Except you don't seem to notice that all the ADCs have ridiculous self-peeling now. Vayne Q/E/R. Draven W/E. Ezreal, Q with Iceborn + E.

The ADCs being most often used are either going to be massive bitches to catch or just have so much steroids and range that by the time a mage can actually close the gap, they'll be dead before half their rotation is complete.

Diana? Ahri? TF? All the ones you've listed rely on landing their most critical skill shots. If they fuck up once, they're dead in the water to ADCs.

The AP needs to make only one mistake to be useless. ADCs need to avoid only one failing and they become gods.

 

To be fair, aside from TF's card-stun auto, all of those 'AP skill shots' are at longer range than the ADC's autos. With decent positioning, the AP's wouldn't suffer overmuch from a missed shot. Calling them 'useless' if they miss their cc-spell is a bit over the top. If they are in range of the AD's autos when that happens, that's another story entirely, though, I will admit.

 

And you guys are missing the point entirely regardless. Even you go out and say it, people have to play "Protect the ADC". From who? Midlaners and bruisers. And do ADC always get protected? No. Do they sometimes successfully peel away and carry the game? Yes.

They are just two different roles, both important to the game. Saying one is favored over the other is stupid. For if that is true, than we would have 5 adc in the game, every game (Best pushing power, best peeling, and best damage right?). But no, there is a need for cc, there is a place for burst damage, and thus team comp includes them.

Also, I don't know about you, but Draven has one of the worse self peeling powers of all the ADC.

 

Next thing you know people will say that Varus can succesfully disengage/escape because of his E/R.

 

You just admitted if an ADC does not die they carry the game, which was my point (nevermind that I was done with the issue). There is no protect the AP carry, and all bruiser teams don't work. The key bit here is: "by the late game, the ADC is the most important role on the team because of their ability to put out high amounts of sustained damage with no CD."

Are you trying to say that an AOE slow and root (stun?) that spreads to more people is not a disengage? That's got to be the dumbest thing i've ever heard.

"Hey this guy is walking towards me" AOE slow, Root/stun->walk away "phew that was close."

 

Well, let's see. You can add Tryndamere and Master Yi to the list, but they're just ADCs with melee range.

Jax is hybrid and he's absolutely terrifying at full build - or at least he was when I last saw him. I guess Season 3 wasn't kind to him.

Cassiopeia, Karthus and Ryze are the closest that League has to AP hypercarries. They all have a spammable, low cooldown spell and great scaling. Of those three, Karthus is the only one you see because he's reliable (and because Requiem is OP). Cassiopeia does carry levels of damage, but is tremendously fragile and needs the team to protect her like they would an ADC. Of course nobody is actually able to do that because they're hard wired to follow 'the meta'. Ryze still scales super hard, but playing him in lane after his range got nerfed is awful. His lack of wave clear and terrible attack animation always meant his early game sucked, but it's kind of ridiculous now. Thanks for killing off my favourite mid, Korean top laners!

 

If he does not die.
Hey if you want to believe the ADC is still the most important role in the game, go for it. Maybe it works for you, you're fine with it, whatever.
Let me just mention, once more, that ADC is my favorite role.


Varus is one of the slowest motherfuckers in the game. If you think you can escape literally anyone with any sort of movement buff/gap closer because you stunned them for 1-2 secs, then congratulations, you just Flashed.

 

Doesn't need to escape when one snare means his target's dead in 3 seconds end-game. Kind of what an ADC does with his autos.

 

You don't understand. ADC needs to be protected because they are usually the most reliable sustained damaged on the team. AP carries don't have to be protected as much because most of their burst gets sent through with their first QWE and ultimate. It's why ap "Hypercarries" might include Cass and Ryze because they have very good sustainable damage. Someone like Ziggs or Lux, for example, blows almost all their damage in 2 seconds.

Thus it makes sense for an ADC to try and survive, because the longer they survive, the more they can auto. The more they can auto, the better they can help carry. But you know, in the end, most ADC cannot 1v1 bruisers effectively (assuming they are equally farmed). It's why CC is needed, and why they are effective in teams. Also, just because games reach late game, doesn't mean Early and Mid doesn't matter. A fed AP carry will carry through mid game (and if they didn't win at that point) will only help the rest of your team get far ahead either through kills or objectives. The roles they play are different.

Also, in low elo (Bronze-Gold) games, where ADC can't position for anything, their importance drops even further.

 

So, Season 3 ends on Halloween and the rewards just got released;

Tier Rewards (Based on highest achieved Ranked Queue [solo, 3v3, or 5v5] Tier):
Achieve Bronze+ in any ranked queue: Summoner Icon
Achieve Silver+ in any ranked queue: Profile Banner Trim, Loading Screen Border, Victorious Ward Skin
Achieve Gold+ in any ranked queue: Season 3 medal for buddy and team invitations and Victorious Elise skin

So essentially you could be Diamond in 3's and Silver in solo/5's and you'd get a diamond trim - Not sure how I feel about that given the abuse/demoralisation people suffer from when seeing those borders. Victorious Elise seems rather nice though, bit of an odd champion but hey, when you have 114 to choose from, why not.

Now to sit and wait and wonder what people who attend the World Championships will get in their goody bag.

 

Yeah.. Goal's just to stay in Gold really, should be easy enough considering it's impossible to drop, though ending with a nice mmr for next season's promos would be nice.

