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Doctor Who

Discussion in 'Movies, Music and TV shows' started by Heleor, Apr 12, 2009.

  1. Padishah Emperor

    Padishah Emperor First Year

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    Aside from the fact the lore change means Eleven needing a new set of regenerations from the Time Lords now makes no sense, demystifying the Doctor and the Time Lords is an awful idea, because certain mysteries about them being unanswered keeps the show going. And these mysteries have now either been answered or have been made redundant. Nobody's going to care what the Doctor's name is now, because the name they thought they had wasn't their actual name after all. Why exactly did the Doctor leave Gallifrey with Susan? Who cares, because the Doctor has left Gallifrey countless times pre-Hartnell. And surely the Doctor being great because (s)he was a bog standard Time Lord who wanted to explore the universe and recognised it needed a hero, is a much more interesting take on the character than them being a genetically pre-disposed, chosen one figure?
    I'll probably be lured back in come Xmas with promises of the Daleks and Captain Jack, but I can't say have much inclination to watch anymore Who with Chibnall as showrunner.
     
    Last edited: Mar 7, 2020
  2. Shinysavage

    Shinysavage Madman With A Box ~ Prestige ~

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    To be fair, there are ways to explain the new cycle for Smith to Capaldi: maybe the Time Lords don't know about the whole Timeless Child thing, it was hidden very deep in the Matrix after all. Or, they do know, but wanted to keep the secret so went through with the pretense knowing that it wouldn't make any difference.
     
  3. Padishah Emperor

    Padishah Emperor First Year

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    The Doctor was destined to die on Trenzalore, though, which implies Smith was supposed to be the Doctor's last incarnation. Though I suppose it's possible his Doctor was supposed to be killed in such a way that regeneration wouldn't have been possible.
     
  4. Shinysavage

    Shinysavage Madman With A Box ~ Prestige ~

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    The Doctor was also destined to die at that lake with the astronaut, so...but yeah. There's always wiggle room in these things, just whether the subsequent explanation is good or not.
     
  5. Gaius

    Gaius Fifth Year

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    i just caught up on all the episodes and think overall i've liked this season better than last. i think the Timeless Child thing was an interesting twist, so it was nice the finale had some oomph in comparison to last season.

    yes, i was wondering when or if we'd get something for 13 like we do for 11 like "the Doctor lies." up until this speech, she doesn't seem very dark or conflicted, but her angry claim that the team structure isn't always so flat was great.

    yes, now you mention it, it's a bit classist that the concern is about saving important people and the French maid dies alone and unmentioned despite her heroism. although i like Shelley's poetry so i'm glad the Doctor saved him ;)

    i kind of liked the fact that Graham saw ghosts that weren't explainable, although it's kind of an easy ending to make it sort of spooky at the end. it gave the episode another thriller motif akin to Henry James' Turning of the Screw, so it wasn't all Frankenstein comparisons. although Mary Shelley recognizing the Cyberman as a "modern Prometheus" (the subtitle of Frankenstein) was cool.

    i hadn't thought of Padishah's critique about 11 on Trenzalore, but Shinysavage I think you're right that we can read that now as either 1) the history is so buried, the Time Lords think they have to give the Doctor more regenerations, or 2) they know but they shoot out some yellow regeneration lookalike dust. i probably would prefer the former.


    after finishing the finale, i feel a little confused about the Doctor's flashbacks in the Cyberman story with the foundling. the Master makes these visions out to be a kind of code left in the Matrix to identify the Timeless Child, and i buy that bc. of the whole bullet wound thing with the foundling child, but the actor who plays "Brendan's" father is the same as the one who plays the lead Cyberman (?) or maybe they just look kind of alike. after the finale i think we're supposed to think the father = Timeless Child's mother, and the police chief = head of "the Division," but the distinction between the Matrix code and the Cyberman's backstory were a little mixed up to me. i think partially to make the twist work, but i feel a little uncertain about some of these details.

    also, why was the Doctor arrested? for what happened on Gallifrey? is that why they were looking for Ruth? or did they arrest the Doctor for what Ruth did and the Doctor isn't sure what that is?
     
  6. Shinysavage

    Shinysavage Madman With A Box ~ Prestige ~

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    They probably arrested her partly because of whatever Ruth did, and partly because she's arguably, technically, the person who broke off their leaders horn.
     
  7. Hymnsicality

    Hymnsicality Seventh Year

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    I disliked the ending immensely. Whereas 10 ended up sacrificing himself (or attempting to sacrifice himself) multiple times for the every man (the Sontaran Strategem, The end of Time) etc, 13 just runs away like a coward and allows the old dude to die in her stead. Chibs baby what is you doing?

    The Cyberlords were pretty fun though, but had about 2 seconds of screen time. The Master had the manic energy I like him for but occasionally clunky dialogue. The doctor getting really angry for a moment was neat.

