And if he were town he would've spent more time on the game (or at least posted more). Besides the fact that he could've also just wanted scum to win once his death was inevitable (or specifically wanted me to lose, considering he was unsuccessful in surviving via getting me lynched as it went).

The second Jarizok claimed, he pushed him super hard with setup-gaming, even though I remember someone posted a specific example of a game where there WAS a bulletproof + doctor (Bill Door?).

And I quote "I know setups." as his justification. That was panicking at the idea he couldn't kill the guy

 

I'd believe this a little more if Proph had actually been killing anyone during the night phases. But he wasn't, which suggests to me that he was just trying to hide as a town for as long as possible.

Like, I don't see the self-preservation. I genuinely think that he pushed you because you're scum. We haven't really gone back to it since D3, but the votal analysis of Jarizok makes you look very bad. Only reason I'm not voting you is because now I'm more sure of mal considering his claims and inconsistency.

 

The second Proph kills someone at Night, everyone's on the lookout for a killing role other than the mafia kill (unless a kill disappears which is unpredictable). The absolute best play as SK this game was to not kill til a kill endgames him (which is definitely a thing in serial killer closed setups), because noone even considered a neutral this game. He also got forced into claiming D1 and claimed Vanilla. If he killed, the second people start asking for a vigilante claim they'll know a SK might be floating around because the only other alternatives are 2-kill mafia (no way 13p) or vigilante (nope, noone claims the extra kill and he can't because he claimed vanilla D1 and offered himself as a consolation lynch to boot)

You mean the end of day last-second lynch? What are your thoughts on Kai's vote there then?

 

Scumread him for it initially. But, like, he's done nothing since then except advocate for a Proph lynch, which isn't inherently scummy. Honestly, will have to do a full reread to be sure about his alignment either way. The question for me right now is which world makes the most sense.

I'm at:
Citrus/mal
Citrus/Kai
mal/Kai
Citrus/mal is my current scumteam right now.
Out of the other two mal/Kai makes more sense because Kai and fluff pushed Citrus early before the Jarizok flip and we got the votal analysis for it (I think, please correct me if I'm wrong) so the likelihood of Citrus/Kai is lower than mal/Kai.

Fair enough on Proph, I'll have to think about that one some more.

 

You say all this but you haven't voted for him yet. Why is that? Isn't he already distance voting you?

 

Votecount 5.01

mallorean_thug (3): owner, miner11121, KaiDASH
Citrus (1): mallorean_thug

Abstaining (2): Citrus, Bill Door

With 6 alive, it's 4 to Soft Lynch and 5 to Hard Lynch!

Day 5 will end Thursday, December 1st at 2100 EST or immediately following a Hard Lynch. A timer is available here.

Previous Votals: 1.01 | 1.02 | 1.03 | 1.04 | 1.05 | 1.06 | 1.07 | 1.08 [Final] ||| 2.01 | 2.02 | 2.03 | 2.04 | 2.05 | 2.06 | 2.07 | 2.08 [Final] ||| 3.01 ||| 4.01 | 4.02 | 4.03 | 4.04 | 4.05 | 4.06 [Final] |||

 

Because putting mal onto 1 away from hard lynch in lylo is an unnecessary risk yet.

 

Oh right, Bill and Citrus can't be the team.

Uhh... more rereading is necessary.

 

Something something garcia, but yeah this.

Besides that, ending discussion early is almost never a +EV thing for town. Someone's going to get killed toNight, so ending Day early is effectively helping the scum silence that person

 

Wouldn't it be mylo not lylo though?

 

Yeah but the same principle applies.

 

You have 24 hours to lynch someone. Or not. Up to you.

Votes haven't changed.

 

your daily dose

 

Hi, I was going to post last night but then the electrical pole across the street caught on fire and I had no power all night. Going to post shortly.

---------- Post automerged at 11:31 ---------- Previous post was at 11:17 ----------

Citrus has still completely deflected from naming a teammate for me, or from considering the world where both him and I are town.

The only thing he has to offer is that my claim was bad and that it was obvious that Proph was neutral and not scum. Please note that if it was obvious that Proph was neutral, the scumteam would want to kill him and that the scum team should have suspected that there was a third party since the beginning of the game because of jarizok's role.

