Ways in which Harry could try getting around the line using magic:

1. Move the Goblet out.

2. Use the imperius on someone over 17 to enter Harry's name.

3. Confound someone over 17 to think they're entering their own name, but they're actually entering Harry's.

4. Use some kind of controlled magical creature/construct to get his name over the line.

5. Somehow teleport his name in without it physically passing over the line.

6. Possibly dig underneath the line. Depends on how the line works.

7. Conjure a piece of paper with his name on on the other side of the line.

8. Levitate it over.

9. Perform a switching spell on his arm with the arm of a 17 year old and use their arm to drop the name in over the line.

10. Animagus.

 

This. I like this. I hadn't even considered this option before, but now it seems the best one by far. The basic idea is brilliant in its simplicity, but it will still require quite a bit of magical skill to pull off and doesn't depend on some lame loophole or technicality.

 

Not my idea. Pers suggested it above.

In which case, when it came to evaluate Viktor's problems with magic, it would find that he asked Harry for help.

The Goblet will have a hard time finding someone who has never asked someone for help. If that is truly a requirement, I think Kira has a better chance of being champion than Krum.

 

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About the chapter it was little average for Santi work, but it's understandable that faster updates = worse quality. I liked the scene with boat/ship. What I didn't like particular was Krum and his flu ...

 

11. Confound every Durmstrang member to not enter their name but only Harry's so there's no choice.

 

I think he'll alter the wards in the age line.

 

That isn't necessarily how it might work, given the bulger idea that you quoted.

It could be argued that being willing to accept help from a younger wizard, and then following through and making the most of said help, is a type of courage and good judgment.

On the other hand, having Krum put Harry's name in the goblet requires no courage, no magical prowess, and no daring.

And although it may seem unfair to penalize Harry for taking the easy way out of a challenge that none of the other entrants had to face, it works out nicely, symbolically. That is, if you're underage and still believe yourself capable of facing an adult wizard's challenges, the Goblet might want you to prove it.

 

Isn't the whole age thing a rather new rule, time-wise?

I assume the Goblet chooses those it deems worthy irregardless of age, and the ward is just Dumbledore's concoction.

 

This seems rather circular - what's the point of having an age line if the Goblet chooses candidates with the greatest mastery of magic? If Hogwarts' younger students are so far behind Durmstrang's, the Goblet will choose an older student based on their greater skill. Seems a little fishy to me.

An idea just came to me, though: we don't know how the age line works - maybe if Harry thought of himself as being older than 17, he'd be able to pass the line. Or, if the ward was developed to keep children out of places they shouldn't be, maybe the ward judges whether you are mature enough to pass.

 

That's a pretty likely possibility. Really, it depends on how flexible the Goblet's magic is - how much it actually "knows" about the current situation.

But if it doesn't care about the age line, I'm thinking that from its perspective, it will be comparing Harry, who had someone else put his name in the Goblet, to a bunch of other candidates who didn't. Which gets back to the whole courage thing. It once again sounds unfair to Harry, but it still works out from the symbolic point of view.

 

It's been stated that a person can use Occlumency to beat Veritaserum, it is entirely possible there are other similar applications. Harry could trick the line using Occumency.

Maybe.

 

I really didnt like the Dumbledore/Harry conversation either or the whole obsession with the age line. Unless the Santi has something important to Harrys future development planned , it all seems a long , unecassery plot point that doesnt add anything to the story......other than breeding endless discussion on this thread.

 

First: a nice surprise Santi, and Happy Birthday.

I have to agree somewhat with Lord Anarchy about the Veela Allure. Why tell Krum anyways? Because of his Quidditch career he has pretty good tolerance. And is the Allure something that once you break, you're never bewitched again by the same Veela?

Also, what’s up with Dumbledore? He first tells Harry he doesn't want him to try and enter but then gives him advice (assuming its valid) on how to do it. Why didn't he just let Harry tell Krum to put his name in? That way, Harry's happy he tried and he's happy since the Goblet won't consider it 'daring' enough to consider.


I’m also wondering who’s going to be the DADA professor at Hogwarts if ‘Moody’ doesn’t show up. The whole entrance scene seemed to be a bit anticlimactic. Maybe I just expected Draco or Weasley drama. But then, this is the first part of the chapter.
I assume the tension between Kira and Krum is leading to an epic break up. I wouldn't put it past Kira to use the Dark Arts at that point, especially if Calypso is present.

Oh and what Calypso said; that no one can blab about her father... Any ideas on how he managed that? I assume it was a threat/curse on all the Durmstrang delegation...including Harry?

As for my opinion on the Goblet beating, I kind of liked Taure's Animagus idea. I think it would fit all the categories if he manages it in time. And even if the age limit works on animals, well, I'm sure his age would be counted in dog years.

 

Dumbledore says he doesn't want Harry to enter. Whether he means it is another matter. I think Dumbledore's main concern is Harry's development as a person. If Harry is to enter, Dumbledore wants him to enter in the right way. In the noble way.

I think Dumbledore sees much of himself in Harry. He doesn't want Harry to make the mistakes of his own youth, chasing glory. But because he does see himself in Harry, he recognises the need that Harry feels to do so, and respects it. He's just trying to guide Harry in a slightly different direction.

Or at least that's my reading.

 

I think this was one of the better chapters in a while, and certainly one of the most highly anticipated. So, it seems the Durmstrang students have the option of attending Hogwarts classes, as was speculated before. I do find it amusing that Harry now got what he originally wanted way back as a first year Ravenclaw: advanced classes at Hogwarts. All he needed to do was switch schools.

