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Marvel Cinematic Universe General Thread

Discussion in 'Movies, Music and TV shows' started by Andrela, Jul 18, 2017.

  1. Zenzao

    Zenzao 500 Club King Prestige DLP Supporter

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    To be frank, it isn't anything to do with Brie herself that I'm complaining about there, it's that having a last-minute character inserted into the overarching story pull off the dramatic finish kind of sucks IMO. I don't really know who of the OG characters I'd be happy with pulling it off, but then I don't just want one person to be responsible at all, no matter who that is. If she's involved in a team-effort kind of way that they defeat Thanos, that's perfectly fine, but please don't steal the thunder soloing him after all of the rest of the buildup across three phases to this point.
     
  2. Andrela

    Andrela Plot Bunny DLP Supporter

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    Don't worry, it won't happen.
     
  3. Nevermind

    Nevermind Professor

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    I might just have an answer to that. Read at your own risk.

    Please note: Outside threat of possible spoilers for the first two arcs of Endgame lie beyond this link.

    I have to say, this is one of the very few Endgame theories I actually like. CM isn‘t overused, and there‘s nothing that stands out as completely outlandish by MCU standards. Suffice to say, I wouldn‘t mind if that was the actual plot. Of course, it all depends on the eventual resolution.
     
  4. Arthellion

    Arthellion The Chosen One

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    Damn it Tom!
     
  5. Taure

    Taure Magical Core Enthusiast Prestige DLP Supporter

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    I'm ignoring it because at the time I saw the movie I hadn't heard of the interview. It was only after coming to this thread to discuss the movie that I became aware that there was any controversy around it. I still haven't seen the interview and I don't intend to - for me, it's just not important and it has no impact on the way I see the film.
     
  6. Nevermind

    Nevermind Professor

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    I honestly don‘t know what‘s more likely – possible leaks getting more accurate as more people get to know what actually happens, or them getting less accurate because more people are drawn to the film the closer we get to the release date and thus trying to peddle their own fantasies. Didn‘t the Cursed Child plot leak some days before the premiere as well?

    In any case, someone should keep track of all the “leaks“ floating around the interwebs and make a list to compare it to the actual plot… would be amusing if nothing else.

    I had a somewhat similar experience – I was aware that there was some sort of controversy, but only learned of any specifics (and I still don’t have the whole picture) after I saw the film. It‘s considerably more enjoyable than trying to soak every single bit of ancillary information. I‘m thinking about establishing something of a media blackout for the major films on my watchlist in the future, just muting the appropriate phrases and hashtags on social media.
     
  7. Lamora

    Lamora Definitely Not Batman

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    I just saw it. Somebody said it would have fit in perfectly among the first round of origin stories (Cap 1, IM 1, Thor 1), and I agree - but that was a whole long ass while ago, and Marvel has considerably upped their game since then. I don't put in anywhere in the top 5 for origin stories (Black Panther, GOTG, Spider Man, Doctor Strange, Iron Man, arguable order for me) or anywhere near the top 5 for Marvel movies (Black Panther, Winter Soldier, Ragnarok, GOTG2, Iron Man 3).

    People saying there were parts that were wooden or weak definitely have a point though.

    Spoiler for rest:

    The biggest failure, in my modest opinion, was that of the meta narrative.

    A powerful, imperialist Kree Empire using the Skrull infiltrators as cassus belli to expand their control and empire while systematically exterminating their race is about as clear a metaphor for the US policy of expansionism post-GWOT as I think you can make. Recruiting Carol Danvers - a native of earth - and gaslighting her into aiding in this effort even ties into it as an aside about puppet governments and propping up dictators, and the Supreme Intelligence appearing as your own figure of admiration is a pretty good stand in for US in-country propaganda.

    If the film had chosen to follow this narrative all the way through and done it well, it could easily blasted CM into the top 5 of either category. And they almost did. Carol realizes that the Kree are in reality that bad guys, flips sides, and turns around and starts working to protect the Skrull refugees and work to find them a new home.

    However, one crucial step is missed - there is absolutely zero emotional recognition of the fact that Danvers has spent the last 6+ years slaughtering the shit out of the Skrulls as a member of Starforce. She's killing them all the way through the first half of the movie. She goes from beating the shit out of the grandma Skrull infiltrator hissing and jumping around like they're in the Exorcist to the noble, misunderstood Skrull refugees and leaders accepting her aid with next to no compunctions.

    And Marvel, when dealing with criticisms of imperialism, has absolutely done better. Ragnarok, Winter Soldier, Black Panther. In Iron Man 1, practically the entire plot and antagonist revolves around Tony trying to reform his company and it just not being that easy, and the Iron Man movie was pretty heavily partnered with the USAF in development, so you can't just point to that as the reason either.

    One of the major reasons, I think, is that the movie tried to do it and amnesia-identity narrative at the same time. The time that might have been spent addressing the consequences of her actions in a morally and emotionally compelling way is forcibly shared with the personal narrative of Carol Danvers discovering who she is (also combined with a weird coming-of-age vibe, what with her main antagonist being her mentor). The Skrulls and Kree are engaged in this bloody, complicated struggle that Captain Marvel is essentially trudging through with blinders on, completely tunnel-visioned on resolving her own identity crisis.

    I'm not going to say that both couldn't have been done in a compelling way at the same time, because I'm not a director, but in this movie, they weren't. The Skrulls flipping on a dime from upside-down electro probe torture to a grateful, copacetic group of refugees completely accepting of the aid of the former space commando who spent the last half-decade annihilating them with proton blasts with a distinct lack of emotional in between fucking sucked.