While if a town player thought Proph was neutral, they should have accused Proph of that, tried to get a confession, and tried to lynch actual scum first, becuase a wagon on actual scum is way more useful.

At this point, I think I'm back to Kai as his partner, despite the claim weirdness with Jarizok? It mechanically can't be Bill Door. Miner's done some scummy stuff, but his pressure on Jarizok in my reread doesn't read like distancing? Does anybody disagree with this? And there's a decent amount of interaction.

Meanwhile, Kai's only redeeming point is setup gaming about what collective claims the scumteam might have. Which I'm even more inclined to dismiss after Proph's flip. I already explained why Kai's vote was in a spot where he needed to buss anyways, and some additional flavor drama would have been an easy way to establish cred, despite his late arrival on the wagon.

So that's where I am. Completely wrong about my early meta reads on both of them, but this is where we're left.

The worst part is that the next most likely team is miner/Bill Door, which has no overlap, so we can't pursue both. But we lose in that world basically no matter what so I'm going to disregard it unless Citrus or Kai become particularly towny in the next 9 hours.

---------- Post automerged at 11:36 ---------- Previous post was at 11:31 ----------
owner, please think about what I said about the scumteam and needing to name a team right now. Again, naming two town as your theoretical scumteam is very very hard to do because you risk both fighting back against you. It would be even harder for both members of the scum team to avoid naming each other.

Far easier to name both your designated mislynch AND your partner, and then avoid pushing on your partner. Say that we can lynch your partner "tomorrow" because scum love making future promises at LYLO if that will ensure tomorrow never comes.

Or even easier to avoid naming a second person at all. Just deflect and lurk out the day, hoping your target can't convince the more stubborn town, and wastes his time arguing with them instead of talking to you.

That's what Citrus and Kai are doing. Please see that.

 

Fuck, where'd my post go

---------- Post automerged at 11:18 AM ---------- Previous post was at 11:14 AM ----------

Try 2

Laughably and irrefutably false. I said he wasn't town, NOT that he was neutral. I literally never ever said I thought he was neutral or any time of non-town except scum.

Your assuming he was town and committing to the point of a fake-claim of cop for town-cred failed because you ignored his behavior and made an assumption off the fact that he wasn't in your scumteam.

Vote: Mallorean_Thug

That's soft-lynch. Also fyi, probably won't have internet access from like 5pmish onwards

 

Hi Citrus, if you're town, you're ignoring my behavior and making an assumption based off of my ill-advised fakeclaim.

You're not though, and you still haven't said who my partner is.

Town!Citrus would never ignore that, he'd be scumhunting for the last scum and looking at team PoE, not trying to push through a mislynch.

---------- Post automerged at 12:22 ---------- Previous post was at 12:21 ----------

Like, the fact that you haven't even tried to figure out who the last scum is when you'll be on the chopping block next just shows that you don't need to worry about "next".

Because the game will be over with my lynch.

---------- Post automerged at 12:24 ---------- Previous post was at 12:22 ----------

And yes, you didn't say Proph was neutral.

But all your points about Proph speak for themselves. You figured out days ago that Proph was neutral and wanted to lynch him for it. So when you try to show that genuine game solving intent, it leaks out that you were hunting for a neutral, not for scum.

---------- Post automerged at 13:04 ---------- Previous post was at 12:24 ----------

Oh, also if Bill Door posts without hammering me, he's lock town.

That would be very nice to confirm.

---------- Post automerged at 13:05 ---------- Previous post was at 13:04 ----------
Bill Door /tenchar

 

Yeah, I'll be around later. Been busy the last 2 days.

 

Gah, I hate forum software that doesn't autosave posts. Oh well, it will help me trim down to just the essentials:

Posts from Jarizok:

Spoiler

Is this a post towards a scumbuddy?

Questions a scumread on miner, questions a townread on me.

Is miffed that I got townread so easily.

This is in response to Bill voting miner. Encouraging town aggression on a weak buddy this early seems unlikely, even if the "no content" attack is a preferred distancing move.

