Just a little thing that's annoys me a little bit.

The 'General Discussion' subforum is currently described as:

There is no Deathly Hollows subforum, at least, not that I can see.

 

As the owner of FanFictionRecs.net, I can shed some light on this:

1. Their ToS says you cannot use a bot to submit more requests than a person reasonably can in a given period of time. This is a dubious, but reasonable, Term, and the crawlers I've written all take that into account (I delay it so that crawls can only happen, at fastest, half a second after the previous crawl).

2. Their ToS says a whole bunch of other things about the data itself, however most of it is CYA language, or unenforcible. It's fairly impossible for ff.net to in their ToS legally keep you from grabbing basic information about the stories. Basically, anything that you get in the list view or from the feed is completely fine to crawl and store. They can't do shit about that.

3. With proper coding, you can actually pull the story information from ANY page the story appears on, because the data is stored in a Javascript array, which is comma separated. It's basically, how would you like to get the information.

4. Depending on the number of items in an off-site database, you need to recrawl stories approximately once per month or less to keep them reasonably up to date.

 

That depends on what you want to do with the data. A month is a bit late for information on new ff.net updates.

I suggested to follow the newsfeed to be able to follow all stories by checking just one source. A crawler or newsreader would load it in a five minute cycle or so, and with that the database would really be up to date.

Of course every fic has to be crawled the moment it is submitted to the library - but then you don't need to touch the fics themselves any more - except perhaps to crosscheck the database once in a while - perhaps twice a year.

 

I meant that you re-crawl the stuff you've already gotten, to update and such.

Few fics update more than once a month. Particularly fics that DLP would be interested in.

 

Yeah, I got that, but still - it means that DLP wouldn't be up to date with fic updates but be noticed of updates up to a month late. And then the feature is mostly useless.

 

The rating system is fine, but if you're going to change it I think making it into a progress report card would be cool.

In every WBA/For Review thread there would be a Rate Story button that allows you to rate various aspects of the story like grammar, originality, plot, execution, characterization, etc in the same 1-5 system. And on the thread topic there can be a little icon that you can click on that'll bring up the report card in a bubble pop up so you can be like "Everyone looks good, but the grammar sucks." You'll know what you're walking into

How about more emphasis on non Harry Potter things? Put a Fantasy and SciFi section on the front page? Cause the Dresden Files and Other Fandoms section sort of look like add ons. If you create a Fantasy section you can have fics and general discussion posted there for other fandom's like the main page is for Harry Potter.

 

If you could make the project DLP format the default that would be great. Or even make a brand new one but I always rush to hide the "dark lord potter" banner when I log on with a new computer it would be great to not have to do so.

 

You can set your default theme here: http://forums.darklordpotter.net/profile.php?do=editoptions

Very last option.

 

Woah that was awkward, but thanks for telling me. I would never have thought to look there.

 

I can really only think of one suggestion right now: bring back the introduction forum. I thought it was a decent way for newbies to get their feet wet, as it were, and from time to time it would produce comedy gold. Yeah, the flaming of newbs got harsh at times, but I still think it worth it.

 

I also miss the Introductions, but mostly because they were fun for older members to produce a bit of comedy - and not necessarily the welcoming format they were intended to be. I still think that primary purpose should be encouraged, which is why I had suggested a link in newbie signatures to encourage the rest of us to welcome them.

Which brings me to this post, which I forgot to respond to:

I'm not encouraging laziness. I'm encouraging a new platform for welcoming new members. It's not about three clicks being painfully difficult, but the fact that no one would do so otherwise. With the closing of Intro threads, I'll bet a bank that every member of DLP was like "Oh well, that's it, no more welcome messages for/flaming of newbs." Anyone who tells me they thought about going out of their way to welcome new members via profile posts or PMs before I suggested it is absolutely full of shit.

That little reminder in a newb's sig will result in the following:
- Nothing: which is good, since the vast majority of people posting in intro threads were just bandwagoning the lulz
- People who want to welcome new members getting a quick reminder to do so: a.k.a. what the "lazy" Donation banner does quite effectively.

 

Actually, after forgetting what account I'd used the first time I signed up on DLP, I made a new account 6 months later and I got a message that day from Perspicacity which blew my fanboy mind. He even went out of his way to remind me not to be a dumbass when I made a typically retarded first few posts and welcomed me to the site.

