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WIP Mother of Learning by nobody103 - T - Original Fantasy

Discussion in 'Original Fiction' started by Betosa, Apr 3, 2013.

  1. Blorcyn

    Blorcyn High Inquisitor DLP Supporter DLP Silver Supporter

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    I'm wondering too what importance Fortov will have as they escape or post time loop. Zorian disparages him so much when he's become reasonably empathetic with almost everyone else he's ever interacted with.

    Maybe it's a 'he's better now but he's still the same core deep down' but that would be unsatisfying. I want fortov to hold some Chekhov twist that will solve a major problem easily and they just neglected him.
     
  2. chrnno

    chrnno High Inquisitor

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    Well I wanted to say they had enough interactions that Red Robe would have noticed Zorian if he was Fortov but considering everything we have on him I could totally see him failing that badly. So maybe.
     
  3. Palindrome

    Palindrome A bigger, darker mark Moderator DLP Supporter

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    Oh yeah. I want to see the story go down this path, Fortov looks like he's finally going to prove himself... And then nope. He fucks it up. And proves that what Zorian's been saying about him this whole time is true. I would laugh my arse off.
     
  4. Celestin

    Celestin Master of Death

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    I doubt that Fortov is going to be the Red Robe, if only because unlike some other picks, if you consider every information we have about both of them and assume they're the same person, it simply does have at the moment a necessary groundwork for it to be a good twist. Of course, there may be some other twists and missed clues that will make it work and it would add a family drama and a mirror of yourself revelation for Zorian, but for now I'm unconvinced.

    As for the chapter, I liked it more than I expected because of refreshing new interactions with an old character like Ilsa. That said, I'm against anyone else, but Z&Z actually leaving the loop.
     
  5. OkraMaster

    OkraMaster First Year

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    https://www.fictionpress.com/s/2961893/87/Mother-of-Learning Updated.

    (I can't figure out how to collapse url into a word (the Link command doesnt't let me edit the LINK line over the URL line)

    Check-in chapter, with progress made on a lof of fronts, but no earth shattering reveals. We're still in the first half of the restart it feels like, with loopers making connections with each other.
     
  6. Clerith

    Clerith Supreme Mugwump DLP Supporter

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    Mostly a filler chapter.

    To be honest, I haven't really enjoyed the last few chapters too much. Even starting to read this, I was instead frustrated we weren't closer to the final climax. Mostly it feels like nothing too exciting will happen until the very end, and I'm antsy to get there. It's not about exploring the time loop or personal abilities much anymore, instead it's prepping for the final push. It's build-up that's taking too long.
     
  7. Blorcyn

    Blorcyn High Inquisitor DLP Supporter DLP Silver Supporter

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    I agree. The last two chapters have had strong ending hooks where I think, OK, that's going to be interesting. But, then, the very next bit they push through the problem, it's ok and then it's onto more planning and exposition.

    There's a lot of characters in this now. It would have been nice if it was Zorian and other time loop characters in this. I get that zach is the mvp but I want to see more 'woke' people bringing a different perspective to their existing issues.
     
  8. OkraMaster

    OkraMaster First Year

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    The only thing of real note was the direct bringing up on Zach's continuing refusal to let Zorian examine his mind. This, combined with Zorian's offhand mention that he'd need the hydra's help if he were to seriously fight Zach... Gives me pause.
     
  9. BitMyFinger

    BitMyFinger Groundskeeper

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    There is no way that the escape from the loop does not involve Zorian having to betray Zach and steal his spot or something along those lines.
     
  10. Ched

    Ched Da Trek Moderator DLP Supporter

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    Really? I can see it happening but I don't think it's super likely. I think it's more likely that both will get out. Having only Zorian escape because he screwed Zach over wouldn't seem to fit with the character development the author is doing. But I can still see it happening, maybe.

    I think maybe both will escape but the process for it will require them to trust each other? Like maybe Zorian has to pick between (1) taking Zach's spot or (2) trusting Zach to do something that allows Zorian to escape via another method. I don't know.

    But I do think they'll both make it out. If they don't both make it out I figure you're right and it'll just be Zorian, but I think both will make it. And I think there's going to be something interesting hidden in Zach's mind that would have benefitted them to find before now.

    And yeah - I am also hoping they don't manage to take all the 'extra' loopers with them.
     
  11. BitMyFinger

    BitMyFinger Groundskeeper

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    Whatever the specific details, it is the time for the author to say what they want thematically. Really I'm just interested at this point what the author I've been reading for the past 5 years of my life is trying to say.

    Personally, I have hopes for them bringing all the peeps and they all trust each other setting up some real quick and dirty utopia once they've broken out of the timeloop, but thats the socialist in me if anything and yadda yadda

    I feel like I've been trapped in Zorian's mind forever now and at this point I'm more interested in what Zach is gonna end up doing. The Noveda mansion coming in to play this chapter made me wonder. Him not trusting Zorian to look in his mind makes me think he might be an important red robe candidate this late in the game. Or something...

    Damn I might need to reread, but im also kinda saving the time for that after its all completed.
     