And even if this was a planned mutual fight between them, making miner take a side on the fluff thing doesn't seem like a buddy move, because the results are either to push fluff more towards a consensus townread, or cause a fight between them. While if miner is town, getting miner to take a stand could either tie him to fluff, making both look bad, or make him look culpable after fluff flipped town later in the game.

Continuing the above.

Is this a mention of a buddy?

I don't see this as the defense offered during a mutual distancing attempt.

Mentions Citru's lack of proactiveness, but says nothing else. Note this is right after he signed up for Citrus's game.

Very weak objection, but hard to tell if its because Citrus is his buddy, or because Citrus is town giving him a daypass.

owner's theory that he'd scumread his buddies seems obviously wrong now. Personally, I expect newb!scum to spread their team out more, so putting Citrus and Kai next to each other kind of speaks against that team . . . except that he started from the numbered playerlist in the OP.

Rule of three kind of implies miner is scum here, except that this seems to be more responding to pressure than anything else. Probably a wash?

Is this something you'd pick up from a buddy's post? (He's responding to my #301, where I'm partially asking Waco to tell me who Jarizok's possible buddies are and who he might have spewed clear)

Strong rule of 3 on Citrus here. Also note Kai's absence from this list compared to his readwall above.

Oops, we're going backwards on miner now. Tying town to the buddy you're bussing and then pushing on the town instead of your buddy is classic scum.

Ok, so much information here. And I guess I have to give props to owner on thinking that Jarizok would be pushing on his scummates and having difficulty reading town as scum.

He suggests a scumteam of owner/majube/[Delphin,Kai,miner]. Strong strong rule of 3 on either Kai or miner there. Even more so, seems pretty unlikely that /both/ Kai and miner are his buddies. Its going to be one, not both.

He attacks Kai for activity, but then gives her the softest ball of the 3. And in his indictment of miner, he cites Kai calling miner scum?

Even better, his question to citrus is basically "Hey, either owner is scum, or she's scum with you. What do you think?" Like, that's not about his interaction with owner at all, its about owner's interaction with him! And this is after opening with shade about Citrus's activity. Also note that he doesn't ask owner about Citrus at all, instead its just vague stuff about Zen's scumteam.

Is this an interaction with a buddy?

First bolded section starts with a reason to suspect Citrus but then goes to going with his conclusions immediately.

Second bolded section is another section of him talking about me that makes me roll my eyes at anybody suggesting I'm on a scumteam with him.

Third bolded section is right after specifically denying Bill/Kai as a likely scumteam, but without committing to either Bill /or/ Kai, and then some good old OMGUS shade on miner (which continues to not feel like mutual distancing to me).

Again, with a statement like that you guys think that Citrus and I are both scum together?

The Bill vs Kai paragraph immediately backpedals his earlier readwall, says he's ok with lynching either, but then immediately says we shouldn't lynch either, along with a slight defense of Kai. To me, this reads as "I'm ok with you guys running up Bill, but let's not make it Bill vs Kai, because that's a fight Kai will lose"

And his response to Owner suspecting him AND miner doesn't feel like he's worried about a mutual distancing ploy with miner going terribly wrong.

:roll eyes:

Again, is this how Jarizok would treat a buddy?

In readwall land, still no opinion on Citrus despite posting a giant wall responding to him as soon as Citrus asked him a question, I'm null with Kai, and he's tying miner's alignment to other people. Maybe I'm conf biasing here, but Jarizok/Kai/Citrus is feeling more and more like a slam dunk.

More responding to Citrus interactions, more saying that if he tried to choose between Bill and Kai it would be Bill, more grouping Citrus and Kai in the middle of his wall as null reads

Questioning Zen's townread on Citrus, but not for real reasons. Doing the whole "Well, if you guys presented a case, I'd consider it" thing that I always read as scum avoiding spew.

Ok, I had forgotten that Jarizok /asked/ for a George Weasley claim. Scumchat surely discussed claim stuff, so this isn't by accident.

His last post, knowing he was about to flip scum. The only thing he changed from his earlier wall was casting more shade on me.

 

Hi I probably won't be around until very near deadline ~8:30 ish.

With Citrus's vote Bill is now locktown, which means one of my worlds was correct.

I'm hoping that day is still ongoing when I get back.