How come?

 

Guys I'm extremely busy today, but I'll get online later tonight. I just want to confirm I used my power last night as agreed.

 

a) Would you ever put two scum roleblockers in a game with a bunch of one shot powers and no cop?

b) Why would scum block Elemental that night?

---------- Post automerged at 01:50 PM ---------- Previous post was at 01:49 PM ----------

Hrm.

Actually, that's like the only time I'd ever put two scum roleblockers in the same roleset.

 

They'd block Elemental if they realized he was a protective role.

 

How would they have done that? The role cop was dead.

 

I'm reading his ISO looking for clues, but I know that Citrus, Titus and Koalas are all decent rolehunters.
Koalas, please answer my question.

 

Town Protective Jack-of-all-trades.

---------- Post automerged at 01:54 AM ---------- Previous post was at 01:53 AM ----------

And it wouldn't require mistakes Rubicon, I make those all the time. It'd require thoughtless play.

 

Okay, after reading the whole thread I still think there are real problems with Koalas' claim and he's the most suspicious player left. My other suspects are Jan and Tempus, but I have more reason to think they're town.

tl;dr of my reads: I think EvilOftenWins, LJ, and Plotless are town (with a small chance of third party), Tempus Fugit is probably town and shouldn't be lynched today either way. Jan has me slightly paranoid, but I liked his push against Citrus on day one. I'm going to read his posts in more detail later. I know this is brief, and I'll post something more detailed tomorrow.

Now for Koalas:

Two roleblockers -- conditional rolecop/roleblocker + a 1-shot jailkeeper doesn't seem any weirder than an unlimited bodyguard and a doc/JK JOAT. That would be a lot of protective powers for the town.

Factional neighborizor -- probably not a thing. It doesn't make a lot of sense with a tracker, and I just don't see how one mafia PR + several goons + a factional neighborizor would be any better than one mafia PR + neighborizor + goons. TMNT wouldn't have claimed neighborizor unless his team controlled the power. So that means there is a mafia neighborizor still alive, and this is true whether or not a third party exists.

In forum mafia, JOATs pretty much invariably have 3-4 distinct powers, hence the "all trades" part. I mean, calling a doctor/jailkeeper combo a JOAT would just be naming it wrong. I'm very skeptical of this statement.

He'd have to make the chat between TMNT and someone, since he probably couldn't target himself and giving two townies a chat would be silly. If TMNT told fontisian he didn't know how the chat happened, they'd need to make up a fake role for him to claim, which has other risks.

As a JOAT, giving one of his powers to TMNT to claim would actually be a pretty good move.

Notice how he went along with this suggestion, but didn't actually hard-claim doctor until an entire day later, once no one had counterclaimed?

Come to think of it, Koalas being mafia explains why fontisian died N2 -- they figured there wasn't a town doctor or someone would have claimed it. If Koalas is town, wouldn't scum have expected him to protect her and shot him first?

fontisian suggested Koalas might be town for the claim, but that he'd die soon. She didn't know TMNT wasn't a neighborizer, and he hasn't died. Hmm.

Why on earth would he do that? Seriously.

The last point in the town-Koalas case is "why would he have targeted Elemental?" It's not a great defense. He did, maybe he read them as a PR, maybe it was just coincidence that the PR was a bodyguard. It worked out phenomenally well for scum, though.

vote: Koalas

Without these reasons to think his role might be town, what has he actually done to look town?

 

I'll adress your other points in the morning but Tempus has claimed a one shot two Night delay non-mod confirming Innocent Child but a two shot JOAT is what you find unbelievable?

 

Yes. His claim is similar to Plotless'.

 

Agree that Tempus' ability is exactly like mine - at least in terms of the time it takes to activate. If it comes to it, I can always shoot Koalas to either kill or confirm town, so that's a thing. Other people still alive, I want a reason not to shoot you.

 

If Koalas is Scum then that means there is other scum still alive making a team of 5, I mean if he isn't a jack of all trades somebody else blocked elemental.
Or he is the last scum and there is a third party still alive, but I don't think he would own up to a power used by another faction (if it exists in this game) so I have to think that there should be 5 scum in total.

 

Or Koalas is the roleblocker.

 

Rubicon- Why do you think Evil is town? What do you think of his vote on me today?

---------- Post automerged at 10:30 AM ---------- Previous post was at 10:30 AM ----------

I doubt Koalas is roleblocker if he is scum because of the Fonti track.

