I was just reading a review of Sitra Ahra and it reminded me of a question I had been meaning to ask but kept forgetting about. I see reviews that criticize the author's portrayal of 1st!Harry. For instance, "1st year harry could not have thought of that plan" or "a first year does not speak that way". Now I'm not saying I disagree with them at all. I was just wondering if anyone noticed Rowling making the gradual change in dialogue or thought processes from first year to seventh year. I have honestly never noticed. The only sign of aging that I ever saw was of everyone wanting to snog each others brains out in HBP. Other than that I never noticed a difference in 1st year harry and 7th year harry. Please give me examples if you have noticed otherwise though.

 

4th year he occasionally realizes holy shit my life is actually in danger.

5th year he hits the I'm going to be an emo teenager stage.

6th year nothing really.

7th year there are occasional glimpses of a more mature Harry.

Overall the maturation process is by no means done well in my opinion, but there are some signs of it. There are more examples of it then I'm willing to spend time thinking on, but if you went back and read it just to see if he matures I'm sure you could find some examples.

 

OK, now that you mention it I see what you are saying. I always attributed fifth year anger to not being rational at all and poorly written, but I realize I proved my own point with that. Teenage anger is rarely rational haha.

---------- Post automerged 11-13-2009 at 12:16 AM ---------- Previous post was 11-12-2009 at 01:35 PM ----------

I've noticed a lot of people viewing this. If anyone else has any more examples I would be very interested to hear them.

 

I tend to agree with elvin. I haven't given this much thought, but emotional maturation is somewhat present, as he points out. He doesn't seem to be getting much smarter though. Maybe I'm overestimating the difference between the intelligence of an 11 year old and a 17 year old, or maybe its because I grew up as the books came out, and thought he was a bit of an idiot through most of them.

 

In first year, he doesn't really think.

In second, he wanted to help his friends(a step up from being a vegetable).

In third, he made one of his first plans.

Fourth had the stress of Triwizard Tournement, and Harry was finally thinking about how he could be killed.

Fifth was emo, all out. Although he was a leader with the DA.

Sixth had Harry trying to plan far ahead of time, and he wanted his suspicions recognized(Draco Malfoy being a Death Eater, for example).

Seventh had Harry recognizing how much shit he was in.

 

Harry never really did grow up until seventh book. It was just that the circumstances surrounding Harry changed in the other books so that he could think.
I mean, in fourth year he was in a life threatening contest and what does he do about it? That's right, he doesn't even bother trying to figure out the clue until a few days before second task.

In sixth book he does not question the fact that Dumbledore is not teaching him anything and he does not try to improve at all himself.

Really, in the first book you got the impression that Harry actually was a smart kid but never got to show his full potential under the Dursleys. The other books proved us wrong.

 

Harry hadn't matured much at all in the series. There were small places, but those were small and few in between. Such as 4th year, he actually tried, same with 3rd with Lupin teaching him the Patronus spell. 5th year he ran the DA, which was the only credible thing he did in that year, if you ask me. 6th book he was just a lazy turd who didn't want to improve himself at all. And Dumbledore teaching him garbage he didn't exactly need to know besides the Horcruxes and how to destroy them. 7th book I didn't even bother reading, so I can't give any opinion on it.

1st book he was a smart kid, but as soon as he started becoming friends with Ron (who's such a lazy dumbass who can't even think for himself), and Hermione's rule mongering/bossiness, he just decided to dumb himself down and make himself into a fool most of the time. Before 1st year, he was quite cunning and smart. Which is why the Hat almost put him into the snake house (and I honestly think he would have done better there, for the most part, if he kept his common sense and not be so naively stupid).

 

I was so hoping Dumbledore was going to train Harry. Ga, I was so pissed when I realized what he was going to be teaching him. Just.....dueling tips.......at LEAST.