 

I fail to see why this is a problem.

I read this and I know there are words here, but this is all I can think.

"I did PM welcomes before the Introduction forum was closed."
​

I've had more than a few people welcome me on a few trolling accounts...

Either way, I am against using the Visitors Messages for introductions for the same reason that the introduction is closed. Flaming, baiting, general fuckery, etc.

Its also got the huge disadvantage of not displaying new responses in the new post list, making it a lot harder to police. I sincerely doubt anyone one the staff wants to spend an hour going through every new members profiles.

Reputation's made it clear that while it might go well for the first month, month and a half if you want to be generous, it's just gonna go back to the way it was.

From where I sit, the only viable method for doing intros, welcomes, and etcetera; is to do it in Private Messages, where no one but the two parties can read or respond. You might get the same asshole behavior with some people, but taking out the ability to show off (or worse/etc.) should mellow out a lot of the responses.

And for the cases that don't get filtered out and its just private trolling, cut it off at the pass and set up a PM upon register that gives out the same generic welcome with the addition of Welcomes from members likely happening in PM and offensive messages should be forwarded to one of the staff members.

And if the majority of the members don't want to do it, then who the hell cares. Their choice. I really don't care about their personal opinions, so unless I run across them in some other thread, I don't have any inclination to get to know the newbs.

 

One idea is when new people register they get a welcoming message. For me it was something about the forum was very nuanced and to post carefully. (Or something like that.) In addition to that PM, there could be links to various stickies throughout the board. One example would be how to post in For Review, which would eliminate the need for the post limit on For Review. Also could explain what WBA is for and the Library.

Also, not sure what the current message is.

 

:facepalm

:facepalm

It's not about anyone else being able to see posts to a newb's wall; it's about the newb being able to see (and control) what kind of messages they recieve during their welcome period. That said, some pretty good conversations were generated from other members being able to chime in while reading the Intro threads, which PMs wouldn't facilitate.

Raven and others higher-ups said, as part of the reason for shutting down the Intros, was that the rise in flame-baiting didn't make new members feel welcome (amongst other things). Taking steps to make people feel welcome can involve proactive steps instead of retroactive, i.e. encouraing people to do something, as opposed to cutting certain actions out.

You can't in the same breath say that you loath laziness, yet balk at the idea of taking the time to do something relatively small to welcome new members. Nor do I see how a simple link (that you'll have no part in setting up; that you're not being forced to use; that you won't have to police due to the newb's built-in control over their profile wall posts) is that troublesome.

Anyways.

@TheSoundofSilence: that's awesome, if atypical. I think it'd be cool if there was a little something extra (besides postcount), that prompted older members to reach out to newbs. A PM can facilitate that purpose, sure, but the wall's right there as well, allowing for other members to join in a potentially nice discussion. Yeah some people might flame/troll, but those are the same people that supposedly cbf'd to take that kind of effort.

@iLost: the current message is pretty basic from what I remember. Other forums also typically include the most helpful stickies - that'd be a good idea.

 

More on this below.

I quote: "Anyone who tells me they thought about going out of their way to welcome new members via profile posts or PMs before I suggested it is absolutely full of shit."

I see only two reasons for this phasing: 1) You are an internet hipster. 2) You're just an arrogant douchebag. I gave you the benefit of choosing the former. Don't :facepalm at me because you chose to say that in a shitty manner that's not even relatively true.

"And honestly, how many people considered this an option before I posted?"

Simple. You deserved it.

Valid. Sensible even. However;

1: DLP is likely one of the corners of the internet to be prone to bandwagon and hive mentality than normal.

2: Look at IRC for the example here. Huge swaths of time where it can be utterly, utterly dead save for three or four people. DLP has membership all over the world.

Taking this into account, you can interpret this suggest in two ways. First, newbs should assume an around the clock, militant watch of their profiles to squash out the slightest hit of disagreement or disdain for them and their ideals. Second, that because they could do this, that the masses will somehow find themselves at a sudden epiphany in their antisocialism (or anti-externalism, or whatever you want to call [their/our] collected issues) and views of the world.

I don't see it as valid.

Moving away from why DLP makes it a bad idea, lets look at it from the point that the new member themselves can make it a bad idea.

