1. Hi there, Guest

    Only registered users can really experience what DLP has to offer. Many forums are only accessible if you have an account. Why don't you register?
    Dismiss Notice
  2. DLP Writing Competition
    Topic - Master and Apprentice (or Mentor and Protege!)

    Click here for more info!
    Don't miss the due date this time Guest - it's March 13th!
    Dismiss Notice
  3. Introducing for your Perusing Pleasure

    New Thread Thursday
    +
    Shit Post Sunday

    READ ME
    Dismiss Notice

kitsune naruto

Discussion in 'Fanfic Discussion' started by readerboy7, Oct 27, 2013.

?

Change thread name to "genjutsu theory discussion" and move to discussion forum?

Poll closed Nov 4, 2013.
  1. yes

    1 vote(s)
    100.0%
  2. no

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  1. tragicmat1

    tragicmat1 Death Eater

    Joined:
    Mar 7, 2011
    Messages:
    923
    Location:
    Madrid
    Considering that the Hax-Sharigan can just control the Bijuus like pets, I don't really think it's a good idea to have them vulnerable to Genjutsu because they are coming from the Kyuubi. I do really like the idea of illusions that target different sense though, kind of like Tayuya or the frog elders.
     
  2. readerboy7

    readerboy7 Fourth Year

    Joined:
    Jan 11, 2013
    Messages:
    126
    Location:
    GMT + 12
    Let’s see... Yin-chakra!kyuubi... increase naruto's mental/spiritual chakra, making him more intelligent... probably wouldn't heal as fast as in canon... probably high chakra control, can't overpower jutsu with excessive chakra... Aaah!:fire I just wrote 'Lighting up the Dark'! The fanfic that was inspired by HPMoR.
    On a different note: doujutsu can see chakra, rendering all area-of-effect genjutsu visible and thus easily ignoreable. Additionally, doujutsu users see the world a different way from normal people, so targeted eye-based genjutsu would be obvious unless used to target that specific doujutsu, which can only be done well by someone who has (or had) that specific doujutsu. This would also mean that Inuzuka would be able to resist smell based genjutsu.
    Henge would be an illusion. However, people would create (subconsciously, probably) thin chakra constructs over their hands to pick up objects. Masters of henge would create this construct all over their body, and be able to make the construct feel like skin, clothes ect. Or perhaps the technique is the construct, which is shaped to look like someone else. Canon naruto overloads it with chakra, making it feel completely solid.
    We also seem to be forgetting other potential kitsune powers, like a (severely nerfed) flight. Flight, which would be around as powerful as a hot air balloon, combined with a SEP field genjutsu, would be perfect for infiltration and avoiding trackers.
    Edit: Also, has anyone else noticed that we seem to have shifted from a story search thread to a genjutsu theory thread? It's not dislikeable, but it does seem unusual.
     
    Last edited: Oct 29, 2013
  3. Aerylife

    Aerylife Not Equal

    Joined:
    Jan 28, 2011
    Messages:
    139
    Location:
    Everywhere
    High Score:
    1,828
    Shut up and give my my Naruto with Fox Ears/Tail~
     
  4. Darth Disaster

    Darth Disaster The Waking Sith ~ Prestige ~ DLP Supporter

    Joined:
    Sep 10, 2011
    Messages:
    234
    Location:
    Two blocks from the beach.
    High Score:
    2,249
    It's fanfiction.

    Literallly fiction we write because we want to change shit in canon.

    :facepalm:facepalm
     
  5. Aerylife

    Aerylife Not Equal

    Joined:
    Jan 28, 2011
    Messages:
    139
    Location:
    Everywhere
    High Score:
    1,828
    We were speaking of canon, if you wanna step into au territory, thats fine.
     
  6. Darth Disaster

    Darth Disaster The Waking Sith ~ Prestige ~ DLP Supporter

    Joined:
    Sep 10, 2011
    Messages:
    234
    Location:
    Two blocks from the beach.
    High Score:
    2,249
    Err, no. We were talking about fanfiction and how to justify Kitsune!Genjutsu not being fucked over by Sharingan without it being convoluted.

     
  7. Hal

    Hal Professor

    Joined:
    Jun 11, 2013
    Messages:
    427
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    USA
    You could have Itachi pass a way he developed in order to fight Madara down to Naruto for extra insurance should his Amaterasu seal fail. Another way would be to have Naruto learn Bringer-of-Darkness and use the principles behind that to make genjutsu that attack eyesight. Since the Senju likely made it I find it likely it was intended for sharingan users.
     
  8. mortalone

    mortalone Sixth Year

    Joined:
    May 18, 2013
    Messages:
    176
    Wait, wait, wait. I was cool with everything you were saying up till here. If you're talking fanfiction, then okay, it annoys the hell out of me, but "Naruto's Henge is special" is deeply imbedded in fanon culture. But in canon Henge IS a physical transformation. For everyone, not just Naruto.
     
