Hey everyone,
A lot of debate goes on about "magical theory", here and in other places. What is magic? What makes it tick? Why do we need incantations? Yadda yadda yadda, and so forth. Well, I'd been thinking about something for a new story and I'd thought I share it with you, just to provide another possibility and perhaps some new ideas. It's quite amatuerish though, so, ya.

Anyways, onto the theory.

I got the idea off Stargate, where it's possible to shed your physical body and ascend to a higher plane of existance as pure energy, just energy.

I was thinking that perhaps magic is located on another plane of existance, a higher plane made up of pure magic (or energy) that does not abide by the laws of physics, which allows for "impossible" things, such as one item turning into antother, happen. Basically, it does not ahere to any of the rules of science the muggles have come up with.

Wizards and Witches: are human beings who have been gifted with the ability to tap in and access this plane of magic. Some wizards can access more of it than others can, which leads to differing levels of power, while others, such as squibs, can only sense it...i.e, seeing past muggle repelling wards and Dementors. Muggles can't see it or sense it, like Dudley with the Dementors.

Magical creatures: I propose that this plane of energy has a constant effect on our world. I mean, it resides here, only in a different plane, and this is bound to lead to some effects. This is where you get the various magical creatures, who have been "touched" or gifted with accessing the energy. Some may have been the result of complete freak accidents, like the centaur, while others have evolved from normal animals, such as Unicorns from horses or Phoenixes from birds.

Incantations: We get a lot of stories that state that incantations are only used for concentration, to help people learn, and it's gotten to the point where that idea is a cliche. Well, what if it's the other way? What if incantations are necessary for all magic?

Say the word "Rhombus". It causes a sound-wave and a vibration in the air (and probably some more scientific stuff, but you get the point). By using incantations, wizards and witches can produce and entirely different effect in the plane of magic, the effects which the wizard can channel into our reality. With time, wizards and witches can produce the effects with the mere thought of the word, which could also cause an effect in the plane of magic and so forth. It explains how Harry was able to use Sectumsempra on Malfoy without knowing what the spell did. This can also work with other languages and spells. Look at the word blue. You could also say cobalt, azure, teal, and whatnot. Other cultures merely found words that similarily acted upon the plane of magic as the latin version did.

Of course, the incantation, while extremely important, sometimes needs to be worked with determination and imagination. Sure, the effect can be produced, but sometimes it may not be channelled properly. That's where willpower, confidence and determination come in. If a wizard, say Harry, were to slash his wand without using an incantation while envisioning the purple flame Dolohov, he may be able to access the plane of magic and produce the flame from the mere feel of it.

Wand Movements: Most of the times, these are essential. While saying the words can produce the effect, to draw it into this physical reality requires movement. If you swat something in the air, you're not only moving your hand but also moving and pushing away particles in the air, causing a small wind, and so forth. A wand, with an essence of the plane of magic, allows us to channel this magic easily and effectively from the other plane, because it causes an effect on that plane that links it with ours. Wandless magic can happen, though not with the DBZ-Shoot-A-Stupefy-From-The-Hand. This relies on the limited amount of energy needed to be channeled and again a movement of some sort, like clicking your fingers.

Basically, everything a wizard or witch does has an effect on a plane of magic that exists alongside the physical world. The word causes an effect, the movement causes a channel and the mind brings the effect over.


So, that's it. I can't think of anything else. I'm sorry if it's a little stumbling at times, but it's only the beginnings of a theory I've had and I haven't streamlined it. Tell me what you think.

Sincerely,
Shezza88

 

What I dislike in every story or J.K. Rowling's books is that it's way too easy to learn spells. Basically, all you need is some 'power' behind the spell, some intent, a little practice to cast is fluidly and powerfully, the incantation and the wand movement (though not necessarily). So, if I wanted to cast the killing curse at eleven, maybe I'll have some difficulties doing it because I have not a connection with the 'plane' of Magic deep enough to draw power, but with enough practice I would be able. Plus, what's the use of having so many books about Magic, because the way casting is now, you could put every single spell into a single book. Plus, there has to be a reason why in the canon Harry and his friends learned two dozen spells during five years.

Anyway, your theory is interesting as it could explain quite well about the Magical creatures and the fact Muggles can't see most of the 'Magic' things.

In a Stargate Crossover, I suppose if the Muggles used the 'Dephaser' (the kind of pistol who made the Starship Troopers-like big insects visible in one of the Stargate episodes) they could probably make all these things visible, no?