---------- Post automerged at 10:38 AM ---------- Previous post was at 10:30 AM ----------

There's a kind of remaining team dichotomy in my head right now.

If Koalas is scum, I think it's with Jan.

Otherwise, I think it's Rubicon and Evil.

I don't know. Plotless- what do you think? Like, I feel like if Rubicon is scum, it's almost definitely with Evil at this point.

 

Jan -> Banks
Citrus -> Banks
Fonti -> Banks
Koalas -> Fonti
Wei -> Citrus
Tempus -> Fonti
Snowvon -> Fonti
Citrus -> Plotless
Snowvon -> Banks
Fonti -> Snowvon
Titus -> Snowvon
Citrus -> Titus


Vote Count #1

Banks (2): Jan, Snowvon
Snowvon (2): fontisian, Titus
fontisian (1): Koalas
Citrus (1): weiyaoli
Titus (1): Citrus

Abstaining: Banks, Blorcyn, demonturtle, Elemental, EvilOftenWins, ljtrigirl, Plotless, Tempus Fugit, TMNTurtwig


Snowvon -> TMNTurtwig
Plotless -> TMNTurtwig
Blorcyn -> Titus
TMNTurtwig -> Plotless
demonturtle -> Titus
Titus -> Demonturtle
Plotless -> Demonturtle
Blorcyn -> Demonturtle
LJ -> Jan
Wei -> Snowvon


Vote Count #2

demonturtle (3): Titus, Plotless, Blorcyn
Titus (2): Citrus, demonturtle
Snowvon (2): fontisian, weiyaoli
Banks (1): Jan
fontisian (1): Koalas
TMNTurtwig (1): Snowvon
Plotless (1): TMNTurtwig
Jan (1): ljtrigirl

Abstaining: Banks, Elemental, EvilOftenWins, Tempus Fugit


Fonti -> Citrus
Citrus -> Fonti
Jan -> Citrus


Vote Count #3

demonturtle (3): Titus, Plotless, Blorcyn
Citrus (2): fontisian, Jan
fontisian (2): Koalas, Citrus
Titus (1): demonturtle
Snowvon (1): weiyaoli
TMNTurtwig (1): Snowvon
Plotless (1): TMNTurtwig
Jan (1): ljtrigirl

Abstaining: Banks, Elemental, EvilOftenWins, Tempus Fugit


Banks -> Jan


Vote Count #4

demonturtle (3): Titus, Plotless, Blorcyn
Citrus (2): fontisian, Jan
fontisian (2): Koalas, Citrus
Jan (2): ljtrigirl, Banks
Titus (1): demonturtle
Snowvon (1): weiyaoli
TMNTurtwig (1): Snowvon
Plotless (1): TMNTurtwig

Abstaining: Elemental, EvilOftenWins, Tempus Fugit


Snowvon -> Koalas
Wei -> Koalas
Evil -> Koalas
Blorcyn -> Koalas
Citrus -> Evil
Wei -> Evil


Vote Count #6

Koalas (3): Snowvon, EvilOftenWins, Blorcyn
Citrus (2): fontisian, Jan
Jan (2): ljtrigirl, Banks
EvilOftenWins (2): Citrus, weiyaoli
demonturtle (2): Titus, Plotless
fontisian (1): Koalas
Titus (1): demonturtle
Plotless (1): TMNTurtwig

Abstaining: Elemental, Tempus Fugit


--- Citrus got shot ---

The vote count has been reset.


Fonti -> Demonturtle
Titus -> Demonturtle
Snowvon -> Demonturtle
Koalas -> Demonturtle
Jan -> Demonturtle
Fonti unvotes
Snowvon unvotes
Jan unvotes


Vote Count #7

demonturtle (2): Titus, Koalas

Abstaining: Banks, Blorcyn, demonturtle, Elemental, EvilOftenWins, fontisian, Jan, ljtrigirl, Plotless, Snowvon, Tempus Fugit, TMNTurtwig, weiyaoli


Fonti -> Titus
Snowvon -> Titus
Jan -> Titus
Titus -> Jan
Plotless -> Titus
Demonturtle -> Titus
Tempus -> Titus


Vote Count #8

Titus (6): fontisian, Snowvon, Jan, Plotless, demonturtle, Tempus Fugit
demonturtle (1): Koalas
Jan (1): Titus

Abstaining: Banks, Blorcyn, Elemental, EvilOftenWins, ljtrigirl, TMNTurtwig, weiyaoli


Evil -> Titus
Blorcyn -> Titus
Tempus -> Evil
LJ -> Koalas
Titus -> Evil
Wei -> Titus