Still wouldn't trust the lag on European servers though, ARAM was messy after they said they'd fixed it earlier with spikes here and there plus DC's on both sides, though half the time I think my DCing is just me being on wireless, so.

Edit; Worth noting if you don't own Elise and you qualify for the skin, you get Elise unlocked for free + get the skin as you normally do with things like this from Riot.

 

I'm just gonna throw in my 2 cents since I'm god's gift to Lol cause I just hit Gold 5. Honestly, I'm of the opinion that the APC has a lot more impact on the game than an ADC does.

The first part of this comes from the fact that they're played in mid, the lane that expects roams. So many games I've seen won from some scary roams by the Fizz, Kassadin, Ahri etc who snowball the other lanes.

The second is that they can spew out a massive chunk of damage in like 2 seconds, so that if they die they've already done their job, in comparison to ADC's who need to spend much more time positioning and kiting.

The third is that it seems from when the meta was established, there has been an influx of gap closing champions. When 3 members of the enemy team can just dive your ADC from half a screen away, their effect seems to be a lot diminished. You could say that they could dive your APC as well, but as stated earlier, he APC's generally only need about 2 seconds to have done their job, plus chances are they have Zhonya's to delay their death even further. An example is that their team has say, a Leona, Malphite and Irelia, a protect the ADC comp is practically impossible here, no matter how much peel you have, unless you can flat out kill the Malphite before he walks into ult range.

The last point, is armor. In LoL I've always gotten the feeling that armor has a much greater effect on the game then magic resist does. Mostly due to the fact that all magic resist does is reduce the damage of AP champs. If an Ahri was slapping away at a Darius with Spirit Visage, Locket and Maw of Malmortius, she's only doing less damage than she would if he didn't have those items. In comparison if a Graves was beating on the same Darius except he had a Randuin's omen, Frozen heart and Thornmail, his attack speed had just been gutted by 2 of those items and any damage he actually does gets turned on him. Plus, if Darius gap closed, his W slows the attack speed even further.

I'm not saying ADC's can't carry games. Its just that with the introduction of all these armor items and gap closing bruisers, its a lot harder to. And in lane, 2 man roams don't really work unless you're willing to give up both cs and your tower for MAYBE a kill.

 

Those armor items have always existed. In fact, you're seeing the versions that are about 60% weaker than their initial stat. By that logic, with ADCs being weak now, then they were super weak from the start based on items.

Gap closing bruisers still get fucked by ADCs with self-peels. You're not catching the Draven with a constant 30% move speed buff who can E during the gap closer to fuck it up. Nor are you catching the Ezreal spamming frostborn Qs and E with maxed CDR. Or a good vayne using QER.

As much as people say gap-closers are making ADCs worse, I say they need to look at all the CC and mobility that ADCs are getting to counter it now. The advent of furor boots makes it even more ridiculous for the long-range kite machines like Cait, Ashe, and Trist to keep away.

As for your argument on gear, you're forgetting how scaling works.

APs have 2, maybe 3 sources of scaling max. CDR, AP, and whatever bonus 3rd stat, be it mana or HP. An burster's natural counter is MR + HP because if the AP can't finish you off, then they're sitting ducks until their next CD.

ADCs and ADs in general have 4 basic ones on AD, Atk Spd, Crit, and Crit damage. If they have AD skills, then a 5th in CDR. Quadratic scaling means a single form of defense in just pure armor does jack shit. On top of that, most ADs will also now carry some form of innate sustain, whether from items, runes, masteries, or skills. Compare that to APs who have far harder time getting sustain without going into the weird Revolver build territory.

On an ADC with no steroids, they'll already chunk for 200-500, average of 350, a hit after armor on most enemies not built full tank after just an IE, PD, and Zerkers. Attack speeds at that point are usually at 1.2-1.3~, which means they'll fire 4 shots in 3 seconds.

The only ADCs without some form of steroid are Corki and Ashe, and even Corki is arguable since it's 4%-10% extra true damage bonus on his autos.

If you add in steroids or just on-hit skills, it gets really stupid. Draven basically has an automatic crit every Q at rank 5 along with crazy W steroid. Vayne has Q reset and AD steroid. Ez has Q reset and passive. Trist Q, twitch QR, etc... That 1400 avg over 4s can compound easily with steroids into 2k+ in 4 seconds. All while healing the ADC. And it never ends.

As for Darius, guess how many ADCs punch his face in before he can get close enough? All but Graves since Graves has shitty range + shitty kiting.


As for that about an AP already doing his shit in 2s. True. That also means the AP is now pretty much ignorable and no longer a priority until his CDs are up. Guess who has to finish clearing the hell out of everything? The ADCs on each team. Because a mage fundamentally can not carry unless they're Ryze/Cassi/Karth because they don't have the sustained damage to actually finish survivors. Carry the team? Possible. Carrying the fight? Not so much.


EDIT: About your armor thing, you do know this is the weakest armor has ever been, right? ADCs can pretty much laugh at all armor this entire season. APs have been the ones that've been fucked completely by item revamps, causing people to change over from burst mages to AP bruisers.

 

Fuck Elise. I hate that bitch so much I don't even want her in my champion pool but she's going to be stuck into it without my consent. I'd rather have Victorious Mordekaiser (hue hue hue) or Zac or something. I hate spider-bitch with an unrivaled passion, which is funny because every champ I play can just crush the bitch without even trying.

 

Holy shit, WTF is with that GUI?

 

Just thinking the exact same

 

It looks like ass.