  9. readerboy7

    readerboy7 Fourth Year

    Joined:
    Jan 11, 2013
    Messages:
    126
    Location:
    GMT + 12
    Isn't the 'Temple of Nirvana (white feather makes people sleep) Technique' a genjutsu? That shows genjutsu can affect things other than the senses.
    Additionally, I thought of a way for someone without a doujutsu to affect people who have them. Have Kakashi (or any other loyal Uchiha) and a Byakugan genjutsu user show Naruto what the world looks like through their respective doujutsu, and so modify the vision-based genjutsu with that knowledge. However, my own interpretation of the Wikipedia article was that kitsune use area-effect illusions, which would negate the whole ’overcome doujutsu' thing and render it impossible. Or we could ignore that interpretation of Wikipedia.
    Yes, Mortalone, I get that my henge theory doesn't match up with canon, especially when considering Kiba and Akamaru's 'fang over fang' and Akimichi techniques (maybe). But just because something is fanon doesn't mean we shouldn't defy it. I don't think any author has properly abused Naruto's 'super-henge' in fanfiction anyway. But, kitsune-powered transformation is shape shifting, never an illusuion. You are correct about that.
     
  10. mortalone

    mortalone Sixth Year

    Joined:
    May 18, 2013
    Messages:
    176
    The way you phrased it made it sound (to me) like you thought that was canon, which was why I came to full stop.

    However, I really dislike that particular fanon cliche that Naruto's Henge is "different." I am completely cool with Naruto being exceptional at Henge (he is in canon), but I'm actually quite tired of reading fics where Naruto's Henge is physical and nobody else's is for several reasons. I could rant for days on this issue, but I'll try to keep it brief:

    This technique is given to Naruto but then rarely if ever used, meaning the only reason it was given to Naruto in the first place was either to make Naruto seem cooler, more powerful, more competent, and most obnoxiously "more special" than he actually is or as some kind of utterly retarded nod to an utterly retarded cliche. Early Naruto is a chronic underdog: against Haku, against Kiba, against Neji, against Gaara, and against Sasuke. Even into Post-TS people have doubted him on many occasions (e.g. Karui, just to name names). It's fine if you want to strip away the underdog label, but AT LEAST do so with a purpose. When people go out of their way to give Naruto special powers he doesn't even use I'd rather be slamming my head against a wall than reading that fic.

    Pant. Pant. Deep breath.

    I'd like to suggest that if you want to play into Kitsune lore and give Naruto special shapeshifting powers, you can STILL do so without making Henge a genjutsu. For example, Henge seems to take not only chakra but also concentration to maintain. You could make Naruto's Kitsune shapeshifting semi-permanent, which comes with added advantages:
    -Since he is not actively expending chakra to maintain the form, it cannot be "seen through"
    -His smell changes to match his new form (presumably chakra constructs would either have no smell or the same smell as the original)
    -He can maintain the form indefinitely with no risk of chakra exhaustion or slipping up by mistake

    These are no small factors. Moreover, it IS canon that different people have different levels of skill with Henge. Naruto's Henge was originally bad (see flashback where he cannot Henge into the Sandaime -- this image was also used in the databook as an example of a bad Henge), but after presumably a lot of training he got to the point where nobody else in the manga uses Henge as well as he.
     
  11. readerboy7

    readerboy7 Fourth Year

    Joined:
    Jan 11, 2013
    Messages:
    126
    Location:
    GMT + 12
    I agree with everything you said except for your phrase: 'chakra exhaustion'. That does not exist in canon. Chakra is a mixture of physical and mental/spiritual energies. Therefore, you get physically exhausted, like after a long run or strenuous exercise, while you simultaneously get mentally exhausted like the feeling you get after a difficult exam. Chakra levels are the 'magical cores' from Harry Potter fanon. They are quick, easy to use and understand, and they should be killed with a combination of fiendfyre, brisingr (both spell and sword) and amaterasu.
    Sorry for the rant.

    Should this thread get it's name shifted to 'mainly Genjutsu theory (formerly kitsune naruto story search)' and get moved to fanfiction discussion? will try to put up poll when I figure out how.
    Edit: can't figure out how to make the question for the poll to be less than 85 characters. sorry
     
    Last edited: Oct 30, 2013
  12. mortalone

    mortalone Sixth Year

    Joined:
    May 18, 2013
    Messages:
    176
    "Chakra exhaustion" is a commonly used phrase in direct manga translations, so I'm not sure what the issue is and I have little knowledge of HP fanon since I don't follow it so I do not know what magical cores are supposed to be. I can guess based on the name, but I don't know.

    Yes, chakra is a combination of physical and spiritual energies. That doesn't change the fact that if you use too much of those energies you collapse or in the worst case die.

    There's a lot you can play with in terms of how chakra is formed and used. I'm certainly not advocating the view of chakra as RPG videogame mana. For example, if I run a marathon, does my chakra naturally shift towards yin as I run since I'm using my yang energy? Or does it shift towards yang because I shut down my brain when I run? Most people are probably just confused with why it would shift towards one or the other at all. And presumably different people have yin and yang in different ratios even while at (physical and mental) rest. Do jutsu also require particular rations of yin and yang? (Almost definitely.) Maybe the reason Naruto cannot do Bunshin is because he has too high a concentration of yang and lacks the control to achieve the correct yin/yang ratio for the technique. That theory certainly fits better with canon than "Naruto has too much chakra."

    There's a real playground there, but exhaustion is definitely a critical part of what it means to play there.

    Less than 85 characters? Why not...
    Change thread name to "genjutsu theory discussion" and move to discussion forum?
    Yes
    No
     
Loading...