the known world, why couldn't Harry Potter be fighting them too? I mean maybe a real genuine Outsider is summoned a bit later Harry chases after it. Some intergalactic immortal policedude.

I mean the base elements are that Dresden is an adult trained wizard and way too often JKR's world is about fucking stupid as shit idiot teenagers acting like most teenagers. That is to say, a fucking stupid as shit idiot. Every crossover I've seen where Harry's not native to the Dresden world has him grown up and still ignorant as shit of the Dresden world. Since it already requires a growth and maturity found nowhere in JKR's world, why not one where Potter knows of and/or is familiar with the Dresdenverse? Maybe one he's been to in the recent or distant past? I'm sure there's some history of Dresden where you could have Potter involved. Maybe centuries ago he had the same coin Dresden has now? But the coin couldn't leave the boundaries of the Dresden world and Nevernever. Maybe Dresden's uncle/former master/whatever it was spoke of some magical asshole that was Harry Potter. Maybe Harry was hunting horcruxes across known realms and met Bob back when he was alive. If you're traveling across universes, then it's not much of a stretch to say you could travel across time too.

I don't know enough about Dresden (I liked the TV show, but I found the books a bit tedious - yes, yes, I know), but to say there's only two ways to cross them means you're not trying hard enough.

 

Umm... I said that "there are only two ways of getting Harry into Dresdenverse. First is to pretend that it has always been there and try to mix them. The other is to get Harry transported there magically, which in Dresdenverse translates as being Summoned."

Besides, you will notice it was not an ordinary Summoning, it was a weird fluke. The woman didn't intend to Summon Harry. He just happened to have been lying in an activated, incomplete Transportation Circle when she did her magic.

EDIT:

Seconded.

 

Actually, no. You could also make Harry's world part of the Nevernever, maybe a sheltered place, out of the fairy realm, but still invaded with some Nevernever creatures; you could make Harry's world an alternate dimension, with the Nevernever serving as a gate between the two worlds, in a CSLewis-kind of way; you could create yet another world under Dresden's (there's room to spare in the Underworld), which would make Dresden's world a gate between Harry's and the Nevernever, creating a hierarchy between worlds -- with possibly a fourth world under Harry's where there would be only Muggles and no magic at all.

You could have Harry summoned into Dresden verse, yes. Or Harry stumbling through a gate; cheap but you can write it in many different ways, therefore it stays efficient. Or Harry summoning Dresden/someone from the Dresden verse accidentally (what the hell, let's brew a potion and have something rise from inside the cauldron!). Or Harry being nearly killed in his world and having his soul somewhat transported to the Nevernever, where it'll shape itself into some being (Sidhe, demon, whatever) that will then be summoned or sent into the Dresden verse. Etc. There's always a way around the beaten tracks, if you go to the trouble of thinking about it.

But yeah... you *have* to go to the trouble of thinking about it.

Thinking. Key word.

People who write clichéd stories don't think. The clichés aren't bad in themselves, what's bad about them is that people just mindlessly write the same thing over and over again; why wouldn't they? it's so much easier than making a real effort of imagination. They might hurt themselves, thinking too much.

Hey, I don't even think you ripped nuhuh off; I just think you were too lazy to think of an original way to bring Harry into the Dresden verse, so you borrowed that one tiny plot twist. One tiny plot twist, that can't hurt, right?

Wrong. Because the more a plot device is used, the cheaper it becomes.

That said, I wouldn't even call it a capital sin (well in fact, now I think of it, laziness IS a capital sin... disregard what I said, you're going to hell). However the way you defended yourself was freaking idiotic. When you jokingly say that one author ripped another off, you'd damn well better make the sarcasm much more obvious than that, because as you proved it yourself, that kind of accusation usually makes an author lose every ounce of sense of humour they possess.

EDIT: Well, 3 posts made in the time it took me to type that out. Go me.

 

I know. Accordingly the Dante test; Sixth layer.

You know, that's what people call double standards. So it's okay if they do it, but wrong if do it, right?

 

You say that^ and then give the following as a "lolcopycatjokes" excuse?

I call bullshit. You better fucking be clear when you accuse me of lifting something, and make sure with abundant use of emoticons, clear words the intent of what you're saying.

This wasn't even going to be a big deal for me besides you not using your brains to come up with a plot device that was original. Nonjon and Tinn have displayed how it can be done.

But you went and made a dumbass comment about me stealing without checking sources and gave a dumbass reason for it after the fact: "Easy guys I was just using it as a juxtaposition." Fuck that. That pissed me off.

Have the grace for owning up to your crap, and no I have no sense of humor for your comments:

What she said.

@Nonjon....jeez man, you have a way of making me feel like rewriting the whole damned thing. I made Harry a clueless teenager >_<.

 

If they do what?

...

Holy fucking hell, you're not actually thinking nuhuh did take the 'Harry takes the coin' idea from Shezza?

 

Oh, really? I'm not a part of your little writing coven, and so excuse me of not knowing what you say on private conversations. You know, to me it seemed clear that Shezza was first using Denarian!Harry as he published it first. And thus, using Vash and yours logic, you are as quilty as I am. You cannot expect me to be polite you aren't. Courtesy goes both ways.

EDIT:

This just goes from bad to worse...

I meant it's allright for them to accuse me, but wrong for me to accuse them...