1: How many people do you think are on the internet who have not seen the 'How to Troll Facebook' image? I really doubt many of the sort who would join DLP haven't. Its not a big issue, but its there.

2: Censorship. My very obviously exaggerated example in point two of the above on the militant guard of their profiles.

DLP has always been, and will always be, anti-censor, within reason. You are free to hate who you like, and say what you want so long as you aren't making sincere threats or racist agenda pushing. No hardcore porn either. We've sort of bent on the soft nudity stuff in that one thread, but beyond that, no dice.

I'm fairly certain 99% of DLP will heavily disapprove of giving anyone this ability just because they can't take a bit of criticism and DLP is full of nasty ole' meanyheads.

Don't remember if you were a member at the time, but a while back there was a massive shitstorm over Master Slytherin editing one of Bio's posts purely for the idea of censorship. MS found that did not end well for people's respect of him.

So I maintain DLP keep its current policy: So long as you are within reason of common sense, you need not fear censorship, be it because the masses disagree or even the staff. If you're an idiot, you'll be called on it.

Another valid point. But again:

What is different from our former policy and this change you're for, that's going to inspire the current member base to (using my exaggerated example again) 'have an epiphany regarding their antisocial/antiexternal/etc) views' thats going to stop flaming and arguing in this format?

Because the newbs can delete it on their own now? So what. I can delete it too. So can Raven, Middy, Syaoran, Nonjon and Sree (or at least Im fairly certain they can...) Can even pass out bans. That didn't stop it before. Why would it now?

Its still public. And unless that person is sitting there for hours at a time just watching their profile, someone is going to see it. It will eventually get exaggerated, as always.

The only thing your adding is the ability to remove offending posts on their own. And I am completely willing to miss a few good conversations in public if it means I can take the spotlight off of some of the heavier trolls.

Like I said before, Private welcomes are just as likely as this to turn to shit and no system is going to be perfect, regardless of what we do. But the benefit of doing it that way is that its private. There isn't any reason to be over the top with massively exaggerated insults to show everyone how witty you are, or aren't if that's the case.

I mean, Jesus, Mknote was even doing it. And he's fully admitting its only to try to fit in. Getting rid of public introductions all together gets rid of that need to showboat or fit in. And yes, you miss some awesome ideas or stories or conversations. But so what? To quote an overly quoted bit of utter nonsense: Sacrifices must be made for the greater good of those around us.

For this, we are in complete agreement. Something should be done. I simply disagree with your methods. Pro-Private vs Pr-Public.

I'd say the way to address it would be:

One: either change the current Welcome PM to include links to some of the more important threads (Rules, contests, general tips for survival, etc...) and the proactive warning that DLP is a collected mass of the worst sort of elitist scum on the net and if someone says something out of bounds, forward the message to the staff for review and action.

Or two: something along the lines of the neglected stories notification with the same info.

I have never, nor will I, balk at the idea of doing anything for anyone who asks me. But I will tell you the same thing I told the dude in my training class when I told him his "suggestion" paper for talking to customers was shit: Unless you sincerely want to say something, its kind of obvious its forced and sterile/generic.

I browsed over the intro section when it was active. Even posted a bit. But it was rarely just because they joined. I don't see that changing soon. I simply don't care enough about them to waste the effort. I don't know, I don't give a fuck what books you read, where you work, and I honestly don't give a shit if you fuck [insertrandomanimal] on the weekends. And unless you've got a damn reason I should, I don't want to.

If you want to, its not my business unless you're starting shit with someone. Have fun, be merry. Same thing for anyone else. No harm, no foul.

So don't mistake my apathy for new members as laziness.

Because we already have it. It makes as much sense to me to make a new link for it as it is for your mother to bring you a bowl of cereal, spoon included, then for you to get up and get a second spoon before you start eating.

Obviously, I'm gonna have to put a disclaimer here to say that i don't mean that example literally. Someone will take it that way otherwise. But in a nut shell, that's my reasoning.

Edit:

For the sake of future reference, the current welcome PM:

[Sitename] was a different item. Not sure if it works in posts though so best to edit it out.

 

... Hello there.

 

Someone should perform some kind of study into the pattern of post length growth in internet debates.

 

Hitler.

Just to get that out of the way.

That welcome message ought to be updated anyway. There's no Introduction forum anymore

 

We should have a competition for who can write the best welcome message.