Using a spell without knowing what the effect would be makes me think Magic could store informations such as the effects of a spell (maybe some semi-sentient magic?)

 

I think its a pretty good theory actually. Like the incantation causes a unique ripple in the magic on the higher plane, which causes a specific effect. The wand movement could be the formation of the ripple on that plane, with the incantation invoking it, thus drawing the magic and casting the spell.

I'd think that the connection to the magical plane grows with time and practice, with time being the majority factor. Hence why Dumbledore (cause he's really old) and Voldemort (with his 40 odd years of near constant practice) are so powerful.

On the two dozen spells note, that's just JKR being unimaginative. Though for the sake of agrument you could say that school is merely a training ground for the children to develop their connection to the higher plane and most of the more powerful spells are learnt later. Besides, not many people train themselves to do exceptionally powerful spells because they just don't need to. Its like martial arts - you need years of practice to get really good but you're only going to seriously need it a few times in your life (not counting competitions/sparring). Hence why common people don't learn powerful spells and why practice/age are a deciding factor.

The only exception to the rule that I can see would be Nicolas Flamel, though he was noted for his alchemy, not for spell casting. Chances are though, that the Philosopher's Stone would take a lot of power to create.

But I'm getting off topic, it does seem like a workable theory, and I doubt a dephaser would make magic visible, cause it works on a physical and logical premise, it just makes visible things that are 180 degrees out of phase with our plane. Not things that are drawn from a higher plane of existence.

Chances are that the super weapon on Dakara would invoke some magic into it, cause it has the power to create life as well as destroy it. Magic seems to have the same power.

Aekiel

P.S. Ooooh, just had an idea for why the AK is such a terrible spell. It stops people from reaching a higher plane, either destroying them or tieing them to this plane forever more (hence why we see echoes of them emerge from Voldie's wand in GoF). It could kill ascended beings. Hence why it is such a terrible curse. Hell, it could even be partially drawn from the ascended plane, using life energy as well as magic. Therefore it is a damned powerful curse and explains how it just switches off the life in a target.

Could also make for a good Stargate crossover with Harry absorbing some of the energy from the ascended plane. Not enough to be considered even half ascended, but enough to give him some extra power and some nifty little tricks.

 

Aekiel, your theory about the Killing curse coukld also explain what's behind the locked door in the Department of Mysteries. It could have been an experiment gone wrong which some how screwed the planes and merged them into one at a certain place.

Would be an interesting premise for a Stagate crossover, with Harry somehow accesing thwe room and being thrown into the Stargate universe. Or a Stargate is inside the room.

However, an interesting theory that would work. It could even be used in Stargate crossovers to supplement the usual 'ATA gene is mutated and causes magic' theory that floats around.

 

I like the idea Shezza, it rationalises the premise of magic without trying to go all scientific on it, like most people seem to want to. It's magic, its anti-science at its epitomy so to speak.

 

So we've finally found some middle ground to work with Now we can end all those stupid arguments about magic and science. They were just getting boring anyway.

InfernoCannon: Seems like it could work, but I don't think it should be a Stargate. We already have 2 on Earth to begin with. 3 of them is just going overboard. Where would this one lead to? Another galaxy twice as far as the Pegasus galaxy? Nah, its been done, so I think it should be a merging of the planes, which would give Harry the Power the Dark Lord knows not. I.e. Unlocking his minor ascended powers (Note they would be nowhere near as strong as even Anubis' powers, but would be pretty damn powerful).

Dammit! I keep getting plot bunnies for crossovers. I have about 5 of them now, including that Cthulhu Mythos crossover I'm trying to write. Why me?!?

Aekiel

 

I have been most impressed by Johnathan Stroud's work in The Bartimaeus Trilogy. Where magic isnt what it appears to be. It is work of spirits summoned by the magicians from other planes which do the bidding of the magician while their existence in our plane is tied to a summoning pentagram.


Also, there was a book I read long time ago which stressed the use of true names of objects which lets you bend them to your will. This idea was later on copied more famous writings like 'Eragon'. It is also used in Stroud's works but not so blatantly.

 

Was that book you mention a thing about a boy growing up in a village, he ahd immense power, but the only person around at first to teach him how to use it was his aunt or something, and she didn't know the true names of all that many things. He gets taught random things by people passing through?

The idea of true names controlling the world is quite nice.

 

I liked Bartimaeus at first, but then it turned out that wizards could also cast small cantrips like fireballs. It also pissed me off that Bartimaeus wasn't even a full demon, just a Djinn. Not only just a Djinn, but also a pussy. I never ended up reading the last book.