Vote Count #9

Titus (9): fontisian, Snowvon, Jan, Plotless, demonturtle, Tempus Fugit, EvilOftenWins, Blorcyn, weiyaoli
demonturtle (1): Koalas
EvilOftenWins (1): Titus
Koalas (1): ljtrigirl

Abstaining: Banks, Elemental, TMNTurtwig


--- Titus gets lynched ---

--- Snowvon dies n1 ---


Fonti -> Plotless
Plotless -> TMNTurtwig
Jan -> Banks
Banks -> Plotless
LJ -> Jan


Vote Count #2.1

Plotless (2): fontisian, Banks
TMNTurtwig (1): Plotless
Banks (1): Jan
Jan (1): ljtrigirl


Fontisian -> LJ
Banks -> LJ
LJ -> Koalas
Fontisian -> TMNTurtwig
Tempus -> Elemental

Vote Count #2.2

TMNTurtwig (2): Plotless, fontisian
ljtrigirl (1): Banks
Banks (1): Jan
Koalas (1): ljtrigirl
Elemental (1): Tempus Fugit

Abstaining: Blorcyn, demonturtle, Elemental, EvilOftenWins, Koalas, TMNTurtwig, weiyaoli

LJ -> Jan
Elemental -> TMNTurtwig
TMNTurtwig -> Elemental
Wei -> Elemental
Jan -> TMNTurtwig


Vote Count #2.3

TMNTurtwig (4): Plotless, fontisian, Elemental, Jan
Elemental (3): Tempus Fugit, TMNTurtwig, weiyaoli
ljtrigirl (1): Banks
Jan (1): ljtrigirl

Abstaining: Blorcyn, demonturtle, EvilOftenWins, Koalas


Evil -> TMNTurtwig
Blorcyn -> TMNTurtwig
demonturtle -> TMNTurtwig
LJ -> Elemental


Vote Count #2.4

TMNTurtwig (7): Plotless, fontisian, Elemental, Jan, Blorcyn, demonturtle, EvilOftenWins
Elemental (4): Tempus Fugit, TMNTurtwig, weiyaoli, ljtrigirl
ljtrigirl (1): Banks

Abstaining: Koalas


Koalas -> TMNTurtwig


--- TMNTurtwig gets lynched ---

--- Fontisian dies ---


Plotless -> Elemental
Banks -> Elemental


Vote Count #3.1

Elemental (2): Plotless, Banks

Abstaining: Blorcyn, demonturtle, Elemental, EvilOftenWins, Jan, Koalas, ljtrigirl, Tempus Fugit, weiyaoli


LJ -> Elemental


Vote Count #3.2

Elemental (3): Plotless, Banks, ljtrigirl

Abstaining: Blorcyn, demonturtle, Elemental, EvilOftenWins, Jan, Koalas, Tempus Fugit, weiyaoli


Wei -> Banks
Blorcyn -> Banks
Elemental -> Banks
Jan -> Banks
Plotless -> Banks
Demonturtle -> Banks
Evil -> Banks


Vote Count #3.3

Banks (7): weiyaoli, Blorcyn, Elemental, Jan, Plotless, demonturtle, EvilOftenWins
Elemental (2): Banks, ljtrigirl

Abstaining: Koalas, Tempus Fugit


Koalas -> Banks
Banks -> Jan


--- Banks gets lynched ---

--- Blorcyn dies ---


Demonturtle -> Jan
LJ -> Elemental
Demonturtle unvotes
Jan -> Tempus


Vote Count #4.1

Elemental (1): ljtrigirl
Tempus Fugit (1): Jan

Abstaining: demonturtle, Elemental, EvilOftenWins, Koalas, Plotless, Tempus Fugit, weiyaoli


Plotless -> Koalas
Plotless Unvotes
Plotless -> Elemental
Evil -> LJ
Tempus -> LJ


Vote Count #4.3

Elemental (2): ljtrigirl, Plotless
ljtrigirl (2): EvilOftenWins, Tempus Fugit
Tempus Fugit (1): Jan

Abstaining: demonturtle, Elemental, Koalas, weiyaoli


Wei -> Elemental
Jan -> Elemental
Koalas -> Tempus
Demonturtle -> Tempus


Vote Count #4.4

Elemental (4): ljtrigirl, Plotless, weiyaoli, Jan
ljtrigirl (2): EvilOftenWins, Tempus Fugit
Tempus Fugit (2): Koalas, demonturtle

