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Abandoned Control by Anonymous58 - M

Discussion in 'Dark Arts' started by Andro, Apr 13, 2010.

  1. awinarock

    awinarock Fourth Champion

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    No politician in their right mind would want to make an "alliance" or dance at Harry's feet. This Harry is loose cannon that is literally only good for killing things. Also, the people cheering for Harry were students who most likely thought that it was just cool magic, not Dark Magic, who the politicians don't really need to pander to. If anything, he might be manipulated by politicians to further their agenda, but not pandered to.

    Dumbledore is considered the most powerful wizard because of what he achieved. He defeated a Dark Lord, Discovered uses for Dragons Blood, and who knows how many other things. As for Voldemort, we don't really have a clear idea of how many followers he has. Voldemort has also proved his power by proving a challenge even for Dumbledore. Harry is a psychotic nobody student, who displayed how stupid he was by using highly illegal Dark Magics in front of Ministry Officials and showing them that he should have been kept in Azkaban. He's not doing any favors for himself and he's not proving anything to anyone that matter except how desperate to prove his power. He is also not a good representative for Hogwarts or Britain.
     
  2. hexokinase

    hexokinase First Year

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    Whats wrong with having friends?

    Also I am emphasizing the politician might want to use HP's display - which I argue bolsters the ministry's image in the eyes of the international governments - to further their own agenda such as incredibly important cauldron thickness treaty. Furthermore as was pointed out, the magic not illegal but allowable under tourney rules and regulations, which snape highlighted and alluded to while defending HP from Crouch and aurors wanting to arrest him.
     
    Last edited: Dec 15, 2011
  3. awinarock

    awinarock Fourth Champion

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    It may not have been illegal to use in the tournament, but it does give anyone that wants to paint him as a up and coming Dark Lord a lot of ammunition. Also, the display of magic wouldn't bolster the ministry's image in the eyes of the international government at all. If anything, it just shows everyone that the Ministry of Britain allows psychotic Dark Wizards to run amok. The magic that Harry's using is illegal for a reason and it's destroying him.
     
  4. hexokinase

    hexokinase First Year

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    nope not illegal cuz used on beasts not "creatures" ie humanoids.

    Is it psychotic to put down a rabbid dog? as far as I'm concerned animals have two functions, to be eaten and to be defurred for cool wardrobes. Clearly the dragon needed to go.
     
  5. awinarock

    awinarock Fourth Champion

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    Your right about that, but it still shows everyone that he not only has knowledge of such Dark Magics, but he knows how to use it and uses it like a retard as well. It makes him open to manipulation, not adoration. JK Rowling never really covered the opinion of Dark Magic in other countries, so we can't really know if they would even be impressed or just plain shocked that he's allowed to walk free.
     
  6. Zansa

    Zansa Third Year

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    Wait. You can't do that. You're comparing an ant to a colony. Albus is arguably the most powerful wizard in the world. Barack Obama is arguably the most powerful muggle in the world. Why would you name the most powerful wizard in the world, ask us to name a complementary muggle, and then list other entities? Of course a single man isn't more powerful than a nation.

    When the French Minister wants to make a trade agreement with Britain his first thought isn't "I should schedule a meeting with Dumbledore!"

    If you're going to argue two points via contrast at least keep your scales consistent.

    edit: Dumbledore is "physically" the most powerful wizard in the world if you want to go that route. Mariusz Pudzianowski is probably his muggle equivilant in that regard.
     
    Last edited: Dec 15, 2011
  7. Relic

    Relic High Inquisitor

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    Tom Riddle attracted many followers because he was charismatic, brilliant and attached himself to a cause that many people believed him. And yes, he was extremely powerful. It was a combination of all these things that made him not out to be a powerful lunatic but a powerful leader that caused many people to join him.

    Harry in this fic is in a completely different boat - he's powerful yes, but the complete opposite of what Tom Riddle or Dumbledore was personality wise. People don't like to allign or "follow" people who are openly crazy, no matter how powerful they are.



    Dumbledore is more powerful than any minister could ever be. We learned this from you know, the entire series where Dumbledore and by proxy Harry are thwarting Voldemort and ultimately defeating him while the Ministry lay in shambles and compromised by the enemy.

    Sure he's not involved in day to day politics like a trade agreement (because he probably doesn't care) but if you think that any agreement that isn't set in Harry's 5th doesn't help immensely from Dumbledore's support, you'd be crazy.

    Harry even said exactly how powerful Dumbledore is in the sixth book to Scrimgeour. Don't have the quote in front of me but he essentially said "Fudge tried interfering last year and see how that worked out for him." Harry, a teenage, told the Minister to fuck off so if that doesn't prove Dumbledore's power I'm not sure what does.

