First, for those unaware what Dies the Fire is about:

In the scenario I bring you here today, the Change happens in the Potterverse. To make it more interesting, we are also going to add one more thing:

The frequency of new muggleborn magicals is multiplied by 10. So if we had 10 muggleborns born in Britain each year, it will be 100 now.

How soon would the wizarding world notice that something wrong is happening with the muggles? Would they figure out what happened? We have to consider that in March 1998, the British Ministry of Magic was still under Voldemort's rule. In fact, I'd say the Change happens even before Harry and others are captured by Snatchers (Late March in the book).

How will the Change affect Harry's search for the Horcruxes and the Second War in general? In ~11 years or so how will the sudden influx of muggleborns be received?

Finally, the Change obviously sucks for muggles, but might be beneficial to wizards, especially those wizards who would wish to rule over the non-magical people. Might we see an end to the Statute?

 

Sounds like the Change is Voldemort's grander scheme. Perhaps he was waiting to execute such a global curse for after Dumbledore's fall- to ensure that the only ones left who could unweave his magic were dead (Albus), incarcerated (Grindelwald) or in hiding (Flamel).

 

Was Flamel ever stated to be an all around great wizard? His only accomplishments noted relate to alchemy from what I remember.

 

That's true- he was never regarded as a combatant. Still, he and Perenelle were nearly 700 years old. They might have some game. He's also one of the few wizards that might be familiar with using swords.

I could see the trio just beginning to see stuff fall apart, starting with their wizard wireless. As things get more barbaric, they scramble to connect with anyone that could guide them to a solution to this uber curse, only to end up in races against assassinations.

Woe be to them if the only one they can catch up to before Voldemort has struck them ends up being Herpo the Foul, still alive 2 millennia later because of that there Horcrux he invented.

Question is; will he help Harry or was this Herpo's plan all along?

 

Why would he need to be able to use swords? Magic is still around.

Why would the Wizard Wireless stop working? I don't remember from canon, but doesn't it operate using different methods than muggle radio waves? If it does indeed use radio waves, then you're right and they notice pretty soon.

I've never seen Herpo used well as a character, I'd like to see that.

 

I hate to be a stick in the mud, but no.

If tl;dr:

 

Seriously?

 

And? I don't think anyone at any point is seriously suggesting that it is possible in the real world for all technology to stop working.

Yes, the same physical processes underlie both biological and technological processes. But the very fact that I can delineate the two with language means that they are not identical in every respect. They may be physically identical, but not everything is physical. Because I can separate the two linguistically I can perfectly well entertain "technology stops working" without having to believe "biological processes stop working", even if physically the two rely on the same things. In a similar way I can imagine myself disembodied, even though my body is what allows me cognition.

In the context of the HP world, we have the example of Muggles and squibs which are physically (and magically) identical, and yet squibs can do things like see Hogwarts while Muggles cannot. They exist in a different social categories and this is sufficient for magic to affect them.

Further examples of magic taking into account non-physical things: the ability to cast magic on secrets, job positions, and words.

In short:

Yes you can, so long as what makes it stop isn't something chemical. If a new rule is introduced to the universe "technology doesn't work" and it is true that "matches are technology" and it is true that "human bodies are not technology" then it's perfectly fine to have matches not working but the human body continuing.

P.S. I hope someone kidnaps you and decides to kill you by grating you with a cheese grater.

 

The universe Taure describes requires a DM/sentient referee to function. The universe Eliezer Yudkowsky describes requires only Quantum Mechanics to function. That is the core difference.

 

Yeah, but what about a GHMC? I mean, we all know that a HCD needs a HMLS to work, but if the KLS changes to a PYPL then a SLDF reaction will occur, meaning that SCLA suddenly works.

 

My pedantic counter-argument, best ignored:

Spoiler

The universe that Wolf550e believes that Eliezer Yudkowsky may describe is not the universe JK Rowling created, nor the universe described by a crossover between Dies the Fire and a version of the fanfiction-refined Potter-verse that would be detailed in the story idea that Xandrel proposed, particularly because no one has written a story about it yet. Also, by the existence of magic, it (whichever of the above universes you'd like to contrast in this case) isn't the real world.

Shorter version: T3t, take that up with S.M. Stirling. Wolf550e, why are you invoking the accursed one? Taure- that was a very wordy 'because I've got a forcefield, so thbthbthb!' Well done.