Abstaining: Elemental


Tempus -> Elemental
LJ -> Tempus
LJ -> Elemental
Evil -> Elemental


Vote Count #4.5

Elemental (6): Plotless, weiyaoli, Jan, Tempus Fugit, ljtrigirl, EvilOftenWins
Tempus Fugit (2): Koalas, demonturtle

Abstaining: Elemental


Demonturtle -> Elemental

--- Elemental gets lynched ---

--- Demonturtle dies ---


Evil -> LJ
LJ -> Evil
Rubicon -> Koalas


All votes and votals in order (i might have skipped 1-2 votals when they didnt include new votes).
I coloured the flipped people green or red accordingly. I added plotless ing reen, because i assume he will proof himself during the day.

Posting this first, so we are all on the same basis.
Talking about it next.

Keep in mind, while those are all the votes that happened until now, sometimes context and exact timing is important.
Who voted before or after a claim or case, which votes were serious, and which only troll.

 

My reads have been pretty bad this game, other than TMNT as scum, but I agree that Koalas is only scum if Jan is with him.

I liked Evil's posts earlier, I might go back and check.

 

Obviously the wei slot is now played by Rubicon.

Just so people don't forget.

---------- Post automerged at 17:09 ---------- Previous post was at 17:03 ----------

I already found a mistake .. before citrus got shot.
I wrote that wei voted on koalas, but he really voted evil.

The votal afterwards had it right. Guess i just had fun writing koalas name and did it one too many times.
Welp. I hope that is the only time i fucked up.

---------- Post automerged at 17:25 ---------- Previous post was at 17:09 ----------

In a world of 4 scum, every vote after day 2 is something to take with a grain of salt, because a lonely scum has no partner to bus, and only town to vote on.

In a world of 5 that part might still be interesting.


I want to say, that i really want evil to step up and play more and give more infos.

But i still think him to be town. Just one point - #516


Sorry my thoughts are kinda unfiltered, but reading that post might me realize that i nearlly had forgotten it.

---------- Post automerged at 18:18 ---------- Previous post was at 17:25 ----------

Vote Count #2.3

TMNTurtwig (4): Plotless, fontisian, Elemental, Jan
Elemental (3): Tempus Fugit, TMNTurtwig, weiyaoli
ljtrigirl (1): Banks
Jan (1): ljtrigirl

Abstaining: Blorcyn, demonturtle, EvilOftenWins, Koalas


That is a votal I personally i think is interesting to see.
I voted on TMNT just before this, and there are two wagons, 1 town, 1 scum head to head.

2 unconfirmeds on the town wagon, and lj being somewhere out of bonds as she was all game.
I think she has not voted on a single scum this game.

She will argue that she would have bussed her partners after a certain point, which is possible, but nothing but Wifom at this point.

She only started blooming and really getting into the game on day 3, AFTER fonti died, who dominated town and had LJ quite high on her own scumlist.

The one person LJ always comes back to is me, without a good case, mostly a bit on how i feel off this game.
To feed you a bone lj, the one thing that speaks against me is that banks called me scum before he died. He was wrong and disconnected from the game, but that is still the biggest point against me.

On several occasions LJ has fucked up and asked for informations that have been given before, which is a sign for me that she does not care, and is not into the game.
Which would make sense as scum if you lose your partners early on.

The votes on LJ are not really telling, due to her day 1 claim.

The votes involving LJ :
Day 1 :
LJ -> Jan (first rvs, then real)
LJ -> Koalas

Noone voted on her.

Day 2:
LJ -> Jan
LJ -> Koalas
LJ -> Jan
LJ -> Elemental


Fontisian -> LJ
Banks -> LJ

Both confirmed town.

Day 3:
LJ -> Elemental

Noone voted on LJ

Day 4:
LJ -> Elemental
LJ -> Tempus
LJ -> Elemental

Evil -> LJ
Tempus -> LJ

Day 5:
Evil -> LJ


The only questionmarks voting on her are Evil and Tempus, both more likely town.
She did not vote on a confirmed scum. First she pingponged between me and Koalas. She then swapped over to vote Elemental, with a short stop on a tempus vote.

I feel good about evil.
Tempus looks better considering plotless claim (since it is a similar mechanic, both of them unusual), which means the only possible scum she might have voted on is koalas.

Interesting to see that wei/rubicon and LJ have not once voted on each other.
I need to look at their reads on each other during the game, to see if that would be a possible team of 2, if there is still one left.