    And you are equating the magical world to the muggle world incorrectly. The power dynamic is extremely different because one person can wield tremendous personal power, much more than any muggle could. A closer comparison would be equating Dumbledore to a powerful freeholding lord medieval times. Is he a head of state? No, but that doesn't stop him from doing whatever he wants and exerting tremendous influence in a multitude of ways.

    Aaand now back to studying...
     
  8. Vincent

    Vincent Death Eater

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    Why are you guys ignoring that Dumbledore actually had a high ranking government position? You're acting as if he has major pull just because he's uber powerful. He was Chief Warlock of what seems like the supreme court/congress.
     
  9. IBG

    IBG Seventh Year

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    He wasn't back at the end of the first war I think.
     
  10. Vincent

    Vincent Death Eater

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    He was likely still in the Wizengamot given that he was at Crouch Jr.'s trial.
     
  11. El Duderino

    El Duderino Groundskeeper

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    He's right you know.

    Also, Dumbledore is part of the ICW isn't he?
     
  12. Another Empty Frame

    Another Empty Frame Fake Flamingo DLP Supporter

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    In canon he was the Supreme Mugwump, and as Chief Warlock of the Wizengamot he IS one of the people trade agreements would be talked about with. Albus Percival Wulfric Brian Mugglebuggerer Dumbledore isn't a fucking schoolteacher as a career, but as a passion, he's more or less the guiding figure of the Wizarding World.
     
  13. El Duderino

    El Duderino Groundskeeper

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    This means we can all shut up about Dumbledore compared to muggles right?
     
  14. Zansa

    Zansa Third Year

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    I probably could have worded my post better. Dumbledore is undoubtedly powerful, both peronally and politically, I was saying that Dumbledore isn't more powerful than the ministry as a whole. Hexinokase's post specifically said that when we think of power we think of groups, while simultaneously singling Dumbledore out as some sort of epitome of power among wizards.

    I wouldn't even say wizards view power differently than we do. People respect Dumbledore because of his numerous accomplishments, if people really respected him primarily because of how strong he is he wouldn't have all of those titles. Just look at Fudge, he was respected enough to become Minister, but did he really strike you as being one of the more powerful wizards of his generation?
     
  15. El Duderino

    El Duderino Groundskeeper

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    Well, Fudge is a cock, and never uses magic.

    And also, Dumbledore is respected for being the Arnold Schwarzenegger of the magic world, and he gets respected for some of his accomplishments because of that, like killing Grindelwald, and for Voldemort being fucking terrified of him.
     
  16. Another Empty Frame

    Another Empty Frame Fake Flamingo DLP Supporter

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    Drawing magic to muggle comparisons is shittastic, stop it all of you.
     
  17. Shinysavage

    Shinysavage Madman With A Box ~ Prestige ~

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    Not that he did kill Grindlewald; defeated, yes, but not killed.

    For what it's worth, I'm with those saying that the Ministry wouldn't get any sort of advantage out of this, one way or another. Sure, Durmstrang apparently has a reputation for a rather more lenient approach to the Dark Arts, but that doesn't mean the country as a whole does. Even if we do make the assumption that any foreign dignitaries watching are going "Damn this guy's good", as opposed to "What a fucking pyschopath", I'm fairly certain that no Ministry under Fudge would be taking advantage of a prospective Dark Lord. We do remember how paranoid he was about Dumbledore taking over in canon, yes? Think about how he might feel about someone willing and able to kill a dragon by themself, with no regard for what others think.

    More generally, still very much enjoying this. It's well written, and it's actually doing something with Dark!Harry beyond random evulz.
     
  18. EinStern

    EinStern Seventh Year

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    Well, actually, I'd say that Harry does do a lot of random evulz in this fic. It's just that he's got a good reason for doing so (being that he has some... issues) and that how he goes about with his random evulz and the consequences thereof are a lot better (and I daresay realistically) portrayed than one might expect.
     
  19. hexokinase

    hexokinase First Year

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    @relic: HP isn't that 'openly crazy' or Hermione would have never trusted him with her books, nor would Albus have exerted his political influence to free Harry and keep him freed (actively) after the 'debacle' of the first task, nor would the student body have applauded him on his entry into the great hall in that one scene. Or rather his craziness is borderline tolerable, which in the scheme of things isn't that big of a deal considering most wizards are borderline crazy anyways.
     
    Last edited: Dec 18, 2011
  20. Vincent

    Vincent Death Eater

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    Are we talking about the same Harry Potter that cut off a house elf's head at the dining table and then razed her mind 2 minutes afterwards with effects that lasted three days? Albus' actions are implied to be because he thinks Harry has something to do with the prophecy.

    It's already been established that most students don't know that Harry was using dark magic. That defense is getting old. He has openly threatened to kill two students already and one of them is a constant companion of his. He broke him arm over a desk in Charms class to get the juices flowing. He's openly crazy to them as well I guarantee you. Being awesome and being crazy are not mutually exclusive and so there's no reason for them not to applaud him.
     
    Last edited: Dec 18, 2011