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Pokemon X and Y

Discussion in 'Gaming and PC Discussion' started by Aerylife, Jan 8, 2013.

  1. Gengar

    Gengar Degenerate Shrimp –§ Prestigious §– DLP Supporter

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    I dunno, i feel like every gen makes sweepers/ attackers more effective while defensive pokemon just stagnate.

    I haven't been keeping up with the news with X and Y (wanted it to be a surprise), but the news isn't as heartening to me as it is for others.

    Instead of this megavolution stuff (just typing it makes me weary), I'd much rather UU pokemon get new moves / abilities to make them competitive.
     
  2. Poytin

    Poytin The Arby's Hipster DLP Supporter

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    All the Mega evolution tells me is that I'll finally be using Kangaskhan. Which I've wanted to do since getting wrecked by Giovanni's in Yellow.
     
  3. Probellum

    Probellum Death Eater

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    Didn't you get wrecked by a Kangaskhan in Pokemon Colleseum (Repeatedly) too?

    Anyway, the Megastones being consumable doesn't make sense if you only get one with the Torchic they're giving away. Since, you know, it's the only way to get Blazekenite.
     
  4. Lord Raine

    Lord Raine Disappeared DLP Supporter

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    When/where is that, BTW? I'd rather like one, and now that there's an actual "online" with Nintendo handhelds, I don't have to move to fucking Tokyo to get them.
     
  5. Probellum

    Probellum Death Eater

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    October 12 to january something or other, so plenty of time to get one. Th only other thing it says is Nintendo Network.
     
  6. mknote

    mknote 1/3 of the Note Bros. DLP Supporter

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    Wait. Wait wait wait wait.

    The fairy type is fucking real? I thought that was a ludicrous bullshit statement. And now all this shit with "mega-evolutions" and all that?

    The phrase "jumping the shark" is coming to mind right now. I am getting less and less enthused with each passing thing coming out about Gen 6. I've never really bought into the hype that each generation is the worst generation evar!!!1!one!, but...

    Seriously, a fucking fairy type? Did they need to fuck up the current typing matchups?
     
  7. Striker

    Striker What's up demons?

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    Innovation > Black/White 3

    Proceed, Game Freak.
     
  8. Evan Tide

    Evan Tide Chief Warlock DLP Supporter

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    You mean the current one where dragons pretty much reign supreme, except versus a very small fraction of enemy pokemon or very well-made teams?

    If you pit a dragon vs almost any other 'mon, the dragon will most likely win unless the enemy is packing something with 4x weakness.
     
  9. Aerylife

    Aerylife Not Equal

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    Meh, I kind of wish they had a sprite mode similar to the current pokemon games. Idk how they plan to balance Fairy, nor do I intend to use any Fairy Type pokemon.
     
  10. Striker

    Striker What's up demons?

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    They're basically using it to fix the current meta game, Lucky. Right now Steel and Poison are garbage as offensive types and Dragon is far, far too hard to kill, so Fairy is weak to Steel/Poison and strong against Dragon. There'll probably be some other balancing relationships between types that we don't know about yet, but yeah.
     
  11. Chime

    Chime Dark Lord

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    A new trailer just came out, basically revealed the mega stones are species-specific (literally a Blaziken stone).

    Also, poison isn't really garbage for offense, because it's only resisted/immune by certain pokemon, which all tend to be weak to ground/dark moves, which poison tend to get in abundance.

    I like fairy though because it has the potential to improve poor pokemon (like Mawile).
     
  12. Striker

    Striker What's up demons?

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    That... doesn't make Poison a good offensive typing, though. I'm not talking about Poison-type pokemon. I'm talking about Poison as a type. Like, it's super effective against one other type (Grass), resisted by four types (Poison/Ghost/Ground/Rock), and walled by one (Steel).

    There's no reason to use Poison right now, because Grass isn't a big enough threat to warrant it. Fairy might be, though.
     
  13. Lord Raine

    Lord Raine Disappeared DLP Supporter

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    Pokemon is unbalanced as fuck, but you're still pitching a weighted game in favor of Dragons.

    Every major Dragon so far has had a X4 weakness to something. That something is pretty much always Ice, and "Having Something With Ice Beam" =/= "a very well-made team."

    Dragons are glass cannons in the metagame. They hit hard, but they go down harder.
     
  14. MonkeyEpoxy

    MonkeyEpoxy The Cursed Child DLP Supporter

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    Eh. Depends on the dragon. Garchomp doesn't care about your ice beam, because Garchomp has ripped you into fourteen pieces already. It's terrifying. There's a reason it's banned. Multiscale Dragonite doesn't much care either, because it will tank the ice beam, then dish out punishment. Salamence doesn't care about ice either, since it'll just scarf ahead of it, destroy it, then take the Moxie boost and roll. All three have x4 Ice weaknesses. Are they invincible? No, of course they're not. But prior to its banishment, if you didn't have a Garchomp to counter the Garchomp your enemy had, you lose. Simple as that. Dragonite and Salamence aren't as bad since Stealth Rock hits them for 25%, but you still have to build your team around the threat they pose.