    A very entertainingly meh episode.
     
  8. Shinysavage

    Shinysavage Madman With A Box ~ Prestige ~

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    New Year special didn't feel particularly special. Not bad, per se, but could have happened at pretty much any point in the series to be honest.

    While I'm sure some people will be devastated by Ryan and Graham's exit...eh. I didn't dislike them, in fact I liked Graham rather more than I expected to, but neither of them would trouble a list of best companions. Not that Yaz would either, but still. On which note, John Bishop as a new companion is not something I'd ever have expected. I had no idea he had any acting credits to his name, but looks like he's been in a couple of well regarded things, although how good he was in them I don't know.
    Other than that, main thing for me was the shady businessman getting away with everything scot-free. It comes across like the Doctor listens to him lie about acting as a decoy and just accepted it, which presumably isn't the intention.
     
  9. Sorrows

    Sorrows Queen of the Flamingos Moderator

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    I'm a little bit sad that I didn't even think to watch it this year. Or the last season for that matter. It's been a 15 year tradition.
     
  10. Jon

    Jon The Demon Mayor Admin DLP Supporter

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    same..
     
  11. Heleor

    Heleor EsperJones DLP Supporter

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    I caught it after the fact. Entirely forgettable but inoffensive.

    Jack was used fine, and I loved the Rose call out.

    I liked Ryan by the end and his conversation with the Doctor was actually pretty well written. Graham was my favorite companion though. Don't care for Yas at all.
     
  12. KHAAAAAAAN!!

    KHAAAAAAAN!! Troll in the Dungeon –§ Prestigious §– DLP Supporter

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    I gotta say, I was hoping Yaz would peace out as well and they would start S13 fresh with new companions. She is the least interesting of all the NuWho companions to date.
     
  13. Padishah Emperor

    Padishah Emperor First Year

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    Watched it yesterday. It was a watchable, inoffensive story and is certainly better than some festive specials ('Voyage of the Damned' and 'Doctor, Witch, Wardrobe' anyone?), but which no fan will even remember was on the telly in a month's time.
    *Enjoyed seeing Jack back, but aside from him rescuing the Doctor at the beginning, his inclusion didn't really add much to the plot.
    *Did the Doctor really not make any attempt at all to escape the Judoon prison, despite being there decades? Too depressed from the Timeless Children revelations?
    *On the one hand, using the spare TARDIS to entrap the Daleks was actually a nice way of Chibnall tying up that loose end. On the other hand, the Doctor basically murdered a sentient being in doing so.
    3/5
     
  14. Shinysavage

    Shinysavage Madman With A Box ~ Prestige ~

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  15. Republic

    Republic The Snow Queen –§ Prestigious §– DLP Supporter

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    Good riddance.
     
  16. KHAAAAAAAN!!

    KHAAAAAAAN!! Troll in the Dungeon –§ Prestigious §– DLP Supporter

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    On one hand, I feel bad for Jodie. She's a great actress and an enjoyable Doctor, but she got two solid seasons of absolute crap writing, where not even the best episodes are as memorable or poignant as the worst episodes of literally any other NuWho run. And now she's peacing out.

    On the other hand, I'm relieved Chibnall is also leaving. Episodic sci-fi with an overall master plot is just... really not his strength. It showed somewhat in Torchwood, and it really showed here. His love of Classic Who format and his desire to see his Classic Who childhood fanfiction Timeless Child story realized, also did him no favors.

    I'm hoping the new season, which is due to be one long serialized story, will be better, as both showrunner and star seem more comfortable with serialized drama, but I'm not expecting much.

    Anyway, the slate needed to be wiped clean and seems BBC is on board with that. So yeah, good news all around.
     
  17. Argosh

    Argosh Groundskeeper

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    Do you really think this season-long story will be interesting enough in the first episode to make people come back for every episode?
    Just cancel it already.
     
  18. KHAAAAAAAN!!

    KHAAAAAAAN!! Troll in the Dungeon –§ Prestigious §– DLP Supporter

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    Yeah... NuWho won't be canceled anytime soon. Even with the dwindling ratings since the Matt Smith era, it's still one of the BBC's biggest earners both in advertising revenue and merchandising.

    Unless you're talking about just canceling Jodie/Chibnall's final season and going right to a new Doctor, and to that I say "How would that satisfyingly work?"
     
  19. Republic

    Republic The Snow Queen –§ Prestigious §– DLP Supporter

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    People could (and often do) ask the same question about another seson with that duo.

    There's an argument to be made for some hand-waving to avoid a dung heap. It's not gonna happen, but theoretically might have been better.
     
  20. Meerkats

    Meerkats Unspeakable

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    My vote is for a gas leak year handwave. Ooh the doctor got really high on space shrooms and had a really long nightmare.
     
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