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kitsune naruto

Discussion in 'Fanfic Discussion' started by readerboy7, Oct 27, 2013.

?

Change thread name to "genjutsu theory discussion" and move to discussion forum?

Poll closed Nov 4, 2013.
  1. yes

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    100.0%
  2. no

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  1. readerboy7

    readerboy7 Fourth Year

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    In early canon, Naruto is shown to have two abilities that kitsune have - namely pranking and shape shifting (specifically naked women). Are there any legible stories that have Naruto using other kitsune-themed abilities like illusions or cold fire?
    (Note: kitsune information from Wikipedia and TVtropes)
     
  2. Darth Disaster

    Darth Disaster The Waking Sith ~ Prestige ~ DLP Supporter

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    I'm actually really interested in this as well.
     
  3. Sorrows

    Sorrows Queen of the Flamingos Moderator DLP Gold Supporter

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    I think there may be a few, be warned though from what I remember a lot of them also have him growing ears and a tail a-la-inuyasha.
     
  4. nahbutualright

    nahbutualright Sixth Year

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    http://www.fanfiction.net/s/6175159/1/Naruto-the-Black-Blade

    Naruto gets some kind of Genjutsu boosting sword out of the scroll. Also gets a fox contract later.

    It was at least legible, if I remember correctly, but I can't comment on the quality since its been a couple years since I read it. I remember that I stopped reading when he got that contract though, because the foxes made me want to strangle myself. That was towards the end of whats been put up though, so you might get something out of what there is before that.
     
  5. Darth Disaster

    Darth Disaster The Waking Sith ~ Prestige ~ DLP Supporter

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    Eh, none of that bugs me. There was a time I was obsessed with catching every damn episode of Inuyasha.
     
  6. Knyght

    Knyght Alchemist

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    I take it you mean the pilot chapter?

    Spying no Jutsu has a shapeshifting, genjutsu-using Naruto though I don't think it's actually tied to the Kyuubi. Naruto Genkyouien is kitsune-centric and Naruto eventually learns to use fox fire.

    I once read and loved a fic where Naruto transformed into a gold fox, eventually changed by as a hanyou or something and grew into a nine-tailed kitsune. All I can remember is him having a drunken fist chick and coin-based magnet dude as his teammates, a mentoring Kyuubi and a Hinata pairing. Shame it sounds so terrible now.
     
  7. readerboy7

    readerboy7 Fourth Year

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    By 'early chapters' I mean anything pre chapter 193, which is as far as I've gotten so far (don't worry, I know the major spoilers already). Preferably no additional vulpine traits (except maybe in tailed beast mode. Already read spying and genkyouien. Will try out blade now.
     
  8. Knyght

    Knyght Alchemist

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    Huh. I assumed otherwise given the way you phrased.
     
  9. Idiot Rocker

    Idiot Rocker Auror

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    Huh. I've actually always wanted to read a decent Naruto story where he has that particular set of abilities. I'm not the biggest fan of the whole hanyou angle, but having the skill set interests me.

    I still reread Spying No Jutsu occasionally. It holds up really well, even if the action scenes are a bit hard to follow sometimes.
     
  10. readerboy7

    readerboy7 Fourth Year

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    Basically, what you are saying is that this seems like a nice idea (if the hanyou appearance isn't added) but hasn't been executed well.

    So… If I want this done right: I should try to do it myself; probably fail miserably or give up; then post this idea as a challenge on DLP.
    Thanks!
     
  11. mortalone

    mortalone Sixth Year

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    Naruto used genjutsu in Spying no Jutsu? It's been a long time since I read that one, but I'm pretty sure it was all Henge magic.
     
  12. Knyght

    Knyght Alchemist

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    He was revealed to have a genuine shape-shifting ability and a ridiculous talent for genjutsu. But we only really see the genjutsu parts at the beginning and end whilst most of the fic involves Naruto's transformation skills, so it doesn't stand out as much.
     
  13. Aerylife

    Aerylife Not Equal

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    Eh I feel like Blue Flames belong to the Nibi Jinchuuriki, since yah know the Nibi is made of Blue Flames >< Genjutsu Naruto has a lot of potential but, any of the characters who wield the sharingan will laugh at Naruto.
     
  14. Idiot Rocker

    Idiot Rocker Auror

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    Yeah, what LuckyLee said. I think that's problem why Naruto's gensutsu is also typically written as fox influenced. It puts him on a more level playing field with the more broken genjutsu users out there.
     
  15. Aerylife

    Aerylife Not Equal

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    I mean, Kurenai was owned by Itachi and she spent how many years studying genjutsu? Half of the big threats in Naruto have fancy eyes that love ignoring/casting illusions. Genjutsu using Naruto would have to have reality warping powers to be on level with other S Class Nins. Or another ability.
     
  16. Striker

    Striker What's up demons?

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    Well, that's the whole point of having kitsune!Genjutsu. It puts you on the same level as other shinobi with Genjutsu-oriented bloodlines. In fanon, at least.
     