In order to bring science into this theory, where does the mass go? And is the energy expressed through heat? Light?

 

I thought the point of Shezza's theory here was to NOT bring science into it... Magic doesn't care about mass, or energy or heat.

I like Shezza's theory, it seems to expand upon what Taure, myself, and others have concluded - giving not only the existence of magic, but the means to use it through these "Words of Power". I have to agree about the wand part, and generally like to stay away from fics where MAJOR wandless magic takes any part centre-stage.

 

Wow Avitus. You're perceptive.

 

Yep. It's a gift.

 

If there's even a modicum of science involved it would be the equivilent of the Tauri's knowledge on how to ascend. Far beyond us. Lots of things are known about it, but we have no true idea on how it works or how to achieve it.

Bringing that into the magic argument we can assume that it has taken the whole history of the world to get this far. It'd be like the tip of the iceberg, we know that its made of ice, and that its very cold, but we have no idea how deep it goes. So for magic, we could know that it exists on another plane (through whatever means of discovery) and that witches/wizards tap into it through a special connection in the genes (like the ATA gene, though that is practically a cliche in SG/HP crossovers now), and, if we absorb my idea into it; incantations are linked to specific ripples in the magical plane, which creates the spell, which is then channeled through the appropriate focus.

On the mass/energy thing, magic has no mass but it does have energy (as observed by the reductor curse) but that energy can only be tied to this plane through physical objects - charmed items/people, enchantments, wards, etc. - and will dissipate back into the magical plane when it is not anchored to an object. Though this gives rise to the question of whether inanimate objects can have a connection to the magical plane and, therefore, an unlimited source of magic. Perhaps a horcrux could... Anyways, this could shed some light on how wards work, and places like Hogwarts have a magical field powerful enough to disrupt electronics, its just absorbed so much magic that it has forged its own connection to the magical plane. I mean, even the castle itself is charmed to do things (like the stairs that have a life of their own) and after a millenium of magic being cast in it, it could be possible that Hogwarts has become faintly alive (in a magical sense).

Ok, on to my next lecture. Bye!

Aekiel

 

No Morde. It was about an ancient school of Sorcery. The protagonists true name is Ged.......and I wont bore you with the details. But the story was positively ancient as compared to Eragon and Bartimaeus and was the first reference to the true name factor that I ever read.


I dont approve of the faintly alive thing. Does a furnace start developing its own heat even after it is to generate heat? Does a flashlight produce its own light just because it was the first one to be made and has been in use ever since? The answer is NO. So if you are going to bring Einstientanion principles into discussions about Magical theory, adhere to other principles of physics.

 

But we've already decided that magic does not adhere to the laws of physics.

And where did you find any Einsteintanion theory in there? I only mentioned 'a modicum of sciene' - meaning a semblance we can use to try and understand it, like a metaphor to understand Death.

Where did Hogwarts being sentient come from, anyway? Has it been mentioned in canon or is it just fanon?

Anyhow, my idea was that so much magic had been tied into Hogwarts that it could have breached through into different planes, such as the ascended plane, or could just have an unlimited source of magic at its disposal.

Aekiel

 

A Wizard of Earthsea.... terribly longwinded and boring (for a 12 year old I suppose... read it in Grade 7)... his name is Ged, but his TRUE name is Sparrowhawk...

 

Thats actually the book I was thinking of, I could just remember the beginning of it. I read it when I was about 12 as well. Thoroughly enjoyed it. Perhaps I just have a bigger attention span than you Avitus

 

To link to Aekiels theory on killing ascended beings (killing curse), how could we connect it to season 9/10 of SG1?

Spoiler

Merlins anti-Ori weapon - magnified AK to affect all ascended?

 

Merlin's weapon, in my eyes, is more technology based than magical. Just like the AK is mostly magic with a hint of ascended power, Merlin's weapon is mostly ascended with a hint of magic. Hence why AK can only kill one or two at a time and Merlin's weapons can wipe out an entire race of ascended beings.

As for series 9/10 - I haven't watched much of it, when O'Neill left it just seemed to get boring. Though Vala is pretty funny.

 

This theory could also give us a better idea of what arithmancy actually does. Perhaps using mathmatical formulas to attempt to predict what causes a certain effect on the ascended plane, and determine how to bring it about? This would give rise to multiple ways of casting spells, with the common one being the most efficient version, perhaps? That would also give us a reason for Wandless magic being uncommon, it is drastically inefficient as compared to magic with a wand.