Also, I've got this weird 'Fred and George became dark lords' short-circuit in my brain ever since Oz replied to Taure. What was wrong with gleeful Sulu?

Back to the idea- I'd suggest swords are relevant to wizards because they may want to travel incognito, and once bullets stop working, carrying a sword with confidence would be the best self-defense a man can carry. Whether the wizarding wireless works or not is an authorial decision; do you want the wizards to have broadcast capabilities or not? If not, then they're affected by whatever curse Voldemort used.



EDIT: and this is my 1000? Could be worse.

 

S.M.Stirling, the author of Dies the Fire, admitted that a higher being caused the change and therefore it affects things arbitrarily. This whole argument was pointless, gentlemen.

In any case, if I remember correctly, the Change stopped trains from working, YES EVEN STEAM POWER DOES NOT WORK.

So, Hogwarts express, if it is not hidden, will look awfully suspicious now. In fact, there will be no people on train stations, so wizards going to platform 9 3/4 will look out of place even more.

 

It seems to me only fair that if Muggle technology stops working, then magical technology (most significantly, wands) should do the same. (And it makes the scenario more interesting).

 

That's not what I have thought about, interesting.

Still, taking away wands seems too harsh. Why, because canon wandless magic sucks, that's why.

How about a compromise then? No floo powder, no portkeys and no apparition, no hogwarts express, no knight bus, no Durmstrang boat, no brooms, no vanishing cabinets, no time turners. And no magic affecting the mind (Fidelius, Repello Muggletum, Imperius, Obliviate, Legilimency, Confundus, etc). On that last thought, no Unforgivables at all.

 

I like the idea of Voldemort initiating this event after he wins against the Ministry so that wizards can retake the planet from the Muggles.

I don't see why magic wouldn't work anymore. Magic that works in tandem with technology like the wizarding radio, Arthur Weasley's car, the Knight Bus or the Hogwarts Express maybe, but magic itself shouldn't be affected.

I've never read this book or book series, but if it's just the basic premise being used then anything else probably isn't relevant, right?

 

Taure's concern has however some relevance. You see, in the book(s), after the change eliminated technology, something akin to magic has started to appear in the world. Very small and very weak at first, but there are some hints.

So there is grounds for saying that the change affects things like magic. Now, in what ways, this could be debated forever, but the point stands.

 

He didn't say magic itself, he said the wizard version of technology, and that wands fit under that.

I would say they wouldn't though. Even going by the original Dies the Fire itself it's not like all tools stopped working (and I would argue that despite how useful and essential they are, wands are physically pretty basic tools. They just sit there as a piece of magical animal in wood and act as a focus for the wizard), and with the premise that it's from a spell cast by Voldemort, I'm pretty sure it would be specifically designed to take out muggle technology rather than absolutely anything created by human hands.

 

It could also make magic stronger in certain ways, perhaps making the subtle magics Harry was developing a sense for toward the end of DH a bit more advantageous.

 

I'm on the fence about the wands and such being 'depolarized'; it would make the scenario more devastating overall and prevent an auto-win for the magical side, but it would leave everyone very vulnerable to magical creatures, particularly the goblins.

Here's a version to consider: Voldemort's curse sends out a wave that 'unwrites what is written and contaminates all that is combustible'. It was supposed to skip over anything living or with magic infused, but he miscalculated.

Anything written became meaningless spaghetti, including the runes that bind together magical devices and anything encoded in computer systems. Potions were rendered useless, as was all gunpowder, fuel oil, petrol, radioactive materials and interestingly enough, all pharmaceuticals.

EDIT: this was based upon a slightly different idea, that 'all things refined' were contaminated, so toss that out if it doesn't fit for you. Keeping with tainting combustibles would affect some potions and pharmaceuticals but nowhere near all. It would kill all existing batteries, though.

Since this was a one-time effect, future mined & harvested materials wouldn't be compromised, but people didn't know that at first. There's also the possibility that the wave will pulse again once a year or something.

Wandless magic still allows many spells and capabilities (including Legilimency and Apparition), but most people haven't been able to leverage it since they were young. The range on wandless magic is more limited and the effects are very difficult to control.

Since everything was unwritten, there would be considerable efforts for people to transcribe what they think they know. People might still value their elders, unlike most apocalyptic scenarios.