Hey guys. So I've had an idea for a fic in my head for about a year now and I was wondering if I might receive some help in filling in some plot holes.

So the idea, which has been done before I think but not overdone, is an AU fic that explores the idea of what would have happened had Grindelwald defeated Dumbledore in their duel during World War II and the consequences for the magical and muggle world

In the muggle world it's relatively simple. I've always believed that Grindelwald was involved in some way with the Nazi's and their rise to power, so I have them winning the war in Europe. On the other side of the world, I have the United States defeating Japan and the two emerging super powers embark on a Cold War. Both would have nuclear weapons of course.

The magical world is exponentially more tricky. With Dumbledore gone, it would allow Voldemort and his followers to do as they please in England, but obviously they would be limited in their mobility as the continent would be under Nazi/Grindelwald control.

So here we come to my two biggest dilemmas

1) Under these circumstances, what would Voldemort do, or attempt to do? Would he try to kill all muggle borns? Perhaps lead an uprising to overthrow the British Empire? Or maybe he would be more subtle

2) In this kind of dystopian world, how would Harry Potter exist and if he did, what would be his purpose? How could he still be the hero? I'm trying to follow Potter Law number one haha.

Now to be clear I do have an outline of what I think would happen in my notes but they aren't without flaw. If anyone desires more details I would be happy to pm them.

This idea fully appeals to the fact that I'm a history geek haha. I major in it in college, and I love the idea that somehow the wizarding war that Grindelwald lead was somehow connected to World War II, one of my favorite historical topics. JK Rowling said herself it wasn't a coincidence Grindelwald's defeat in 1945 came at the same time as the Nazi's.

I hope this idea doesn't come off as stupid or idiotic. Would love some feedback from you guys.

 

I think you're asking the wrong questions; Voldemort was still a teenager when Grindelwald was defeated in the original time line (OTL). While his response to Grindelwald victory is important, the first thing that should be established is how Gellert influence the continent and the British Isles, both magical and muggle sides. Let's not forget that Grindelwald objective was to establish wizard as leaders over the muggles. After all, they are the enlightened one, etc.

So, does he?

Now, if he actually does, how does Tom Riddle react to that. Fundamentally, Riddle is still the same character. He has an inherent fear of death and is already on the path to creating his first horcrux when Grindelwald victory occurs. He already has followers (or close associates) to whom he has been sprouting pureblood propaganda. He craves power. He is a sociopath and a genius.

Considering that Grindelwald actually fulfilled some of Voldemort's promise to his followers (the ascension of wizardom over muggles), Riddle would have to shift his goals accordingly. I think that he would focus more on the politics side of thing with his end goal being to overtake Grindelwald position.

As for Harry, well obviously he's Voldemort downfall so Grindelwald would try to secure him as soon as possible.

 

Basilisk

You are correct in that a proper explanation needs to happen in order to explain how Grindelwald played both sides of the conflict. Fortunately I did get that far in my notes as to how he influenced the Nazi's and wizarding Germany.

The kicker is, Grindelwald did succeed. But not in the way you would expect. Essentially I have him more or less blending the SS with his own forces so that the two are barely distinguishable. So more or less he achieves power, but for himself and not in the way he promised his followers which I thought would be a good plot twist. He has ultimate say in both worlds (except the UK)

In which case what would Voldemort do in that situation? He is only a teenager at this point (1945) still in school with two Horcruxes (the diary and the ring). Dumbledore, the man who was most suspicious of him is gone, so how would he go about trying to achieve his objectives i.e. conquering death, taking over Britain and probably the rest of Europe. Would he establish himself as a rival of Grindelwald? Or perhaps even the savior of Britain being that the country would be desperate for strong leadership and would turn to his abilities in order to avoid being conquered. Would he try to eliminate muggle borns as he did in the canon series? (In which case Lily Evans and James Potter never meet so Harry doesn't exist)

I'm trying to be as consistent with the plot as possible. No holes.

 

Voldemort would act pretty canonically until around 1957 - in that he would travel, learn magic and create Horcruxes. I think he would try to get into Grindelwald's inner circle and become his proxy in Britain, but at the same time plan a coup - because he doesn't like being the second best. He might kill Grindelwald and take his place.

 

If your intent is to keep the fic Harry-centric, it would be good to consider how his grandparents would be affected by all of this.

Henry Potter was ostensibly pro-Muggle, given his Wizengamot record. It's likely, then, that his family would be in danger of persecution in the wake of a Grindelwald victory. Lily's parents would probably be condemned to a life of servitude, and Lily herself would almost certainly be taken after showing signs of magic.

Where does this leave Harry? The son of refugees-turned-resistance fighters? Pampered and blissfully unaware of the truth in this new magical utopia? Would Lily and James even cross paths under such circumstances? It's up to you, really.

 

I think a change in timeline where Dumbledore went to fight Grindelwald only in the 70's (and lost) could solve this problem. Until the 70's Britain is left untouched by Grindelwald so Lily and James still go to Hogwarts, and Voldemort begins his rise after Grindelwald defeated Dumbledore. Maybe it's his presence on Grindelwald's side that made the difference.

 

This would definitely be a solution except that the whole story predicates on the year 1945 due to the Nazis and WW2. Normally the role of muggle empires and politicians is pretty minimal, but Grindelwald is challenging the very essence of the Statute of Secrecy so they'll be featured every now and then.

But as others have pointed out there in lies the problem. The way I see it there are two scenarios: Grindelwald takes over England and Voldemort creates an opposition to take back England, but of course he only wants it for himself. Or Voldemort confronts and actually holds back Grindelwald managing to keep England free. But that's the problem. How would Voldemort's politics change due to a rival Dark Lord promising something similar?

I do have a scenario in which James and Lily can still meet and have Harry but it's a bit shaky.