Numbers wise a single scum is more likely (16+ is normally 4 scum, the fifth scum gets added with 20 players i think), but since town has that many roles, and scum already had two goons and we know that the/a remaining mafia has the neighbourizer power, there is a chance of two scum left.

That votal took a bit more time than i thought, will have to leave soon.
I should have most time of tomorrow to work on more and also look at other people.

As I said, I would like people to write in here and take a position on the game. Before the shot if possible.
I know it is weekend, but you guys should be able to do something.

Will be more or less gone now (a bit of phone checking for questions asked). Will check out wei/rubicon and koalas when i am back. esp with that push, might be interesting to see.


Plotless if you actually want me to make a case of why i am town/ you should not shoot me, let me know.
I can do that, but i think it is a waste of time, unless people actually make a case on me being scum and have any reasons for it.
I prefer looking at the other people, and see their reactions, that gives me more.

---------- Post automerged at 18:23 ---------- Previous post was at 18:18 ----------

And please explain the connection people draw between Koalas and myself, thank you.

 

I think you're town Jan. I'm currently looking at Rubicon or lj. If either of those would like to not die, please explain.

 

Koalas is a mafia jack-of-all-trades. Eidolonic has used mafia JOATs before, in Mini Mafia 5 (with three abilities). I think he has a 1-shot jailkeeper, a 1-shot neighborizor, and probably something else.

Why do you think it makes him scummy to vote you?

One reason I think Evil is town is that Citrus intercepted Evil's questioning of Snowvon in order to make himself look thoughtful and active. He was thinking about how he looked, not how Evil looked.

I've been on teams with Citrus and Titus before. They coach their less experienced partners to be active. If Citrus and Evil were partners, he'd be encouraging Evil to scumhunt and engage with other players, not jumping in and blocking it.

His reactions to pressure d1 were very good, and when he does scumhunt, there's much more depth than say, Koalas.

Works fine if he's a mafia JOAT.

This is good to have.

Some people seem to think you might be Koalas' partner. What do you think of his flavor? Does it match a purely protective role? (I haven't read American Gods.)

I'll save you some trouble and say there's no chance whatsoever I'm going to vote LJ today.

*cough*mafiajoat*cough*

Excuse me, I have a cold.

Doesn't matter to me. I'll survive and use my confirmed town status to lynch Koalas.

LJ's only scum if she's a third party because of her ascetic claim, which would be silly as mafia, and because Citrus didn't expect it and thought she was a third party.

 

Only a short answer from my phone before I go to sleep.

While your mafia joat goes more into detail, it is close to the one world I talked about.
The only iffy part is the block on elemental, because elemental is town and we know that happened.

So they must have had a PR read on or something.

On the other hand, koalas jailing/blocking elemental that night and thus enabling the fonti nightlife looks bad.

His play is similar to lj, in that they both got more active after fonti died, if I remember correctly.
And both of them have not really bothered to lead a charge for a lynch, and were fine working from the 2nd to 3d row.

Oh you wanted to know about his flavor, sorry I overstepped.
it is a possible fit?!
I have not reread the whole book in a while and his character is not one I remember in all detail.
The lore outside of the book does fit in a way.
Heinzelmännchen are known to help out during the night when everybody sleeps and they are unseen.
They fix broken things and clean up and stuff like that, I think. Really not the part of German folklore I ever cared about.
His flame fits loosely, but considering that citrus as rolecop hat a fitting claim, I would assume they were given some sort of fakeclaim by the mods or gut really lucky.

Like .. If you Check the wiki, 3 out of 4 non God roles flipped or got claimed, and scum get lucky by randomly picking the last one?
I do not believe in that kind of luck.

So yeah, every character claim is only as good as the player is at projecting town, at this point.

Evils claimed character is one that I do not remember interacting with the main plot for example.
I remember the being a single chapter where a Falkirk of some sorts has intercourse with a random guy, he closes his eyes and feels really well, but also kinda warm. And when he opens his eyes again most of his body is in her vagina and a few thrusts later he is gone.
and that is her whole role in that book, as far as I remember right now.

Outside of the manichaean obviously being in the game, some people might be filler chars.

The one thing that strikes me as odd tbh, is that I would have always picked Mr Nancy aka anansi the African trickster spider as host. Because for me a joat being a trickster character fits the bill best.
that might just be personal preference.

---------- Post automerged at 22:16 ---------- Previous post was at 22:15 ----------

Well, that for my short answer.

Going to bed now, please produce some content while I am gone guys, thanks.