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The Power of a Name

Discussion in 'Fanfic Discussion' started by Mordecai, Jun 28, 2007.

  1. Mordecai

    Mordecai Drunken Scotsman –§ Prestigious §– DLP Supporter

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    In olden times it was often believed that names had power. Some peoples believed that knowing something or someones true name gave you power over them, and some thought that speaking a "wizards" name would attract his attention from afar.

    What if this applies in HP. Maybe there is an actual reason that people don't speak the name of Voldemort. What if, once a wizard reaches a certain level of power, speaking his name summons a small amount of that power. Only those of similar or greater power don't have that effect.

    There are several ways the idea could develop. It could be that when an average wizard says Voldemort, he is enveloped with feelings of rage, hate and possibly even fear. Depends on what you think the overriding emotions that drive Voldemort are. Similarly when someones says Dumbledore, they are enveloped in feelings of calmness, security, love etc.

    Or...it could be that when a powerful wizards name is spoken and it draws on his power, they can identify the location to which the power is drawn. Obviously this would be difficult if many people are saying the name a lot, like would be the case with Dumbledore (or Harry if you think he would be powerful enough). But in Voldemorts case, if someone says his name he could track their location and kill them. This would obviously lead to people creating such pseudonyms as are actually used.

    What say you all.
     
  2. Skeletaure

    Skeletaure Magical Core Enthusiast ~ Prestige ~ DLP Supporter

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    Hmm...it's very Wizard of Earthsea.

    One problem is that Voldemort isn't his actual name: he just made it up. If you were then to say that it would still work, then it would work with You-Know-Who and other pseudonyms as well.

    One idea would be that you could say that, in Voldemort's search for immortality, he cast off his name, and took on the name of Voldemort. Or something.
     
  3. Mordecai

    Mordecai Drunken Scotsman –§ Prestigious §– DLP Supporter

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    You could put it that when he started to go through the rituals he literally became Voldemort, and was no longer Tom Marvolvo Riddle.
     
  4. Avitus

    Avitus Groundskeeper

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    I should think that this whole Name Power thing, as magic which is an essential, irremovable part of a Wizard's being would be related to self-identity. This would make the "Voldemort/Tom Riddle" problem a non-issue. He is Voldemort, he became Voldemort with the creation of his Horcruxes (possibly the death of his Muggle family as killing the last links to the identity of Tom Riddle). This wouldn't affect pseudonyms, because they don't represent identity for the wizard. Harry wouldn't be affected by someone saying "The Boy Who Lived" because he doesn't identify himself with it.
     
  5. Khortez

    Khortez Third Year

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    It could also be that Tom changed his name so that no one could use it against him, if what you are suggesting is anything similar to the Dresden Files.
     
  6. the-caitiff

    the-caitiff Death Eater

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    If the magic resides in self identity, a reasonable proposition, it would also explain how uncomfortable Harry gets whenever people start fussing about "the great Harry Potter". He associates himself with "just Harry" rather than "Harry Potter" or "The Boy Who Lived". He may catch a bit of the power flux but it'd be all wrong and out of phase. Like running 120hz through a 60hz circuit.

    The whole idea is very Jung, collective unconscious and all that rot. A whole society associates certain ideas and actions with "The Boy Who Lived" and "You Know Who" so those images/ideas/symbols/je-nes-se-qua are so branded into the collective unconscious of the Wizarding World. Thus someone invoking a name for power plays on those subconscious expectations and perhaps draws a tiny, minuscule bit of power from others nearby. Imagine if you knew the name of a truly powerful entity, say perhaps a deity or incarna...
     
  7. Snarf

    Snarf Squanchin' Party Bro! ~ Prestige ~ DLP Supporter

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    Maybe that's the reason for Dumbledore always knowing what's going on in Hogwarts? He knows he is worthy of their respect and they use respectful titles all the time when every they talk about him so, 'Professor Dumbledore' would be what he identifies himself as.
     
  8. Klael

    Klael Headmaster DLP Supporter

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    Names are more than just what's given; they reflect who you are. Tom Riddle no longer exists; there is only Voldemort. Why do you think that we choose pennames that aren't our real names? We assume personas of different people than we are in real life. DarkSov wrote a story in which a girl (who later turns out to be draco malfoy) is violently gang-raped. Adam would never even consider such a thing!
     