  12. Palindrome

    Palindrome A bigger, darker mark Moderator DLP Supporter

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    There was also another downplayed mention of Zach trying to get the spiders to teach him mind magic - by necessity, that means allowing someone else past his defenses.

    I'm thinking it's going to wake up the sleeper agent in Zach. Cue epic fight between all the time travellers and the OP guy with the freaking hydra to boot.
     
  13. BitMyFinger

    BitMyFinger Groundskeeper

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    In my mind, I'm not even imagining him as a sleeper agent. I thought it might go like a fight club book ending 'chess match with God' type a thing where the ending is just Zorian's first chapter with a wink and a knowing smile added to the prose, or insert any non Zach/Zorian character's first day in the timeloop, but I'm also on acid typing this so there's that.

    I'm hyped now for the climatic battle scene that will go down, whatever the line ups are. The fact that they got the Linch King to retreat with mind magic is super relevant to the Zach is Red Robe theory. Wondering how my boy Q-I is gonna wrap up narratively. Playing with Tolkein archetypes is always fun.
     
  14. Celestin

    Celestin Master of Death

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    That the repetition is the mother of learning? ;)

    I expect that both Zach and Zorian will escape the loop, but the trust between them will be the most important part of it. It will additionally involve that they've small bits of each other souls, or at least Zorian has of Zach's, and the soul-bonded twins that are in their class will help somehow.

    That said, a serious Zach vs Zorian battle would be fun. Two highly skilled loopers who have an opposite styles of fighting.
     
  15. BitMyFinger

    BitMyFinger Groundskeeper

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    Yes to the soulbond trust and love thing but twice as gay.

    Also a QI and Zorian alliance (or QI getting directly uploaded to the Zorian mainframe, depending on how talented/amoral my boy gets) battle vs Zach and Hydra please.
     
  16. Xantam

    Xantam Denarii Host

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    Zach would be crushed. Quatach-Ichl can easily beat Zach or Zorian alone. Pitting him and Zorian against Zach would be a very short fight.
     
  17. BitMyFinger

    BitMyFinger Groundskeeper

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    Eh I dont know. Zach with a hydra that Zach and Zorian beat using their divine soul control advantage, versus QI who got beat by Zach and Zorian with a surprise attack that relied on Zorian as the trump. QI has some knowledge of divinity stuff, but it was still the flip they used to get there one shot at a mental assault, I think?

    I had a hope for a Faustian turn back when they were learning from QI, and he would get added to the timeloop. But I suppose Silverlake's arc is about the closest I'll get to that. I think @Celestin mentioned earlier in the thread that she'll get her youth form in exchange for still being a bitter old woman, but thats been debunked I think with the few lines she got in the most recent chapter.
     
  18. EsperJones

    EsperJones Death Eater

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    I wouldn't be surprised if this was setting up a "Zach sacrifices himself to get Zorian out of the loop" type of scenario. Maybe with some sort of memory pocket scenario.
     
  19. OkraMaster

    OkraMaster First Year

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    I gotta agree. It would crush me (as Zach said back in ch 54 or whenever they found out it wasn't an illusion, if he woke up without any of his knowledge or experience) if either of these two don't make it out. Honestly, Zorian alone can't handle the invasion, QI, or anything. More than anything, no one would trust him since he's a mind mage (in addition to his normal paranoia and shiftiness). And if Zorian were to not make it out - that would be a hell of a downer ending AND thematically not make sense (Repetition is the mother of learning, except when you get cheated out of your learning)

    It would be good to see a fight between Zach and Zorian. I think Zorian would win. Zach is crazy powerful, yes, but Zorian's advantages are more dangerous to Zach, and Zorian also is quicker at resetting the loop if need be. I think there will be a fight, but it'll be Zach against everyone if there really is a compulsion or the like on Zach.

    They are both at the level where memory packets won't help them. Zach is powerful not because of his magniturde 50 reserves, but because he has through dangerous practive expanded them. 14 year old Zach, with no mind magic to help him absorb his future memories, with no way of expanding his shaping skills (which were terrible to begin with, due to his large reserves)... is worth nothing in the wars to come.

    If Zach leaves and original!Zorian gets the memories - who will help him get that expertise, that shaping skills, that anything?

    Not getting both of them out of the loop will be a downer ending.
     
  20. Ched

    Ched Da Trek Moderator DLP Supporter

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    You know, one niggling disappointment...

    Damien.

    I know that a lot of this story has focused on Zorian 'growing up' and learning that the people around him are people. His little sister is a great example, and he's gone from seeing her as a self-absorbed nuisance to a kid who is scared of her future and hoping he'll help. He's starting to learn that people he hated maybe weren't as at fault as he thought they were.

    But personally I wanted Damien to be the asshole that Zorian thought he was. It bugs me that Zorian essentially let him off for a lot of the shit when they were kids. Not the pranks so much as the letting Zorian stew in uncertainty and pain regarding his abilities when Damien knew he had them.

    I wanted Damien to actually be a sociopath. Instead he's a pretty stand up guy that Zorian misjudged.