    But like I said, the movie's not bad. I thought Fury was fun. Visuals were fun. Sound track was okay. I don't regret buying a ticket. It's worth a watch if you got no other plans for a night, but if you're only watching it to prep for Endgame, I've got all you probably need to know just below:

    Captain Marvel has superpowers from the Tesseract, and has been off-planet for a long time protecting Skrulls from the Kree, who are a big bad imperial Empire if that wasn't clear from Ronan. Fury has a cat with a pocket-dimension inside of it. Credits scene is Captain Marvel basically just showing up to Fury's pager from Infinity War and saying hello to the Endgame crew. You're officially caught up on Endgame.
     
  8. Gengar

    Gengar Polymagus Prestige DLP Supporter

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    As per usual, RLM's thoughts on the 'issues' surrounding the movie mirror mine, just said much more cleverly than i ever could.
     
  9. Rhaegar I

    Rhaegar I Death Eater

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    I saw it, and I liked it. It wasn't the best Marvel movie, but it did a good job as an origin story. It certainly makes me want to see her in future movies.

    Fun fact: In Stan Lee's cameo, he's rehearsing his cameo for the 1995 film Mallrats, one of his first major cameos and which came out at around that time. I don't know if they knew it would be one of his last cameos, but it was strangely appropriate to make that cameo be a meta reference to the very cameo that helped cement that beloved tradition.
     
  10. KHAAAAAAAN!!

    KHAAAAAAAN!! Troll in the Dungeon Prestige DLP Supporter

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    I wouldn't have noticed it at all had one dude at the back of my theater not semi-shouted "YO LOOK, HE'S READING MALLRATS!"

    It was a nice touch. As was the change to the opening logo.
     
  11. point09micron

    point09micron Seventh Year

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    The problem I have with the Stan Lee cameo is that it makes no sense. His cameo in Mallrats wasn't like his ones in the MCU where he's Random Bystander #5 every time. In Mallrats he was himself, Stan Lee, writer of Spider-Man, Hulk, etc. all of whom are real people in the MCU. Many of whom are named specifically as comic characters Stan Lee invented. So are we now to believe that the Kevin Smith of the MCU is a Cassandra-esque visionary who predicted the rise of all the exact superheroes we would see on the news 20-25 years later and nobody believed his dire predictions of New York's destruction three times?
     
  12. Arthellion

    Arthellion The Chosen One

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    Probably.
     
  13. Steelbadger

    Steelbadger High Inquisitor

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    Well, I went to see Captain Marvel last night and it was... fine.

    Very much in the vein of other Marvel movies really, though I feel like it was playing with fire being set between The First Avenger and modern day. There were a number of occasions when I found myself wondering how exactly the timeline was meant to work. Like, when exactly did Fury become an emotionless, humourless super-Machiavelli? I figured that his time in the military, or time as a cold-war spy would have done that number on him, but here he is a relative SHIELD rookie still with a very real sense of humour.

    I feel like it lacked tension in the climax. As soon as Captain Marvel came into her full powers and started just flying through warships it becomes difficult to see any version of events where she does not win a flawless victory.

    The biggest win, for me, was probably in the casting. Brie Larson was fine, no complaints, the personality quirks of Captain Marvel were always going to be a little disjointed, given her back-story. The real master-stroke, was Ben Mendelsohn. Even up to the very end I was expecting him to pull an 'aha I was actually bad all along' reveal. I was expecting the Kree/Skrull conflict to be a little more nuanced than it apparently was, so maybe this is also a point of disappointment for me...

    The Flerkin was there. It was somewhat amusing, but nothing that stood out against the rest of the gags.

    Will probably watch on DVD when it comes out.
     
  14. Nevermind

    Nevermind Professor

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    Very much this. My brother went to see the film last night, and he was positively surprised at Larson‘s acting (even though he saw the German, dubbed version of the film). I have a suspicion that after the weird opening fight scene, the Kree/Skrull conflict was meant to be portrayed through the proxies of Yon-Rogg and Talos and their respective crews, but that sort of fell flat in the final cut. Maybe we get some more info on how that war ended in Endgame.

    On a side note, I‘ve been a fan of Mendelsohn since his great performance in Animal Kingdom (which I only happened to see in 2012 when I was on holiday in the UK), so it‘s always nice to see him get some love.

    Does anyone happen to know whether the Skrull faces were Kelpian-like prosthetics or CGI?
     
  15. Shinysavage

    Shinysavage Madman With A Box Prestige

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    New - final? - trailer for Endgame. Mostly old content, but still looking great.
    I'm highly amused that the 'emotional flashback' for Hawkeye seems to be new footage since they didn't have anything from previous films to work with due to how little they've done with him.
    (not an actual spoiler, but I know some people are going into serious blackout mode)
     
  16. Andrela

    Andrela Plot Bunny DLP Supporter

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    Official Poster:

    [​IMG]
     
  17. Celestin

    Celestin Master of Death

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    If the order of the actors is somehow determined by their importance then I'm surprised that Mark Ruffalo is before Chris Hemsworth and Scarlett Johansson, and Don Cheadle is before Paul Rudd.
     
  18. Heather_Sinclair

    Heather_Sinclair Minister of Magic

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    I'm wondering why Don Cheadle is on the poster at all. He was snapped. Everyone else survived IW.
     
  19. Silirt

    Silirt High Inquisitor DLP Supporter

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    I see we're not living in the timeline where Carol is front and center.
     
  20. Celestin

    Celestin Master of Death

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    He wasn't. He's in the last scene with the rest of the original Avengers, but since he doesn't really do anything in this film, you could easily miss him. ;)
     
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