I've been considering Spell-Creation. Naturally, that class isn't covered in Hogwarts and it seems a particularly demanding and difficult subject. Sure, Harry can read on his own, but he isn't quite as advanced in Spell-Creation as in some of his other classes; he would surely benefit from instruction. There is a teacher at Hogwarts he can ask for help: Snape.

I believe that very early in the story, when Harry learned that Spell Creation was taught at Durmstrang, Lily mentioned that Snape used to design spells while in Hogwarts. Sirius confirmed it with the comments regarding muffliato. This, taken together with the depiction of Harry being impressed upon learning this, strikes me as something of a foreshadowing. Harry will seek out Snape for some instruction in the subject. There is certainly precedent, the Occlumency lessons, but now Harry has learned that Snape used to be a death eater -- though it didn't seem to perturb him in this chapter, when he talked with Calypso about what teachers he would ask for help if he needed to. Of course, now there's no order from Dumbledore or plea from Lily compelling Snape to help Harry; however, Harry also impressed Snape during their lessons, so it might not be that difficult. My meta-reasoning is: why reveal to Harry about Snape's inventions and having him impressed if nothing is going to come of it? Alternatively, it could set up for Harry to deduce who the half-blood prince is very quickly, should Nathan inform his brother of the reason of his unlikely success in Potions in sixth year (provided the Hogwarts part of the story mirrors canon).

Regarding this chapter, I do have a criticism.

I think we all get that Harry is exceptionally talented, but having us reminded over and over (even in narrative text!) of this is excessive. We don't need this reminder. Let Harry perform advanced magic: it will provoke comments and praise from those around him, and we will be suitably apprised of his prowess. Having the narrative text serve this purpose is clumsy, I think, and an instance of telling, not showing.

Should your purpose be to give us a glimpse into Harry mind, my comment would be "does he seriously think like that?" I would agree it fits nicely with his developing superiority complex and is consistent with his behaviour in Dumbledore's office, but it is still silly and hamfisted, in my opinion.

That quibble aside, I really liked the chapter. It was fun how you sidestepped the obvious solution to the GoF and hinted at something more impressive; this will surely occupy the attentions of this thread for many weeks to come. I appreciated Dumbledore's conversation with Harry. While it would certainly spare him a headache if Harry didn't beat the ageline and had to sit at the sidelines for the tournament, he recognises that this is something that Harry must do. Dumbledore could've remained silent, and if his theories regarding the operation of the Goblet are true Harry wouldn't have been selected, but he didn't. This is fascinating.

Do be so kind and keep up the good work.

 

Hey guys,
New to this thread and all, but has anyone thrown out the possibility of the animagus transformation? This age line was developed to keep children out of places they weren't supposed to go. I can envision pets and familiars easily walking past the line as they were "beneath" its notice. Perhaps harry will break his promise to Sirius and attempt the transformation early to force his way through?

---------- Post automerged at 12:10 PM ---------- Previous post was at 12:05 PM ----------

Having payed more attention to the thread above me, it has been forwarded as an idea. Either way, I think its a clever route.

 

I'm surprised the Durmstrang ship is in such a deplorable condition, considering Karkaroff's pride in his school, unless it is as samkar suggested and it's merely Karkaroff keeping the students on their toes. Would explain the enormous difference in the quality of enchantments between his private quarters and the rest of the ship.

Karkaroff's blatant coddling of Krum was a bit weird, it's just a cold after all, the way he went on you'd suspect Krum got the magical equivalent of pneumonia.

Shouldn't Calypso have a similar experience with age lines to what Harry had? I'm sure there were places in their home Romulus didn't want Calypso snooping around in. Perhaps changing her question of what an age line is to saying that she's heard of it before but asking Harry to elaborate. Even if Romulus for some reason never used wards to restrict Calypso as she grew up she should be familiar enough with them now after a month of watching Harry play around with them to at least recognize one when it's being cast, hell, Dumbledore's explanation alone should be enough for her to deduce it's a defensive ward of some kind. Calypso's question is one I would expect from either an idiot who didn't pay attention when growing up in a magical home (Ron) or someone curious who does not have the experience of growing up in a magical home (Hermione).

I'm glad Dumbledore talked Harry out of going for the easy solution, no matter if it'd have worked or not, Harry beating the ward by utilizing his discovery in transfiguration like Pers suggested would be far more awesome than simply asking Viktor to throw his name in.

Santi lies like a boss, no updates until Halloween at the earliest and then BAM! Three updates in little more than a month. Dude's gonna be an excellent lawyer.

@Inert
It's not out of the left field, it's been building up for atleast a year, probably since Viktor and Kira started practising the animagus transformation with Harry and Calypso. Every now and then Kira makes some snide, undeserved remark about Harry and Viktor always chastizes her for it, it's been steadily getting worse with her detecting Harry's attempt at legilimency on her and promptly losing her shit and finally culminated with her fight with Calypso at the world cup where she embarassed not only herself but Viktor too in front of his parents. These are only the "on-camera" moments we as readers have been privy too, there's probably many more incidents where Kira's raging jealousy and not so thinly veiled bigotry reared it's ugly head.

It's taken some time but Viktor is about to learn that bros definitely goes before crazy hoes. My question is if Calypso has since long realized this and is one of the reasons why she's been subtly needling and outright taunting Kira, in an attempt to have her go full-on crazy bitch and have Krum break up with her.

 

Seeing as they need to use a ward to create an age limit instead of modifying the cup directly, I'd say not very flexible.