  9. Lorelei of the Sea

    Lorelei of the Sea Unspeakable

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    Interesting. I agree with a lot of things people have said before, but I think I'll go with the Buffyverse name theory. I think that when you try to preform a ritual or a spell from a distance, you'd need the true name. That could be a reason that both of the HP dark lords chose to adopt aliases.
     
  10. Klael

    Klael Headmaster DLP Supporter

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    Well, I'm talking more in context of real life here. We often create new names to fit with new identities, or alter egos, so to speak.
     
  11. deathinapinkboa

    deathinapinkboa Minister of Magic

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    Voldemort was Tom Riddle, but who is the other?
     
  12. Lorelei of the Sea

    Lorelei of the Sea Unspeakable

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    I was referring to Grindlewald. Though, really, we don't know if it's an alias. It just sounds like one to me.
     
  13. Klael

    Klael Headmaster DLP Supporter

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    Sounds like an eastern/south-eastern European name. Maybe Balkan.
     
  14. Snarf

    Snarf Squanchin' Party Bro! ~ Prestige ~ DLP Supporter

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    I'm pretty sure most Dark Lords don't like using their real name. What if a chinese dude named Long Wang aspired to become a Dark Lord. Kind of hard to when your minions are laughing as they called you Lord Wang. My point is, Grindlewald is most likely a fake name.
     
  15. redawgts

    redawgts First Year

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    Grindlewald being a Dark Lord is a fanon idea. He is merely described as a dark wizard in the books.
     
  16. Azrael's Little Helper

    Azrael's Little Helper High Inquisitor

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    Ancient Egyptians believed that the name was everything when it came to existence. The cadaver could be destroyed, the effigies, sculptures and papyri destroyed but if their name is remembered in some way in the living realm, they exist. That's why ancient Egyptians had their names and if applicable, titles plastered all over their tombs, family records and when possible public monuments. By their logic, the pharaoh's have succeeded in their goals of the Afterlife since even today we know/remember their names and hence still exist, so this in a roundabout way probably promotes tomb excavations in Egypt.

    I think a name does little more than identify someone or show how large their ego/their parents ego is. A guy I know named Maverick is a rather cool guy normally but gets real cocky on a basketball court. Though I must say that history has shown how much a name can affect the future. Would the name Adolf Schicklgruber be nearly as imposing as Adolf Hitler? Temujin instead of Genghis Khan? Edward of Woodstock instead of The Black Prince? Vlad Tepes instead of Vlad the Impaler or Dracula?

    And Kolskit, there's actually a Chinese deity dragon named Long Wang. Literally translated it becomes "Dragon King".
     
  17. malaga

    malaga Auror

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    I quite like the Earthsea idea. If you have someone's real name, you have power over them. For most wizards, they aren't powerful enough for anyone to be bothered with it, so the tradition went out of custom. Maybe that's the real reason Voldemort fears Dumbledore...
     
  18. Snarf

    Snarf Squanchin' Party Bro! ~ Prestige ~ DLP Supporter

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    Lulz, I said that because a guy on the wrestling and football team where I live is named Long Wang. He might be 'the dragon king', but you have to admit no dark lord would be thought seriously of it they had that name.

    Wouldn't that be considered 'dark magic' though? I mean, anything that gives you that control over someone else would be striken from all common knowledge as fast as possible. Dumbledore, being Dumbledore, would think himself about that so he wouldn't use it, but what about Voldemort?
     
    Last edited: Jun 30, 2007
  19. deathinapinkboa

    deathinapinkboa Minister of Magic

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    Lets look at it from a different direction. Perhaps every wizard and witch is given a really name, and then a second name for daily use.

    Harry Potter may go by Harry Potter, but the name through which you would exert control over him is something other, given to him by either his mother or some sort of wizarding elder.

    However, only one of greater power then yourself can exert any control through it.

    Voldemort, to proclaim how truely powerful he is, goes by his true.

    This is all well and good, until he remembers that Dumbledore might be a little more kickass then he.

    Harry, as Voldemort's equal, can say his name with out fear, as can Dumbledore, who is superior to him.
     
  20. Klael

    Klael Headmaster DLP Supporter

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    That would explain why Dumbledore never used it.
     
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