  17. Aerylife

    Aerylife Not Equal

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    Arguably, but it seems convoluted.
     
  18. Darth Disaster

    Darth Disaster The Waking Sith ~ Prestige ~ DLP Supporter

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    Eh, simple fix: Genjutsu Theory ----> How Sharingan sees through it ----> How Kitsune!Genjutsu is Different ----> Thus why Sharingan doesn Fuck it over.

    For instance: Genjutsu is the art of linking your chakra to the chakra of others and manipulating the senses through it ----> Sharingan can see the Chakra links being formed, and thus allows the Sharingan user to break any Genjutsu easily/Create genjutsus easily ----> Kitsune Genjutsu create a semi/peudo-real construct from 'Youki' (read: demon energy) that will fool the senses unless 'pressured' with 'active' disbelief ----> Sharingan can't see youki, at best can only see human chakra tainted with youki (I.E. canon Naruto through Sasuke's eyes at VoTE) -----> Thus, no Sharingan Fuckery over Kitsune!Genjutsu.


    Can thus be adjusted for whatever your theory of genjutsu is.

    That took me less than a minute of thought to come up with. Much longer to type than figure out. I wouldn't exactly call it 'convoluted'.
     
    Last edited: Oct 29, 2013
  19. mortalone

    mortalone Sixth Year

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    One of the problems with genjutsu is that different genjutsu attacks work in completely different ways canonically, so there's a lot to sort out. Also, you need to figure out how to write fight scenes that don't read like: Naruto casts illusion -> succeeds and wins or fails and loses. You have to not only figure out clever ways for Naruto to use genjutsu, but clever ways to include genjutsu in your narrative.

    As for issues I've identified with genjutsu:

    -Reality vs Perception altering: genjutsu are said to target the five senses, in other words, your perception of reality. Yet we've also seen genjutsu which trap you in in your mind hyper-accelerating the passage of time to a level that is biologically impossible (e.g. Tsukuyomi) or even alter reality itself (Izanagi and Izanami). Moreover, some ninjutsu techniques behave like genjutsu (e.g. Bunshin. in fanon Henge as well, though every use of Henge in canon is physical). What exactly constitutes genjutsu has become somewhat messy. I'm tempted to say that Izanagi and Izanami should be thrown out and that genjutsu as a whole should be dialed back down to strictly yin-based techniques that target the five senses.

    -Handseals or not: most of the genjutsu we've seen comes from funky Sharingan eye powers, for which eye contact is necessary. Is it possible to cast a genjutsu simply through eye contact, scent or touch? Or are seals necessary? I actually prefer the idea that anyone can train to target specific senses and I believe in canon you can, as indicated by Ma and Pa toads singing genjutsu. You can expand this to things like have kunoichi use special perfumes or release special pheromones or something to cast genjutsu, or utilizing genjutsu through the act of kissing. But if we allow for both (and the latter is used in canon as well, e.g. by Kurenai), then what are the big differences? Is it easy to learn how to do something sensory based when you specialize in handseal based methods and vice versa? Or are these two completely separate theories? Just as a real life example, the Fundamental Theorem of Algebra can be proven using a number of different approaches from complex analysis, the theory of algebra, Riemannian geometry or even probability theory. Completely different approaches.

    -Area or targeted: can a genjutsu affect everything around it? What I mean is, if I make certain handseals, does that mean everyone near me will see the exact same illusion? If so, why isn't Bunshin classified as genjutsu by Kishimoto? Yet we know there are some genjutsu with area of effect: once again, refer to Ma and Pa Toad in Jiraiya vs Pain.

    Actually, getting around the Sharingan is the easy part. Why did Nagato fall victim to Ma and Pa Toad? Presumably his Rinnegan gives him the ability to see through visual genjutsu. If that is not true, then I'd argue that the Sharingan is indisputably the best bloodline. So, let's assume the Rinnegan can see through visual genjutsu. Clearly against Ma and Pa Toad that did not help: with auditory genjutsu you cannot "see" that you're looking at a false reality until it has already ensnared you. Basically, rather than Magic Eyes you would need Magic Ears to Hax your way through it.

    Humans predominantly rely on our visual perception, which would explain why most genjutsu (at least, most that we've seen) is visual, ergo why the Uchiha are such monsters against genjutsu users. Under these assumptions an Uchiha has no special defense against the rarer non-visual genjutsu.

    In other words, you do NOT even need to give Naruto special genjutsu powers -- just have him train in a different form of genjutsu.

    Final note: it would be cool for genjutsu!Naruto to have Yin-chakra!Kyuubi, rather than Yang.
     
  20. Aerylife

    Aerylife Not Equal

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    ...The Kyuubi isn't a demon. It is a chakra construct, its chakra is much different than anything else we see in canon, but in the end it's still chakra, so even genjutsu casted with a Bijuu's chakra can be seen through with the Sharingan.
     
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