 

In SS(PS), Harry very much seemed his age. He didn't think deeply into things, such as Snape and Quirrell's interactions throughout the book, and he was more worried about Quidditch than his education. Honestly, that's canon throughout the rest of the books as well... Hell, Hermione blatantly told him as such right after she solved the potions riddle before the mirror. She's the only intelligent one out of the trio, Ron being at the opposite end of the spectrum with Harry right beside him.

In the Chamber of Secrets, Harry once again goes into 'Quidditch before school' stage. More so, he shows his thoughtlessness by flying the Ford Anglia to Hogwarts when Dobby closes the passage, catching the attention of numerous Muggles. Hermione, once again, is the plan-maker: first with the potion, then stealing the supplies from Snape, then figuring out that the monster's a Basilisk. Harry, meanwhile, sees Riddle's diary's vision and doesn't become suspicious at all about kindly Hagrid setting his monster loose on people, nor does he go and investigate what spiders are afraid off after hearing about their fear of the monster. Over all, he's a nitwit.

Then, Third Year, he isn't interested at all in books or new spells in Diagon Alley. Instead, he spends his time staring at the Firebolt. Right on target for a thirteen year old, but don't you wish he was just a wee bit smarter? Then they get to school, and he knows Sirius Black is after him... but he does nothing at all to train himself. He just waits patiently for Lupin to teach him Expecto Patronum, and goes about his Quidditch days and lazing around in Divinations. Then the entire Buckbeak fiasco, which Harry and Ron don't do shit about, leaving Hermione to help Hagrid. Honestly, the only intelligent thing he did was learn the EP charm. Besides that, it was Dumbledore or Hermione making the plans that saved the day. Hell, he doesn't even see the importance of Trelawney's prediction.

Fourth Year, Harry begins to realize that someone is out to kill him -not that such a thing hadn't been the case in the last three books.... and you want to know what he teaches himself? The summoning spell. That's it. Besides that, it's not until after the second task that he worries about learning any more spells. Hell, Crouch Jr. babied him through every part of the tournament. Harry's too worried about Cho, finding a date for the ball, and not solving his clue to learn anything worthwhile. How can you not find the Bubblehead Charm in the biggest magical library in the world? That being said, the last month before the tournament he did study his ass off. It saved his life, and Cedric's death helped him to mature. Or was that to become emo?

Fifth Year, he suddenly finds himself as the best wizard around, despite his shitty ability in every other year. He leads the DA, and teaches them all how to beat Voldemort's most powerful Death Eaters in magical combat... What the fuck? Besides that, the year shows how emo and childish a teen he is. Harry's butt-hurt at Dumbledore, so he decides not to tell him about Umbridge using illegal torture devices on students. He also isn't smart enough to know when to keep his mouth shut, and gets himself in trouble by being a tool.

Fuck sixth and seventh. Harry gets smarter while everyone else becomes stupid as all hell. Hermione is taken over by her hormones, as is Ron, and Harry -somehow, is the only one intelligent enough to see all of the plots going on behind everyone's back. Then he's taken over by hormones, and all we see is bullshit H/G love from then on. Then Hermione realizes how retarded she was and saves the day, with heaps of help from Dumbledore and Snape.

TL;DR: Harry's a tool, Hermione and Dumbledore solve every problem in the book, and he takes the credit. Fanfiction is win because I can make my protagonist not a tool.

 

This man speaketh the truth.

win

 

Snarf.....thank you.....that was beautiful.

 

Well, let me sit you down and talk to you about Harry's maturity over the seven years.

First year: Well, not much.

Second year: He started to get hairs... down there.

Third year: Girls suddenly became a lot less icky.

Forth year: More hairs, maybe a pimple or two. Wet dreams about asians.

Fifth: Believes the world is against him; mood swings. Chronic masturbation occurs.

Sixth: Hormones on the rise, willing to at least snog Ginny Weasley. See: Desperate and Looking For An Easy Hook-Up.

Seventh: Maybe a beard - hey, he got a razor for his birthday!