    Haxorus kinda cares, but all Haxorus has to do is survive one hit, then it dances, then it rolls. Hydreigon? Better hope you take it out first attack since you're likely faster, but it's varied movepool defines cray and it's got the mixed stats to back it up.

    Now the 'scrub' dragons like Flygon, Druddigon, and Altaria? Sure, ice beam away.

    Of course, most of this shit is moot anyway, because I'm not bringing in my dragon against a pokemon with a STAB ice attack anyway. I'll set up on something else. +d my speed and +d my attack, and your Ice Shard likely just won't cut it.
     
    Last edited: Aug 12, 2013
  15. Lord Raine

    Lord Raine Disappeared DLP Supporter

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    You won't bring your Dragons against anything that can STAB with Ice because nobody STABS with it. Ice types are weak as hell. I don't put Ice Type attacks on Ice types. I stick Ice onto something else entirely, the more unexpected the better.

    Also, speed is the most OP skill, news at eleven. Unfortunately for Garchomp, there are things much faster than it that can learn Ice type moves. Pokemon Quickdraw is a metagame unto itself, and while Garchomp is extremely powerful, it hardly reigns supreme in that realm. A Weavile, Slaking, or Alakazam could beat it easily, and among the fastest Pokemon in the game, a number of them are also special sweepers or otherwise extremely popular, and thus don't qualify as "a specific existence solely to counter fast Dragons."

    Dragon is an overpowered type. I feel that, in the beginning, this was mostly by deliberate design. It's only become a problem now because the type has become far more prevalent than it once was in the past. It is now possible to create an entire team of Dragon type Pokemon. In the past, a Dragon team would by necessity have mirrored Lance's approach, and included dragon looking Pokemon that were not actually Dragon types, such as Charizard, Gyarados, and Aerodactyle. This is no longer true, and thus the Dragon type has become something of a dominating presence.
     
  16. Poytin

    Poytin The Arby's Hipster DLP Supporter

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    Emphasis on the bolded parts.
     
  17. Chime

    Chime Dark Lord

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    Dragons are too strong because they have higher BST, superior typing, and usually, ridiculous abilities. Nevermind that they often get versatile movesets, making them unpredictable.

    Gamefreak didn't need to introduce giant pokemon to fix the game:

    1. Make legitimately terrible pokemon (like Seviper, Flareon, etc.) have a function at top tier play. This isn't hard, last gen they fixed a lot of pokemon with the use of dreamworld abiltiies.
    2. Introduce items that allow non-legendaries to size up to legendaries. What I mean here is, introduce hold items or moves that are effective at disrupting these higher stat pokemon.
    3. Introduce more synergies among low BST pokemon (Beedrill should have more utility/setup-potential, perhaps a move even that strengthens your bug pokemon that come out onto the field after it, something like tailwind, but for bugs).
    4. Introduce more abilities that disrupt cheese/OU play. I mean, counter weather, counter sleep, counter flinch/para, counter sub, et cetera Not that counters don't already exist, but place these counters on underpowered/weak pokemon (like Ledian) to give them utility and purpose. If Ledian could turn an enemy's weather against them, for instance, that pokemon would be viable, despite being totally useless at dealing damage, absorbing damage or providing direct support. I've always wanted a pokemon that would turn rain into acid rain on switch-in - no longer providing the water boost, maybe even dealing poison damage on every turn, like hail.

    It's a balancing act, but with a lot of focus, we could eliminate NU/UU/RU/OU tiers almost completely, maybe even bridge the gap between OU and Ubers, though there will probably always be some set of pokemon too powerful to compete in the larger pool.

    Really, Gamefreak should sit down at Smogon, and ask themselves, "Why is there a sleep clause? Why is there an evasion clause? Why are all these tiers like this?" Smogon is very elitist, and maybe not everyone agrees with their ways of doing things, but I do believe they've done an excellent job at sorting out all these pokemon and pointing out who is balanced and why.
     
    Last edited: Aug 12, 2013
  18. mknote

    mknote 1/3 of the Note Bros. DLP Supporter

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    Yes I mean that one. Dragons reign supreme because they're fucking dragons. That's the payout for them being so hard to raise.
     
  19. Chime

    Chime Dark Lord

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  20. Lord Raine

    Lord Raine Disappeared DLP Supporter

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    Weavile is an exception. Again, Quickdraw is a metagame unto itself. Weavile is one of the fastest Pokemon in existence. Fast dragons are probably tournament illegal, sure, but that's far from saying they're overpowered in the metagame. They can't expect us all to EV train and run teams of Nosepasses and Crobats.

    Any Pokemon in the top 10/15 fastest could easily sweep a Dragon team, even if they were trained specifically for speed, given equal levels. And some of those Pokemon, like Alakazam or Aerodactyle, are popular in the metagame for reasons unrelated to dragon-slaying, so you'll be seeing them in many teams.
     
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