 

First - he is so immature coz he's a kid...

Second - still a kid lol, but more responsible that before...

Third - more involve in planning.

Fourth - he know how dangerous it could be...lol

Fifth - more drama lol

Sixth - hunting for love (Ginny) lol...

Seventh - End ^_^

 

lol yur a fukin idiot...lol

 

And yet, so many authors go bashing Dumbledore because he didn't wan't to tell immature teenager that he probably is going to die. Surely 14 yers old was so mature he could wrap his mind around prophecy easily.

 

Pretty much agree with the subtle change everyone has commented on already, but I'd like to point out that HBP was a definite step backward in many aspects. He started to be mostly concerned about Quidditch again, became a shitty Captain and showed his predominantly thick-headed nature. He didn't use Felix until a couple of months after Dumbledore told him to get Slughorn's memory, he didn't cast fire on the Inferi, and he apparently didn't realise that Hermione wanted him to go with her to the Slug Club Party.

Making Harry more childish in fanfiction is much more of a crime than the other way around IMO.

 

I think that JK put more focus on Harry being a person that the reader could relate to than making him a culured and skilled person with an arsenal of spell and weapons at hand to make sure the bad guy is dead. And since she is writing for teenagers she made sure that Harry was as like the average teenager (ie. without interesting powers, skills, friends or, indeed, any sort of understanding of his own mortality) as possible without getting his ass handed to him by Voldemort.

One sure fire way to keep all the mediocrity in Harry without it being obvious is to make Voldemort a two-dimensional villain who formulates stupid plots and schemes that ultimately fail and make Harry look good. Chuck in some moments of maturity and sensibility here and there and you have a seemingly sophisticated protagonist with a heart of gold and who isn't too unlike your average emo teenager that readers aren't interested.

It's the ugly best friend trick; normal looking girls make merry with fugly girls to make themselves look and feel better.

Apply this to a story line and you get a boring and completely normal protagonist that the reader can "relate to" fighting a completely evil and obnoxiously simple antagonist.

A good example of this is GoF; Voldemort formulates an oh-so-simple scheme for world domination that ends in a duel with Harry, where the whole brother-wand shit comes in and saves Harry's ass, when all Voldemort had to do was Imperius a kid to hit him in the head with a snowball-cum-portkey. When Harry escapes with a minimum of wounds and a dead friend in tow this makes Voldemort look bad and Harry look like a very smart, very tough cookie.

This makes the protagonist look great and heroic and all that shit whilst still keeping that average-joe inside. Long story short JK substituted an interesting and mature character for someone that the reader (intended to be a pre-pubescent that will "grow up" with the story) can understand and relate to.

 

Sofa, imagine this for a second:

Kid gets Imperiused by some unimportant Death Eaters to slap a Portkey on Harry.

Kid does it, Harry is sent to Voldemort.

Harry dies. The end.

I'm pretty sure that Harry Potter and the Portkey That Gets Him Killed wouldn't make for a good ending to Potter!Mania.

 

No but I wish I could see Dumbledore's face if it ever happens.
I imagine it would be something like this;

+ + + =

But I think Harry is at his most immature in relation to his age in the fifth book; running off after Sirius has got to be one of the stupidest moves in all eternity.

 

I think it's rather unclear if Portkeys can bypass Hogwarts' protection under normal circumstances. Dumbledore could have been involved with lifting the limitation in every instance one was used on the castle grounds if I remember correctly.

The Triwizard Cup was supposed to transport the winner to the audience, but the final destination was never checked by anybody but the Impostor. The other Hogwarts Portkeys were used in OoTP, and created by Dumbledore.

The Headmaster obviously has control over the anti-Apperation wards, since the sixth years learnt the skill inside the Great Hall during HBP. So hypothesising that Portkeys are normally blocked in the same way closes that particular plot-whole, at least in my mind.


The best example of Harry's brain power is in CoS I think, when he figures out the mystery near the end.